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Major red flags in this itinerary?

Background- my husband and I are quite well traveled, have driven out of the country numerous times, and like running at a swift pace. We are aware the train services are FAB and driving in cities is a nightmare. Besides these, what huge issues do you see? Thanks in advance.

4/16 Arrive Heathrow 10:20 am (Looked at Eurostar, but flying seems more straightforward.) Regardless, get to Brussels in the evening.

4/17 Grand Palace, DIY chocolate shops, look around, pick up car as late in the afternoon as possible and drive 45 min to Ghent

4/18 Wander Ghent, drive 45 min to Bruges

4/19 Bruges, head to Lieden (may see Kinderkijk along the way)

4/20 9:30-2:00 Bike tour, drive to Keukenhof Garden (We're aware of the weekend parade and increased traffic.)

4/21 Drive 25 min to Haarlem for Corrie ten Boom, drive 25 min to Anne Frank (ticket times not yet released)

4/22 Explore Amsterdam, drive 1.5 hr to Giethoorn Village

4/23 Check out Giethoorn Village, drive 3.5 hours to Brussels, possible random stops along the way

4/24 Head back to Heathrow

Posted by
1286 posts

A warning, I’m going to be using my Dutch directness here. There are several huge issues with your itinerary. The most important one being that a car makes little to no sense for your particular itinerary. Also your driving times are waaaay too optimistic. You’ve accounted no time whatsoever for traffic, which there definitely will be. But most importantly you didn’t calculate any time to find parking and to walk to and from that parking. Your trip from Haarlem to the Anne Frank house for instance. Assuming that you can indeed drive from Haarlem to the Anne Frank house in 25 minutes (which you can’t), where are you going to park your car in central Amsterdam? In one of the very scarce street parking spots costing you €7,50 per hour? And what if all these rare scarce spots are all taken? Are you going to keep circling the Anne Frank house until your time slot has come and gone? From your post I get the feeling you don’t really appreciate what an absolute nightmare driving a car in historical cities actually is.
Is there a reason you don’t want to use the excellent public transport system?

Posted by
1968 posts

If the time between arrival and departure in Heathrow is limited it can be a good option to fly to Brussels. But know that it takes just a train ride of a few minutes from Brussels South railway station were the Eurostar will arrive to Brussels Central railway station and from there some 10 minutes walking to the Grand Place. For going further to Ghent with a car you need to pick up the car first, getting out of Brussels and finding a parking in Ghent, not so easy and time consuming if you are not familiar with finding your way there. On the other hand with taking the train you have just to walk back that 10 minutes from the Grand Place and take one of the frequent trains to Ghent and arrive there after 30 relaxing minutes at Sint-Pieters Railway station and with an additional ride of some 10 minutes with the tram to the centre, I question if driving is so straightforward as you think. Dubble the time for the drive itself is very well possible.

This is just an example about the first days of your trip, my impression is that you are too optimistic about driving a car here. In other words plan in detail for car and train and then decide what will be the best option. Rule of thumb for Belgium and the Netherlands is the train for travelling between cities and a car for the countryside, so one for Giethoorn is well worth to consider.

Posted by
32715 posts

voice of experience here - your next to last day 4/23 - and your fourth day 4/19 - have you ever driven the ring road around Antwerpen? Are you prepared for the hair-pulling-out, screaming at the top of your voice, banging your head on the steering wheel experience of that bloody ring road? I can promise if you go counterclockwise the clockwise will be faster (the word fast being taken in the loosest possible sense). If you say HA, I'll beat it this time, and try clockwise, you'll come to a grinding halt and hear that counterclockwise is moving again. And you have to pay for the tunnel.

But you can't go through Antwerpen because your car won't be registered for the environmental zone which is much of Antwerpen. Big fine.

Where will you park in Bruges and Ghent? Do you know about the blue and white zones in Bruges?

Make sure you don't have a lead foot. Cameras are everywhere - the Dutch invented speed cameras.

Your 25 minute drives into the Corrie ten Boom house and Anne Frank house are completely unrealistic. You will spend that or double that just trying to park. Where had you planned to park for the Anne Frank house.

I don't want to be insulting, but have you planned for the issues I raise?

Posted by
19092 posts

The general rule is that only if a trip by rail takes 6 hours or more, is it better to fly, but that assumes you are going downtown to downtown and accounts for time to get to out-of-town airports, go throuth security, etc. In your case you will already be at Heathrow and likely using the same terminal, so I would reduce the 6 hour rule by 1 or 2 hours. Plus, if you go via Eurostar, you have the time to get from Heathrow to St. Pancras to take the Eurostar. But if you fly from Heathrow into BRU, you'll spend time finding ground transportation and getting into downtown Brussels from BRU. According to Google Maps, the time for the entire trip by Eurostar, from Heathrow to Brussels Midi, is just under four hours.

