14 day itinerary help - barcelona to southern spain to out of lisbon

It definitely sounds rushed to me, but to help us be more specific:

1. Exactly how many nights will you be able to spend in Europe (not counting the night on the plane going over)?

2. What time of year is your trip?

3. Is this your first trip to Europe?

Have you done any reading on Barcelona? It is known for its modernista architecture. To me it's a city that needs at least 4 full days (I had 9), and you shouldn't count your arrival day, because you're likely to be barely functional due to sleep-deprivation and jetlag. So that means I'd want at least 5 nights in Barcelona.

You cannot teleport yourself from city to city, and the business of packing up, checking out, getting to the train station or airport, traveling, then reversing the process in the new city takes a lot more time than most first-timers imagine. As a result, the usual guidance is to figure that 3 nights somewhere only gives you a bit more than 2 full days to see the place. I'm sure you can see where I'm going: You've mentioned 5 cities, 3 of them rather large, and your trip is no more than 14 days. I'm guessing it's probably only 12 or 13, the way I would count. You'll have essentially no sightseeing time on your departure day. You'll need to be at the airport 3 hours early.

To make it more of a challenge, Spain and Portugal are not well-connected via ground transportation. With your timeframe, you'll almost certainly need to fly. It's not too early to check skyscanner.com to see whether there are non-stop flights from Seville to Lisbon. If you have to connect in Madrid, you'll lose even more time. You could also check Malaga, but by the time you traveled from Granada to the Malaga airport, you probably wouldn't be better off than taking a connecting flight from Seville.

Thank you very much for your reply. We have traveled to Italy where we spent 12 days (Rome, Tuscany, day in Florence, and Venice) and rented a car as well as taking a train - the area we loved the most was driving up from Rome into Tuscany and the days in that area)
We will be traveling in September and are hoping for 13 full days. My thought was 4 nights in Barcelona, then 5 nights in southern spain first by flying to Granada (divide into two places?) and then 1 night in Faro and 2-3 nights in Lisbon. From what I could see there is a bus that takes 2-3 hours Seville into Faro and a train from Faro to Lisbon. Is Faro worth stopping for or is there another southern Portugal location that makes more sense for the few days we will be there. I am also open to just going straight to Lisbon and doing a day trip to Sintra. Thank you

Why do you prefer Porto over Lisbon. Thank you

I love Spain and I love Portugal. But, unless I had 3+ weeks I would not combine them. As acraven pointed out, they are not well connected. Any day on a short trip such as yours, where you need to fly is a wasted day given the transit time, airport hassles. The time of year you are traveling can be very pleasant in southern Spain. Barcelona deserves at least 3-4 days and you’ll just hit the highlights. If you like culinary things consider a walk with these folks https://culinarybackstreets.com/culinary-walks/barcelona/. Then I would take the high speed train to Madrid (AVE). That is a pleasant just under 3 hour ride and you are deposited in the center of the city. Madrid is not my favorite city in Europe, but it does have a world class art museum, The Prado, the royal palace and a vibrant culinary scene. You could then train to Sevilla, also about 3 hours, and spend a few days in a really wonderful city, with a day trip to Córdoba to visit the Mezquita, a do not miss. You could then train to Granada, visit the Alhambra with the tickets you bought in advance. Then train back to Madrid, overnight for your flight home. A car is really not necessary. If you want to combine Portugal, then see Barcelona, Madrid, save southern Spain for another trip, fly to Lisbon, train to Porto. IMHO Lisbon has a lot more to offer than Porto. The beach areas of Portugal have no interest for me, I get my beach fix in Hawaii, so not a good one to comment on that.

Andrew and I, as usual, disagree. Lisbon is a fine destination. Nothing wrong with Porto, but I think there's more to see in Lisbon. Faro is definitely not worth your time on this trip.

You can visit Cordoba on a day-trip from Seville to avoid one hotel change. But take a look at Renfe to see what the train schedules look like. Use the appropriate day of the week sometime in January.

If you were spending all your time in Spain, I'd say you were OK. As it is, you're going to be spending quite a lot of time in transit and arguably will be short-changing Barcelona, Seville and (certainly) Lisbon. I realize that (assuming you've already bought the plane tickets) you don't really have many options. It's just that the ratio of travel time to sightseeing time seems painfully low to me. From my point of view, that is not "making the most of your time", but others certainly agree with your interpretation. And I confess that I tend to spend twice as many days in a city as the average tourist.

