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Traffic Tickets from FIVE YEARS AGO?? How can I confirm these???

I know traffic tickets showing up in the mail has been discussed, but I haven't been able to find a reliable way to confirm these are real. I was in Italy 5yrs ago, and just had 3 notices from some collection agency show up in the mail with no details other than an inflated amount to pay. I found a website that appears to be the Florence traffic ticket payment site but its a very basic and I haven't heard anything back from them either. I also emailed the collection agency asking for copies of the actual tickets and no answer yet.

Any advice?

Thank you!!

Posted by
3812 posts

Ignore them, in your case a fine is valid only if they have mailed the first registered letter within 17 months from the 1st charge on your credit card.

The collection agency did not reply because they can't prove the cops did it within the terms and they know those fines wouldn't be legal in Italy, either. I can't imagine an US judge ordering you to pay fines an Italian judge would dismiss.

Of course I am assuming you did not trash any letter from Italy during the last five years, did you? One should remember 5 registered letters from a foreign Police Department.

Posted by
501 posts

For sure wait the reply from the agency whom sent you the bill. And ask them even an explanation of the increasing of the fine increasing over years. If they not answer you, don't take further actions.

Posted by
29 posts

Nope never received anything from Italy that I can recall, but we did do some moving around to another State and even overseas to South Korea when I live now.

Posted by
32750 posts

probably most of us here don't know the laws and customs of South Korea so won't be able to help there.

It sounds like perhaps the tickets were sent to you but didn't catch up with your moves, by the collection agency finally did.

Sounds like you might be in some trouble

Posted by
7357 posts

Wow - despite your moving, the collection agency’s found your current South Korea address now? They must be persistent, wrong or right.

Posted by
32750 posts

did your credit card get charges from the rental car company when they
replied to the police request? Probably in the range of 40€ each? Maybe look back at the old card statements?

If you did that would be a pretty watertight answer that they are genuine

Posted by
3812 posts

It seems strange 5 registered letters in a row were not forwarded to your new address when you moved within your home country.

I think that the cops didn't send the letters at all, and the collection agency bought a bunch of unpaid fines without bothering to check.

Posted by
7549 posts

I agree, you have a mess.

The fact that it is from a collection agency and this late may be a clue that there were several attempts to collect (to some now long past address), and it was turned over to someone who would financially benefit if they collect.

I guess I would first want to know if the company contacting you is a collection agency from the Country you were resident in at the time of the travel, or possibly the administrator used by Florence for the tickets. This late in the game, it should be the former, rather than the latter.

Second, yes, verify the infractions are valid.

Beyond that, whether to pay or not, I can't advise, but you might work to settle with the collection agency, indicating that if they cannot provide proof, you can not in good faith pay. Settling, based on proof, for a fraction of the stated amount is not unheard of.

As for time limits of notification. From what I recall, the limits apply differently depending if you are an Italian Resident, an EU resident, or Non-EU. If you are a Non-EU resident, you have fewer protections, and sadly, fewer avenues for recourse, complicated by a language barrier. On the flip side, the Penalties for non-compliance are not as severe as if you are an EU resident.

Posted by
15165 posts

If the collection agency contacts you again, notify them in writing that, in accordance with the provisions set forth in the Federal Debt Collection Practices Act, §805, you wish the collector to cease any further communication.

They will disappear and they will not take you to court or even threaten to do so. If they did, you can sue them in accordance to §807 of the same law.

They are probably a secondary collection agency just trying to make a quick buck on a bunch of uncollectible debts. When the primary collection agency engaged by the Italians, stopped their skip tracing activities, they wrote off your debt and sold it to a secondary bad debt placement collector that now is trying to collect. Those debts are not enforceable in court overseas, so they are just hoping you get scared and pay something. It’s part of the shady practices of the credit collection business. You have nothing to worry about if you don’t pay.

Posted by
32750 posts

Does the Federal Debt Collection Practices Act, §805 apply in South Korea?

Posted by
15165 posts

Didn’t notice the fact the person no longer lives in US.
That doesn’t change the fact that these violations are unenforceable in foreign courts and therefore the collection agency will be unable to enforce that collection..
Currently that is somewhat possible only within the EU, or at least in the member states that ratified the EU decision 2005/214/JHA.
That is a very well known fact, and in fact the Italian authorities collect a very small percentage of fines issued to residents outside the EU, and that is due only to the good will of the person fined, who simply pays out of their own volition.

Posted by
23267 posts

It is a fairly common practices for collection agencies in the US (and assume elsewhere) to purchase batches of old debt, uncollected debt, even written off bankruptcy debt, for a few pennies on the dollar. With the internet these days it doesn't cost much to run down the debtors, send a few threatening letters or make a couple of phone calls. It is profitable if three or four people respond with some amount of payment. Most of the time the debt is uncollectable since it is too old or there is little to no documentation. So I would forget about it since there is no legal recourse available. However, the one thing you don't want to do is to "refresh the debt." That opens a bunch of options for the collection agency. Do not in anyway acknowledge the traffic tickets, or even the possible of the tickets. Your position should be, "Prove to me it it is a valid debt with supporting documentation."

Posted by
29 posts

I'm in South Korea working on a US Military base, so we have US based mailing addresses that get our mail forwarded overseas. I'm going to pay the fines if they're legit because Italy is a place I plan on going again as soon as the world gets back to normal. As of today 12/15/20 still no response from the debt collection agency email address listed on the letter and I email and voice mailed them asking for copies of the actual tickets, or a POS in Italy to confirm these are correct.

I rented my car from Hertz at Milan airport and NO they never contacted me and I have continued to rent with Hertz over a dozen times over the years. I also emailed them asking if they could research my Italy rental for info on these tickets and haven't heard back from them yet.

Posted by
3812 posts

There is no link between paying or not paying those fines and the opportunity to visit Italy in the future.

Even if those fines were legit, and you have just proved they aren't, a financial penalty remains a financial penalty in non-Victorian legal systems (or, if you prefer, you are not Dicken's Little Dorrit!)

I also doubt a that a monetary debt could limit someone's fundamental rights before either a Court ruling or a separate administrative act that could be appealed against in the Courts.

You can be confident that no Italian city will ever bring a foreign tourist to trial because of unpaid traffic fines they have already sold&forgotten.

Posted by
23267 posts

Dario, is correct. You are wasting a lot of brain damage on an almost non-issue. The fact that Hertz did not bill you the administrative fee for turning you address over to the Italian authorities would indicate to me there is no valid ticket. Forget it.