Which trains NOT to use in Italy???

You must have a wide range of reading habits. Have been on dozens of Italy trains, have yet to see one that is smelly and have animals on them - maybe an occasional service dog but no goats. Italy is not a third world country. The trains can be crowd but that is not unusual anywhere. All trains except the Regionale trains require a seat reservation so the train will never be over crowded. The Regionale trains can be standing room only but that is only at peak travel times. So there is no trains that I would avoid. Around CT it will be Regionale trains but they are fine. And if really bother by people, go first class. Just you, a couple of tourists, and maybe a business type.

Regional trains are not that bad... Sure, they can be crowded, especially on Friday afternoon and Sundays, when people are going to visit family/returning home, sometimes some carriages are hot, but you can always continue and find one with air conditioning.
Some people take their dogs, but I have never felt bothered by dogs, they are always well educated, quiet and stay by their owners...
I usually find a nice seat, with air conditioning and by my husband or friends, and I sit quietly reading, not bothered by anyone.

As for Cinque Terre, if you go from town to another, those trains are usually crowded on the weekend, but you will be on the train approx. 3 to 4 minutes, as towns are so close to each other, so even if you have to stand, it's for a short time! There are parts of Italy where you can only go with regional trains (like Cinque Terre).

And finally, local trains are usually even quieter than other trains, if you avoid peak hours, as these trains are mostly used by people going to work and students. the rest of the day they're pretty empty and quiet. Most are new or newish and pretty comfortable.

stlevine, you wrote "Someone said that some trains are crowded, smelly, have animals on them . . . . Do you suggest we get a private driver instead? The routes will be Florence to CT, Cortona to Venice and Lucerne to Paris". I don't know where you are getting your information from. I would tell that someone they are talking total @@@###§§§, have they ever been on a train? Trains are many times more comfortable, roomier and faster than cars or planes.
You cannot drive into the Cinque Terre.

Italy, Switzerland and France are not countries where you can pick up a car and driver for petty cash. Luzern to Paris is 4½ to 5 hours by train. In a train where you can stand up, walk around, drink a coffee etc. It is 7h09 by road, plus stops, plus delays, during which time you are inside a car unable to move. The driver will have to stop every 2 hours for a break. Even assuming you could find someone to do this, you would have to pay wages and costs, overnight accommodation, fuel, tolls, a second day for him to drive back. I would guess this would be 1500 €/CHF/$, if not more.

For real information on trains in Italy, see here http://seat61.com/Italy-trains.htm

You said "Florence to CT, Cortona to Venice and Lucerne to Paris.". How are you getting from Cinque Terre to Cortona, and from Venice to Luzern?

Well, probably the most overcrowded trains are those around Cinque Terre - as there is not a better way to move around the villages, and the villages themselves are overcrowded.

Someone said that some trains are crowded, smelly, have animals on
them, etc.

Sounds like you need to stop listening to Someone. We've ridden all sorts of Italian trains including local and regionale, never seen an animal, and found then no more odiferous than coach seating on a plane. Some of the local trains can be stuffy, hot and crowded but not bad enough to warrant a driver. My husband and I are both 61, BTW.

The locals trains in the CT are fine but expect them to be very busy during peak and shoulder season. As the villages are largely pedestrianized, trains are how you'll be getting around other than an in-season ferry ride or two, maybe. Haven't taken rail from Lucerne to Paris so can't comment of that. Trains don't directly service Cortona so you'd need to cab or bus from the nearest train station.

It sounds like you have been reading books and magazines talking about the 1950s in Greece, Spain and rural Italy when people traveled with the animals they were taking to market in Third Class trains, National Geographic style.

The lowest class on Italian trains is now 2nd class, it is 60 years later and people no longer take their chickens, pigs or goats to market by train. They have trucks now, and most people no longer live on farms.

Enjoy the nice comfy train ride and put your money back in your money belt.

OK - I am dying to know WHERE you heard about animals & dirty trains in Italy????

Me too. I found this post amusing. I guess I'm almost 60 also since I'm 55 and I visit once or twice a year and have ridden a variety of trains. Can't say that I would say to NOT use a specific train type.

The only train I would hesitate to recommend to someone is the Circumvesuviana between Naples and Sorrento at commute hours. No reservations, and sometimes standing room only -- kind of like taking Muni in San Francisco or the subway in NYC. But no goats.

st,

As the others have said, it would be interesting to know which "someone" is publishing rubbish like that. The "fast" trains such as the Freccia and Intercity are very comfortable, especially as you'll have assigned seats and they're usually air conditioned.

The "local trains" you may be referring to are the Regionale trains and they're just fine as well, although sometimes crowded and a bit more chaotic and sometimes SRO. However, they may be the only way to get to some places, such as the Cinque Terre. I don't recall them as being "smelly, have animals on them", and have never noticed any pigs or chickens on those trains. If they're crowded, many of the other passengers will likely be tourists, like yourself.