One thing about Barcelona: The most popular sights are extraordinarily busy and require that you purchase tickets (usually timed tickets) in advance to avoid very long ticket lines and possibly not being able to get inside at all. That makes Barcelona an especially difficult city for hit-and-run / cram-in-everything visits. You just cannot know how much time you'll want to spend at the various sights (or how much time you might spend in line even though you already have a ticket), and you can only estimate how long it will take you to get from Sight A to Sight B. It really is a challenge if you're interested in the modernista sites and the Picasso Museum. If you are not, 4 nights in Barcelona will probably be fine for you.

My guess is that your best path will be Barcelona-Granada-Seville (day-trip Cordoba)-Lisbon. Barcelona-Granada would almost certainly need to be a flight. If you are OK with just a partial day in Cordoba, you could stop there on the way from Granada to Seville. There don't seem to be very many options for the Granada-Cordoba leg, so you'd need to take a close look at the schedule.

Edited to add: Since you especially enjoyed your driving tour in Tuscany (Umbria?), one possibility would be to fly from Barcelona to Seville and rent a car for a few days to see Ronda and the white villages. That would probably mean skipping either most of Seville or Granada, but I don't have any experience doing a driving tour like that. It would be a shame not to have at least 2 full days in Lisbon (I wouldn't get on that airplane if not spending at least 4 days there myself), so you don't have a lot of time for southern Spain after you set aside the days for Barcelona, a day traveling to the south, a day traveling to Lisbon and Lisbon itself.

Thank you all for such great information. I have not bought any flight or train tickets yet as this trip is still months away. However, I am trying to pin down an itinerary so that I can really focus my research on the places will we be visiting. Thus far, my research breadth has been wide. So It sounds like I can remove Faro. From the various things I have read, I think I prefer Lisbon over Madrid. Though we enjoy museums, it is the wandering and "feeling" the culture than enthuse us about traveling in new places. I want to touch Barcelona knowing that a few days is not enough. It seems like we would enjoy the southern area of Spain the most but I certainly don't want to miss out on an area or place that could be amazing. There are both flights and trains from Seville or Huelva to Lisbon. Thoughts?? TIA

You mentioned September. What part of the month? Early in the month the weather in Andalucía might still be miserably hot. For that matter, the average high temperature for the entire month (not the record--the average) in Seville is 95F! Even in October it's 85F, so I'd expect even the latter half of September to be less than pleasant in southern Spain.

I do understand the desire to combine Spain and Portugal. Judging by posts on this forum, a great many first-time visitors to the Iberian Peninsula start out with Spain+Portugal on their minds. But it is really, truly, not a good idea on such a short trip. Spain is huge, the two countries are not well-connected, and Portugal has lots of interesting places to see besides Lisbon, Porto and the Douro Valley. Please consider making this an all-Spain or all-Portugal trip.

Check again, I don’t think there are trains from Sevilla to Lisbon, at least there were not two years ago. the bus is 8 hours, a non-starter for me. That means a flight, which kills a big part of the day. Portugal has so much to offer besides Lisbon and Porto. Please consider a trip to Spain or Portugal. Look at the Rick Steve’s tours to get an idea of what he considers the high points of each country.

Further to Alan's comment, I spent 89 days in Spain in 2016 and did not set foot in Andalucía (that area is for next year). I still didn't go everywhere I hoped to, and I knew in advance I'd be constrained by my unwillingness to rent a car.

I am so appreciative of all of the information you all are providing. I will definitely rethink trying to add Portugal into the mix. You are reiterating what I have been told by friends as well. I just want to try and see as much as we can in the short time we have and yet still not feel rushed - ha! Does this itinerary make more sense? I'm having trouble from day 8 on- we plan on renting a car but don't want to stay more than one place prior to getting up to Madrid
Day 1 - arrive in Barcelona
Days 2-5: Barcelona with maybe a day trip to Girona
Day 6 - 7 : fly to Granada and spend time there (2 nights)
Day 8- 11/12: Rent car and now I am stuck. Places of interest: Seville, Cordoba, Malaga,Rhonda, Baeza, and Ubeda

I know we can't see all of them and definitely want to go to Seville and visit at least one less touristy place.
Day 11/12: Train or fly to Madrid - possibly take train to Toledo for day. I'm also okay with not doing anything much in Madrid but spending the night and flying out

Day 13/14: Fly home (LAX)

Now that I am keeping only to Spain, I want to make sure I get a sense of southern Spain and its beauty and culture

Thank you

I am also willing to look at starting in Madrid and traveling down and then flying from Granada to Barcelona and doing that at the end of our trip if that makes more sense travel wise

I met a Spanish man who was highly insulted when I said I liked paella made in northern Spain then proceeded to lecture me on the only place to get good paella was in Seville. I smiled when you said you’re taking a paella cooking class in Barcelona, just don’t tell anyone in Seville.

