Taking Mother to Italy in September

I think there's a good chance you can find airline tickets with better options for re-booking than usual. People have posted information on this forum about various airlines' policies. I haven't been paying attention to the details because I don't anticipate traveling before we have a vaccine or a really good treatment.

I suggest going to a website like Google Flights to see which airlines have useful flights scheduled, then check those companies' websites to see what sort of COVID-19 re-booking/cancellation policy they have posted.

Does your mother have medical insurance that will cover her overseas? If all she has is regular Medicare A/B, she will not be covered--and I don't just mean for COVID-19.

Driving in Italy is a topic frequently discussed here, but it's one I know nothing about. If you don't hear from folks who've traveled that way soon, you could scroll back through the Italy forum to look for 2019 threads on that topic. And I'm sure Rick has useful information in his Italy guidebooks.

So much unknown is right. If I were you, I would wait a year and take my 85 year old mother to Italy in September 2021. There are just too many unknowns with tremendous downsides to plan travel for this Fall.

Have you discussed this idea with your mother’s physician? We are younger than your mother but our MD would not want us to travel to Italy yet. She will be in several airports, on flights and in cities all which present possible dangers to her health. Her luggage will be handled by multiple people in different locations. I needed medical care in Rome in January, not a good experience! If you do go, have a list of recommended private hospitals in each location.
Wait until next year! Since Rick Steve’s canceled his tours through September 20, you should too. He is the expert!

People over 65 are in the high risk category. Your mother getting sick and needing hospitalization while in Italy would be a nightmare scenario. Italy is great but it's not worth the risk.

I too would consider the health risk questions posed up thread. As a healthcare provider and knowing what I know currently, the virus knows no boundaries. I would have concern for both your family and your mother. The Covid-19 virus is still evolving. As you alluded to, I agree, “so much unknown.” For myself and husband, we are scheduled for Sicily in September. (Scheduled last Dec.) We have been resigned not to travel this year. We are waiting for flight cancellations.

Edited to add - Subsequent to this message our September flight was canceled.

To quote the Rolling Stones " you can't get everything you want."

Be safe and not sorry.

Cancel any travel plans for this September and look to 2021 for travel.

Stay safe, healthy and happy.

All through this covid mess, I have tried to avoid advising whether to travel or not. I will leave that up to your family to decide. So to answer your question, I would normally recommend waiting until you see if Alitalia flights are cancelled or not. My only covid comment is that I would also decide whether to travel based on whether travelers to Italy are required to spend 2 weeks in quarantine. Is your schedule and bookings set up for that to happen?

I think you know that your 85 yr old mom would be at risk. Please talk to her doctor and let him or her be the bad guy!

Rick’s cancellation of group tours is not the same as his recommendation for individual travelers. The logistics are different and we do expect that individuals will go before groups, with details to be determined. At your mother’s age, I’m sure she’s also trying to weigh whether this could be her “last chance.” Unless you see a super and refundable airfare now, I’d rather wait a bit longer.

As others have suggested, it would be a really good idea to run this by your mother's primary care physician to see what h/she thinks about taking a trip in September (which is about the same time that a "second wave" could be occurring). A lot will depend on your mother's current health, and her ability to get travel medical insurance (including evacuation insurance). I can certainly appreciate that there's a "declining window of opportunity to travel", given your mother's age.

You may already be aware of this but as you're planning to rent a car, each driver listed on the rental form will require the compulsory International Driver's Permit, which is used in conjunction with your home D.L. These can be obtained at any AAA /CAA office for a small fee. You'll also need to do some research on the ZTL (restricted traffic) zone which exist in most cities, as each pass through one will result in a hefty fine!

I tend to agree with others that waiting a bit longer might be the best decision. Would next spring be suitable?

The real problem is that no one knows if Americans will be allowed into Italy at that time or if they will have to quarantine for two weeks if they are allowed.