One thing you need to be conscious of is that, depending on you arrival time, there could be a wait for a connecion flight to BRU or there could be a wait at St. Pancras for the Eurostar. That could affect which route is faster.

Another other thing to consider, in eleven trips to Europe since 2000, I've been an hour late arriving two or three times. I think you have to have a seat reservation on the Eurostar. What happens if your flight is late arriving and you miss your train? If you fly into Heathrow and connect to BRU on the same ticket, the airline should connect you on to BRU even if your flight is late arriving. That, right there, could be the deal clincher for flying.

As for car vs public transportation, I never plan on using a car. In 175 days in Europe, I've never actually needed a car. Once, an overnight storm had washed out the tracks to a nearby town, and German Rail was busing passengers around the washout, and I wanted to get to the town quicker than I could using the SEV. I borrowed a friends car and drove. Other than that day, all my travel in Europe has been using public transportation (trains, buses, taxis).

Posted by
1286 posts

Nigel is correct about the ring road around Antwerp. I have to drive on that ring road frequently in order to get from my hometown to where my family lives and it’s never not gridlocked, not even on a Sunday morning. I still feel somewhat nervous when I’m having to drive right next to the endless rows of trucks. And I know my way and know which exit I have to take. I can’t imagine having to drive there without knowing exactly where to go.

I live in the Netherlands and I wouldn’t even think about driving in central Amsterdam. Aside from parking costing an absolute fortune, I would be too nervous having to pay attention to all the trams, bikers and pedestrians. When I go to Amsterdam I either take the train, or park my car in one of the park+ride parkings and take the metro into town.

Posted by
6347 posts

I'm Swedish and not Dutch, we might not be as internationally famous for our directness but we are usually rather direct as well. And now is a time to use it.

Yes, there are a bunch of major red flags. This is to be honest a really bad plan. As others have said having a car for your trip is a really bad plan. And your estimated travel times are only realistic if you've been able to rent a Tardis, but they are rare at most car rental companies…

And, flying to London for a Benelux is to be honest a very bad idea, unless you've managed to more or less get the tickets for free. The obvious solution for this trip would be to book a return ticket to Amsterdam, a major airport with direct flights to many North American cities. Or Brussels if you prefer that. If you can't find flights to those airports at a good price, Frankfurt or Paris would be much better options than Heathrow.

Posted by
84 posts

Yes, we completely understand the driving times given are best case and straight time as given by internet searches, which do not account for our being new, parking, getting lost, learning the ropes, etc. I was trying to give a skeleton plan here, not that I expected those times.

We do not plan to drive into Amsterdam, but to park outside the city center and use public transportation into town.

It is not possible to add a leg to our current flight. Purchasing a flight from Heathrow to Brussels sounds less troublesome of the two options, and of course we still have the concern of the arriving flight being delayed and not making the second flight. Our problem, I get it. Thank you for those who reminded us of customs for the Eurostar.

Public transportation is simply lovely and we've frequently used it in other countries with success. However, we like to plan and be (somewhat) in control of our time. Relative, I admit. A car gives us the freedom to come and go as desired, get off the main path, etc. Otherwise, we are bound to train schedules, which we will have to figure out and abide by at each city, pay to store our luggage at each stop, and have the learning curve of the transport systems. Yes, traffic, parking, etc are new, but so is the public transport system. I will look at the train frequency a bit more to confirm, but what we have experienced in the past is say X train runs at 1:00, 3:30, and 6:00. Maybe we're done with a town at 4:00... we could have hurried up and shortened the day or be done and wait for the 6:00. With a car- we're done, we get in the car and keep moving. Do we have issues with being new, certainly, but we tend to prefer making mistakes and not waiting over waiting. That being said, we're happy to hear suggestions.

Knowing ahead that the Anterpen ring is especially frustrating is most helpful. Thank you!

We have driven through Paris, and around Greece, Italy, France, Switzerland, Austria, and Germany to name a few countries and had a splendid time. Thank you to each who are helping us hash out this trip.

Posted by
32715 posts

Dutch and Belgian trains operate on a clockface timetable, that is the same trains run at the same times every hour.

For example, from Brussel Zuid, one of the three central train stations on the north/south axis through Brussels, to Gent St Pieters there are trains every hour at xx:04, xx:29, xx:37 and xx:53; they all take 28 or 29 minutes. You can count on it. The tickets are for travel not for particular trains. If you are early take one before your plan. If late take the next one.

From Gent St Pieters to Bruges/Brugge there are trains every hour at xx:02, xx:10, xx:25, xx:39 and xx:45 (that's a slow one). Except for the all stops slow one they take between 22 and 28 minutes. Faster than you can drive..

But hey-ho. It is your trip and you know what you like so go and enjoy. You asked for red flags.

Posted by
32715 posts

Leiden is a good choice - I like it there very much. Nice windmill on the walk into town from the station.