Hello, if you do decide on the "Spain-only" option, then here would be my rough itinerary for 13 nights:

Fly in to Madrid
Madrid (2 nights)

AVE Train to Córdoba
Córdoba (1 night)

AVE Train to Sevilla
Sevilla (3 nights)

Rent a car in Sevilla and drive to Ronda
Ronda (1 night)
{Explore los pueblos blancos

Drive to Granada and drop off car
Granada (2 nights)

Fly to Barcelona
Barcelona (4 nights)
{La Mercè Festival
{Day-trip to Girona

Fly back home (LAX)

This is my take on the "best of Spain" style tour, I think that it strikes a nice balance between seeing many things and not feeling too rushed. You basically make a U shape, starting in Madrid and ending in Barcelona. I gave Madrid just enough time to get over your jet lag and maybe see the Prado Museum, before moving on to Andalucía (which seems like your main interest).

I put Barcelona last, because if you time your trip right then you could be in Barcelona for La Mercè (Sep 21-24), which is Barcelona's annual city festival. The festival itself is huge, there are 100s of events spread throughout Barcelona's squares, streets, museums, and parks. The best part - all the entertainment is free! This is something that we put on for ourselves, not just for tourists. If you want to experience Catalan culture like a local, at least for a few days, this is a great opportunity.

During La Mercè, make sure to check out the Castellers, which are human towers built by teams of the local communities. Also something that is really cool is the Correfoc, which I would describe as a pyro-musical with synchronized fireworks, there is usually a big one at the base of the Montjuïc mountain.

Hope this gives you a few ideas :)

@Pab and in turn you could say to that rude Sevilla guy you met, that the best paella is not from Sevilla but from Valencia! :)

"Day 8- 11/12: Rent car and now I am stuck. Places of interest: Seville, Cordoba, Malaga,Rhonda, Baeza, and Ubeda
I know we can't see all of them and definitely want to go to Seville and visit at least one less touristy place. 
Day 11/12: Train or fly to Madrid ..."

So many options, but here is what I'd do. Hire the car and drive to Baeza, then onto Ubeda and stay the night. These are less touristy than the white villages and a beautiful contrast to other Andalucia cities. Then drive the next day, via a stop in Cordoba, to arrive late in Sevilla; drop the car, stay three nights, before taking the railway to Madrid.

Also, Sevilla is famous for its meat based food, especially with pig, but I've never heard it described as a paella centre. Valencia is known as the home of paella and Murcia for its better rice dishes, generically called caldero.

The order of Carlos's itinerary is good, as it works well logistically. My problem with it is that it dramatically shortchanges Madrid. Your first day likely to be a jet-lagged haze, so you only have one good day there. Even if you only are going for the "big three" art museums, I don't like to go into museums on my first day as it worsens my jet lag recovery considerably, and I also can't appreciate the art fully. (On my first trip to Madrid in 1995, I actually made the mistake of seeing the Prado my first day; never again). I also feel Madrid has more than just those museums - I like it for its big city vibe, the parks, and some of the smaller museums like the Museo Sorolla.

However, as everyone else is saying, with only 13 days, you have to make trade-offs. On a trip of that length, I'd be happier choosing two of the following three, and having more time to explore them:

Madrid and "around" (Toledo, Segovia, etc)
Barcelona and "around" (Girona, Montserrat, etc)
Andalucia (Seville, Granada, Cordoba, white towns, etc).

Do not buy plane tickets until you've figured out your itinerary, and do not finalize an itinerary without looking at flights. Many people buy round trip to Madrid, then realize they want to focus on Barcelona and Andalucia, which requires using extra time and money traveling to and from Madrid. On the other hand, while sometimes it's the same price to (for instance) fly into Seville and out of Barcelona, sometimes it's dramatically more expensive. In those cases, flying into and/or out of Madrid and adjusting your itinerary can be a good plan.

That festival in Barcelona looks great! I will look at flights to Madrid and see if it makes sense dollar wise to start there. I really like the idea of visiting Ubeda and Baeza so if I do that we will need to cut out something. My husband would like us to go to the coast as well so this is definitely a challenge. I wish we had more time. I am so appreciative of all these comments and tips. It is really helpful!