I'm well over 60 and don't have too many problems with the trains in Italy.

All of the routes you'll be travelling in Italy will likely be a combination of fast and Regionale trains. For Lucerne to Paris, you'll likely take a Swiss local train to Basel SBB and then TGV high speed from there to Paris.

I also want to for sure have a seat.

If you board the Regionale at its point of origin, and show up 15 minutes before departure time, you will be among the first people on the train and pretty assured of finding a seat. Some trains, usually denoted as Regionale Veloce, have 1st class cars with even more likelihood of getting a seat. Of course, you will have to pay 50% more for these already cheap tickets.

I think your "someone" who saw animals on the local trains may have been smoking something!! Trains in Italy are excellent and to be honest a hell of a lot better than those in Sydney where I grew up. Trains are by far the easiest, most comfortable way to access Cinque Terre. A private driver would be a complete waste

I was actually told this by two people. One was just yesterday when I was at the bank and told the teller I was going to Italy and he said just be sure not to take local trains because when her was there several years ago they were very crowded and smelly and some people even had chickens with them. I had already been warned about this from someone else a few months earlier. So I guess when they went they got on some funky train

a funky train with funky chickens huh?

"A-won't you take me to
Funky Train?
Won't you take me to
Fuh-unky Train?"

“One was just yesterday when I was at the bank and told the teller I was going to Italy and he said just be sure not to take local trains because when her was there several years ago they were very crowded and smelly and some people even had chickens with them.”

Never seen it; if there is a dog on our scheduled trains in Italy in August; my wife will be petting it like it is hers. As for crowded and smelly; try the Tube in London or the New York Subway in July and August during afternoon rush hour. Go online to https://www.italiarail.com and develop yourself an itinerary. FYI, I am 63 and my wife is 61 we have no problem with the trains and getting around.

Ed

You could just change your itinerary to avoid local trains, if you're that worried about it. But in my experience, they aren't bad. We took local trains to, through and from the Cinque Terre in 2005 (that qualifies as "several" years ago) and it was crowded with middle-aged American tourists clutching their copies of Rick Steves' Italy. No animals, no bad smells. We took a local train from Verona to Desenzano in 2014. On this trip there were more locals than tourists, but still no animals or bad smells.

Maybe that bank teller was confusing Italy with someplace else? Maybe buses in Central America? Or they were pulling your leg. People may take their pets (dogs) and service animals on trains, but they don't carry chickens.

As for crowding, the regional trains that serve Cinque Terre villages can be uncomfortably crowded, but it is a short ride ( a few minutes) so don't worry about it. There is really no other way to get to the villages, unless you can find a private driver from La Spezia which would cost a LOT.

when you get back, can you tell us if your bank teller was right, please?

In my experience (including temping for banks), bank tellers are among the worst sources of travel info, usually just repeating what some disgruntled customer told them.

...several years ago they were very crowded and smelly and some people even had chickens with them.......

That is so bogus that it is hardy worth a comment. We have been traveling on European trains since 72 and Italian trains since 93, have yet to see a chicken. The bank teller must have watch a travel video on trains in India and was confused by Italian trains since both start with "I". If you are believing those comments, hate to think what else you might be believing.

Even in Morocco, the chickens go in the baggage compartment of a train, bus, or taxi.

Well, now that I think about it, I have taken trains where other passengers were carrying chickens with them. Those passengers were ladies who also wore very large hats. But that was about 43 years ago in rural Bolivia. Never experienced that in Italy, before or after. Maybe a chicken sandwich though.

If you board the Regionale at its point of origin, and show up 15 minutes before departure time,

Isn't that when they board the smelly animals? ;-)

Actually I might be tempted to pay extra to ride a train with goats and chickens....but I was raised on a goat farm. No roosters or male goats. THAT would be smelly indeed.

I am glad we are all having such a good time with this. Looks like NYC did have a chicken once:

The subway rider who took the video said Thursday that it was one of those New York moments she felt compelled to record.

Kylie Kaiser, a 27-year-old architect, and two friends boarded a Manhattan train at around 7 p.m. Tuesday when they saw the man.

"He was on his back, rolling from side to side, kissing, hugging and lifting the chicken up in the air," she said.

She said the man was oblivious to everything around him and didn't respond to onlookers.

"It was definitely an only-in-New-York situation," said Kaiser, who moved to the city about three years ago from a town in Tennessee.

Some passengers look on and laugh, while others seem to be hustling out of his way toward the far end of the car.

Kaiser said the man looked like he was homeless because he had a shopping cart next to him full of cans and was wearing a shirt with an MTA patch that "looked like he had found it somewhere."

NYC Transit spokesman Charles Seaton said no passengers reported the incident. He said only service animals (such as guide dogs for the blind) and animals in carriers are permitted in the subway system.

Kaiser took the video and photos with her Blackberry and posted them on her blog. The post was picked up by Gothamist, a local blog network, YouTube and others.