Leiden to Haarlem - double decker trains so great views of the bulb fields in April - to Haarlem is at xx:03, xx:12, xx:20, xx:42, and xx:50 taking between 19 and 22 minutes.

Leiden to Amsterdam Centraal (although Amsterdam Sloterdijk might be better for some things) is xx:03, xx:09, xx:20, xx:39, and xx:59 (all straight through, with nearly as many more requiring one easy change) and taking between 35 and 40 minutes, the ones with a change take about 5 minutes less.

Just so you have the facts and don't think you will be 2 or 3 hours between trains.

Posted by
84 posts

Nigel! THANK YOU!!! Train time frequencies are MOST helpful!!

We've read some train tickets are by the day, not by the specific time slot, but had not confirmed this was the same for in Belgium and the Netherlands.

Do all train stations on our list have locker storage? We will only have a backpack each- not huge ones that young people carry for extended trips, in fact, they are always allowed as carry on luggage on any size plane.

Lieden is where I'm doing the bike tour on 4/20. Can't wait!!

Let's say we do go with the train option. Does anyone already happen to know which type of ticket would be the most economical and versatile. I am happy to research on my own, but having on the ground confirmation is always helpful.

IF we were to go with the train route, is seeing the Giethoorn Village a reasonable thing to do via public transport? I thought I had read it involved maybe train and bus. I haven't explored this option much, as we planned to have a car.

Thanks a million!!!

Posted by
862 posts

Of the places you plan to drive to, Haarlem looks like the least stress option. Why not base yourself in Haarlem for a couple of nights rather than in Amsterdam? It is very quick to get from Haarlem to Amsterdam on the train for Anne Frank house and exploring Amsterdam, and there is a lot more to Haarlem than Corrie ten Boom. We spent four nights in Haarlem as our Amsterdam base in 2019 and really enjoyed our time there. It was nice to get away from the red light/coffee house/beer culture of central Amsterdam in the evenings.

Trains between Haarlem and Amsterdam take between 9-13 minutes and run every 10 minutes or so ... so no waiting required.

You say you want freedom and control of your time but your itinerary looks to me like frustration, confusion and being a slave to timed parking. I would hate to have to cut short my time in a museum or historic city centre because I had a deadline to retrieve my car from a parking station.

As to wondering what to do with luggage - either use lockers at railway stations or drop it at your hotel early.

Posted by
84 posts

Wd you say the hourly train schedule is from at least 7 am to 8 pm through these cities or will they run less frequently on weekends or evenings?

Posted by
1286 posts

You can very easily look up train schedules yourself at the website of the Dutch and Belgian railway companies. Both companies have an easy to use website in English.
Netherlands; https://www.ns.nl/en
Belgium; https://www.belgiantrain.be/en
Like I wrote earlier, the public transport system is excellent, with frequent trains running several times an hour. You may think a car gives you freedom, but that isn’t true when you plan to travel in a very densely populated area.

Posted by
1968 posts

For those nevertheless using the road in Belgium, their government has recently announced the roadworks of freeways planned for this year. Some causing serious delays (to expect) like the E17 near Ghent: Gentbrugge viaduct in July and August, Zwijnaarde interchange from early April to the end of November. Further two weekends between August and November for the R4 near Oostakker.

Coming 5 weekends between Antwerp and Zelzate (E34) during days with good weather. Many roadworks around Antwerp and Brussels, both remain problematic anyway. One of the tunnels of the Liefkenshoektunnel will be renewed but with limited delays according the announcement.

No roadworks at all around Bruges (so far).

Finally in the province of Limburg: E313/E314 Lummen interchange in May and the E314 close to the Dutch border during weekends from April till June (included).

There are more roadworks but causing minor delays according the announcement.

Posted by
39 posts

First, fly into Brussels and don't mess with the train from England. Not worth the time and expense. With all those cities, have you looked at the Eurail Benelux pass? I did that last year and the convenience of just getting on the next train (I avoided the high speed trains as I did not want to pay a premium or for a seat reservation) as I traversed much of your route was well worth it. I used the pass alot and the cost was about the same as if I had bought point to point train tickets. Also, if you do go to Kinderdijk, plan for at least 4 hours -- it's a lot of walking and things to see.

Posted by
5702 posts

Not worth the time and expense.

If the OP had booked sooner the Eurostar may well have been cheaper than the flight. As it is now it is about £100 more expensive. But that comment displays an unfortunate prejudice.

The OP would have originally been better advised to book a flight to Brussels or Amsterdam, but as they didn't the next Brussels Airlines flight is at 1750, so much for saving time.

There is no point in booking on another carrier from another London airport- that just adds complexity and uncertainty.

That is no bad thing to have the long connection as it gives a robust allowance for a non-ticketed connection between the two flights, given all the difficulties there are at the moment with transatlantic flights.