Madrid really isn't the priority for this trip. It would be just a landing spot. I would love to see Toledo but am willing to give it up for the Adalucia area

Sorry if this is a stupid comment, but Barcelona is on the coast and has beaches so would that be okay for your husband? Incidentally, there's loads to see there, but one of my favourite Barcelona things was the boat tour around the port and along the coast (much better than a walk along the hideously touristy, and partly sordid, Las Ramblas).

If you do go to Ubeda, I recommend Hotel María de Molina or (more expensive) the central parador.

He was speaking about the southern coast but I am sure I can convince him.....

If you are interested in coastline, then the Costa Brava, stretching north of Barcelona all the way to the French boarder, may be just the ticket! With it's rugged cliffs, emerald green waters, and charming seaside towns, I would say that it's the most beautiful of Spain's three main holiday coasts. The beaches will not be as packed as they are in the high summer months. The weather should be in the 70's but the water might be getting a bit cool towards the end of the month, but still swimable.

In September, Tossa de Mar could be a nice Costa Brava beach town to explore. It takes about 1:20 hr to get there by Sarfa bus from Barcelona. While Tossa has this idyllic medieval Mediterranean setting, it can get quite packed in the high summer months, but I think you will be fine in September.

One of my favorite beaches is called Platja del Garraf, which is just a short 30 min train ride south of Barcelona. You will find only locals at this beach. There are also many good places to eat nearby. La Cúpula is one such place, it has commanding views of the Mediterranean and a pretty good Fideuà, which is like a Paella but with short noodles instead of rice.

Another potential day trip (with a beach) could be Tarragona, which is 1:15 hr south of Barcelona via train. Tarragona has some of the best Roman ruins in Spain, including a Roman amphitheater and Praetorium tower, which are designated as World Heritage Sites by UNESCO. They also have a great Roman history museum called Museu Nacional Arqueològic (MNAT), showcasing various treasures from antiquity.

Hope this info gives you some backup when convincing your husband! :)

My husband would like us to go to the coast as well so this is definitely a challenge. I wish we had more time.

Having responded before, now seeing this I have to say, I think you and your husband really need to sit and discuss what you want to do on your short vacation. Really have that discussion, nail it down, then decide on where you want to go. You simply can’t do it all and if you try you’ll miss so much of what this vacation can give you. I’m sure the coast of Spain can be charming, but are you traveling all this way to lay on a beach, see an ocean?

Ryanair has flights to Porto from Sevilla. TAP has flights from Sevilla to Lisbon. There's no reason to go to Madrid if it's not a place you really want to see.

You will go crazy trying to figure out how to fit 30 wonderful destinations into half that many days. I promise you the more you research, the more places you'll want to see. Less is more. Prioritize your places. Be brutally honest with yourselves. If you really really want to see the Alhambra, give Granada 3 stars. If you added it because it's near other places you really really want to see, drop it - realistically, it isn't near other places and there are lots of towns that will charm you just as much or maybe more. How likely are you to return to a place? Portugal and Andalucia are not places you will likely add to another trip, so I'd prioritize them. Barcelona is easy to combine with just about anywhere else, because it's a major air hub, so maybe that should be put on the back burner for your next trip. Is Portugal on your list because it borders Spain or because you really really want to see it? On my first visit to Spain, I spent 3 weeks in Andalucia and it wasn't nearly enough.

Day 1: Arrive in Barcelona (4 nights)
Days 2-4: Barcelona with maybe a day trip to Girona
Day 5: Fly to Granada (2 nights)
Day 6: Alhambra
Day 7: Pick up car & drive to either Ronda or Baeza/Ubeda (1 night)
Day 8: Drive to Córdoba (1 night) & return car
Day 9: Mezquita then train to Seville (3 nights)
Days 10-11: Seville
Day 12: Train to Madrid (1 night)
Day 13/14: Fly home (LAX)

Hi all, Thank you for all of the tips you have provided. We are finally solidifying our dates and itinerary and definitely have a few more questions. We will be arriving in Barcelona on 9/21 late in the day and plan on departing out of Madrid on 10/6 in the afternoon. This is my itinerary at this point and would really like additional input as it just may be a bit rushed and I am trying to avoid that and still see many places (oxymoron I know). Trying to decide if Malaga makes sense and to start there vs Granada??Also for day trips from Seville, is it easier to drive or take public transportation? We will rent a car in Granada or Malaga if we decide to start there. TIA