"I knew it would be a story people would want to hear," she said.

Man seen hugging, kissing chicken on NYC subway

In this photo taken with a cell phone and provided by Kylie Kaiser and 2PzNaPpod.blogspot.com, a man plays with a live chicken on an uptown No. 6 subway train in New York Tuesday evening, Jan. 26. Kaiser, 27, an architect from Brooklyn who made the photo after boarding the train in midtown Manhattan, said "It was definitely an ONLY in New York situation." (AP)

it was probably a service chicken

I just blew coffee out of my nose.

Jim,

Good one! I'm glad I wasn't drinking coffee at the time I read it.

stlevine,

Next time you go to the bank, you might ask the Teller which part of Italy he encountered the livestock. I suppose that might be possible in some of the more rural parts, but I doubt you'll even encounter that.

would you STOP that please, JiminVa?

no harm no fowl

We took a regional train from Florence to Pisa. No animals, not smelly, not crowded.

But I do have a chicken on public transit story. In San Francisco. My husband's co-worker was riding the bus home from work. It stopped in china town and a person tried to get on with a live chicken. The bus driver said no animals. The person stepped off, wrung the chicken's neck, and got back on saying, "groceries now." (This was within the last five years.)

Now that I have wiped the wine off my screen...3 times...

It could be a group project...Find the chicken on a train - you know like geocaching - but with chickens and trains!

THis has to be the best story ever!!! This has all really made me laugh. Glad there is a good sense of humor here!

THis has to be the best story ever!!! This has all really made me laugh. Glad there is a good sense of humor here!

So glad you have one as well!

Now that we have beat the chicken to death. What happen to the posting about the guy being slapped around for talking to a dog on a bar stool in Prague? I kept waiting for the punch line and now I cannot find the posting.

This has to be one of the most enjoyable threads ever. Thanks to you frequent travelers!

Come to Portland, and I'm sure you can bring anything onto the MAX trains.

Maybe this question will be more sensible then my last, but I am sure not as amusing. IS the train ride to Cinque Terre from Florence scenic? Is the train from Cortona to Venice scenic?

Linda

Linda,

I answered the question about the train ride to the C.T. in your other thread. The train ride from Cortona to Venice is reasonably scenic, especially the Florence - Venice portion. It's important to remember that the purpose of the train ride is to get from Point "A" to Point "B" in the quickest and most efficient manner possible so you can spend your time touring in the places you've come to see. Not every route in Italy (or elsewhere) will be "scenic" enough to satisfy everybody.

Are you aware of the fact that there are two stations you can use to access Cortona? Of the two, Camucia is a bit closer, but you'll still have to find your way up the hill to the town via Taxi or local Bus.

I think that between the dog on the barstool and this one, we have finally surpassed Hula Hoop Girl.....

Florence to Rome - moderately scenic (relaxing hills, gets hypnotic at high speed)
Florence to Bologna - no scenery (almost completely in tunnels)
Po valley (Bologna to Milan/Turin/Venice) - flat boring plain

I walked into a bar in Rome and there was a chicken on a bar stool. Having previously read a thread on here i asked permission before i petted the chicken.

I recommend that you travel First Class or Second Class Reserved, where you choose your own seat when you buy the ticket, and to check for First Class on all Local Regionale trains you may have to take. Sometimes Local Regionale trains are the only option. If these trains have First Class or Second Class Reserved, buy it. I'm 70 and this works for me.

That's how I travel in Italy, always First Class wherever I can get it and I check for every train I take, even Local Regionale trains because some have First Class. Only here, the entire car may be reserved first class, meaning you choose your own seat when you enter the car, not necessarily when you buy the ticket.

Otherwise yes, Local Regional trains can be quite crowded. I might see a few cats in carriers and a few dogs on leashes, but that's it. Usually I always stand in the foyer between cars cause it can be that crowded. But if it's crowded, others will stand in the foyer with you. I help myself by having only one light carry-on roller bag with me, weighing 15 lbs. or less. Some trains have only one step up, but others may have a longer stairway of narrow steps big enough for the ball of the foot.

I love that the OP appreciated the humor in this thread. Your trip will be more fun if you bring your sense of humor.

Unless the smelly animals belong to the human species, I think you were ill informed.

There are occasionally smelly humans on trains, or anywhere, but those can be on any type of trains.

Animals on trains are generally limited to service dogs. They have an extraordinary ability to detect bad smells but they generally don't smell bad themselves.

"Chickens flying everywhere around the plane, could we ever feel much finer?" I think Arlo was singing about Mexico. But maybe it was Italy.

With apologies to Laugh-In: Is that another chicken joke?

"Chickens flying everywhere around the plane, could we ever feel much finer?" I think Arlo was singing about Mexico. But maybe it was Italy.

The song is Coming Into Los Angeles. I am definitely dating myself now.