Day 1: Arrive in Barcelona (stay 5 nights - festival will be there! - day trip to Girona)
Day 5: Fly to Granada (2 nights Granada) - rent car and drive to Nerja and then spend one day at Alhambra
Day 7: Drive to Cordoba (on way spend time in Ubeda/Baeza) - (1 night Cordoba)
Day 8: Explore Cordoba and later in day drive to Seville (5 nights in Seville)
Day 9-12: explore Seville and take a day trip to Ronda and ??? Cadiz
Day 13: train from Seville to Madrid (2 nights)
Day 14: day trip to Toledo
Day 15: fly home

Day 5: Fly to Granada (2 nights Granada) - rent car and drive to Nerja and then spend one day at Alhambra If you fly on Day 5, you'll have about 1/2 day to rent a car, drive to Nerja and return to Granada, park the car and check in to your hotel. That sounds pretty rushed to me.

Day 7: Drive to Cordoba (on way spend time in Ubeda/Baeza) - (1 night Cordoba)
Day 8: Explore Cordoba and later in day drive to Seville (5 nights in Seville) Doable, but rushed.

Day 9-12: explore Seville and take a day trip to Ronda and ??? Cadiz Ronda is a long day trip. Cadiz is in the opposite direction. Do you mean on separate days? That leaves you 2 days in Sevilla. Not so rushed, but a lot of hours in a car.

Things to keep in mind. If you are staying in/near the historic center, parking will be expensive and it will use up time to drive in and out of town. It's hot in September in Andalucia.

Hi everybody, I have to tell you that english is not my first language. So I'll try to make my best !!! We will go to Spain in september. We will be 2 couples. We will leave September 11th for Malaga. We will spend 3 nights there and then we will go for 3 nights to Cordoba (this town is so beautiful) and then 3 nights in Seville and then 6 nights in Barcelona. By leaving in the middle of the week we save money. We will stay in apartments with washer and dryer. We will take the plane between Seville and Barcelona. Sometime, taking plan is less expensive than taking the train and it's a shorter route. I hope I help someone. This is not our first time in Spain. We love that country. Thank you for reading me !!!

Johanne.

Johanne,

Please start your own thread. It's confusing to have two separate conversations on one thread. Also, when someone posts a response, the person who started the thread gets notified by e-mail. You want that to be you, not someone else!

Hi there - Thank you for the input. I keep rethinking our itinerary. My biggest question is whether to go to Malaga or skip it and also skip Ubeda/Baeza. I would like to do one or the other but it seems both are challenging to do in 7 days in southern spain. Because we enjoy small towns, I think we want to spend at least one night in Ronda and Cordoba. From Seville, is it realistic to go to Cadiz for a day and is it worth it? Also, is it possible by train to stop in Toledo and spend the night and then literally just go up to Madrid and fly out (late afternoon flight).

Thinking this itinerary now but has issues:
Day 1: Barcelona (during festival - 5 nights - 1 day trip to Girona
Day 5: Fly to Granada (2 nights) - see Alhambra
Day 7 : rent car and drive to Ronda - stop at Nerja on way (2 nights)
Day 9: Drive to Cordoba (2 nights)
Day 11: Drive to Seville (drop car off) - (3 nights)
Day 14: train to Toledo (1 nights)
Day: 15 Train to Madrid and depart

This still seems a bit rushed to me with one too many hotels. Please assist.
Thank you

Actually I think I have figured it out -
Instead of driving from Ronda to Cordoba, would it make sense to drive to Seville and drop off car and then spend the extra nights in Seville with 2 day trips to Cadiz and Cordoba for the mesquiz?
The only thing we will be missing is more beach but thinking that Cadiz and Nerja will have to do. We live in Southern California so the beach is not a new thing - just thinking a bit of relaxation would be nice.

Thanks

I also am sad about missing Ubeda/Baeza but it seems I need to choose between Ronda or those towns. Trying to figure out which we would enjoy the most. When we traveled through tuscany we just loved stopping and enjoying the small walled cities and did not want to spend all of our time in the larger metropolitan areas. However, Spain is a different country. We will be spending a good amount of time in Barcelona so maybe we should focus on the smaller areas in Southern Spain. We definitely want to see the white villages.

I know I am all over the place but we need to make decisions so I can get reservations started so all help welcome
Thank you!

I haven't been to Ubeda and Baeza yet (later this week!), and I like Ronda, but I believe there's a major difference between the two areas: Ronda is touristy and Ubeda/Baeza are much less so.

You cannot stop off in Toledo on the way from Cordoba (or Seville) to Madrid if you're traveling by train. Toledo is on a dead-end spur line connected only to Madrid.