Wait until July. We should know more and I don't think you'll have too much trouble booking tickets. If you do decide to book, try to keep as much as possible refundable.

Be prepared for anything. Especially last minute.

I will only account for the driving part of the conversation. I’ve been to Italy x2, had a car at one point and took the train/tube. Just depends what your goals are. We rented a car in Florence to drive into Chianti and dropped it off that night.....that was ok. If you are going into the historic district with ZTL and parking I would pass. They trains are so amazing throughout Italy and so easy to deal with! I would do the trains and hire transfers if possible. I’m not sure that I would take my aging mother to Italy this year....

I don't know about an 85-year-old in a cylinder for 10 hours with hundreds of other people. Over 80 is about a 20 percent death rate if COVID is contracted. That is certainly a roll of the dice.

Do I wait out to see if Alitalia cancels flight?
Often (but not always) if your flight is cancelled, they may offer an alternative. The new flight option may be a few hours earlier or later; it may be different stops (e.g., 1 stop vs non-stop); it may be the next day or even 2 or 3 days later if they are flying a route less frequently. If you book everyone on the same flight, you'll all be in the same boat if they cancel or change your flight and can decide together whether to accept the new arrangements.

I must get airfare for daughter and husband- got to be refundable.
Alitalia is offering a "free change" but they note you can only change your flight once. For a refundable fare, you'll just pay more, as is normal practice.

Still need Rome hotel/Airbnb.
If you wish to minimize risk, I would focus on "no upfront payment" rather than refundable rates with an upfront payment. With an upfront payment, in these times of high volume cancellations, you could find it difficult to get your money back, even if a rate is noted as refundable. (Lots of examples of this in other threads on this forum.) Smaller properties especially, have been hard hit by refund requests and may not have the cash reserves to honor their own policies, despite having done so cheerfully in normal situations.

Good for your mother wanting to do this! I agree that at that age you can't wait till someday. We too are mulling a September trip as we couldn't go as planned in May. Assuming Italy opens to US travelers, the quarantine requirement would be the biggest obstacle, if it is still in place.
Being optimistic and assuming you get to go, I would be on top of Alitalia for info on how close to capacity the plane would be, would they offer a seat upgrade for a reasonable price, where exactly would you still have the same seats you may have already chosen, etc.? Driving rather than taking trains would be a wise decision. Cabs in the cities would have dividers between the driver and passengers I'd imagine.
Wish you the best!

CDC has not lifted their level 3 & 4 warnings in regards to travel to Italy. Italy is currently only allowing travel from the US for proven work, urgent health care reasons or return to residence and then with a 14 day quarantine. Just my opinion, but spending money/time on making travel reservations for a few months from now, when there is no indication of when restrictions will be lifted for travel from the US, doesn’t sound realistic. And then there’s the issue of taking an eighty five year old.

Thank you for all the opinions. We are going to continue to weigh options thru July. My mother’s doctor gave her the ok to travel and she has health insurance coverage. Yesterday Alitalia (we already have tickets) told me Italy is open on July 1 without quarantine. Whether that true or not?
My mother wants to go and doesn’t want to wait if things are open.
I am staying hopeful and will take all the precautions. Who is to say where it is safer home or abroad. Rick’s tours are still hoping for September.

One other thing to consider is whether your mother (and the rest of you) are comfortable wearing a mask on the flight (which right now is required on U.S. based flights and I would guess for Europe based ones too) and while in Italy. My understanding is masks in Italy are required on public transportation, indoor public spaces, and outdoors whenever you cannot stay six feet of others.

I don't think this is necessarily an age thing. We had a trip to Italy planned for May with our young adult children and have discussed going again next year. We are OK with wearing masks if necessary but my 35 son in law said he didn't want to go if that was the case.

If it was my mom and U.S. residents were welcome without quarantine and everyone could live with wearing masks, I would go. A year from now there might be less risk from the coronovirus but the risk for your mom is that her health will decline and not make it possible for her to travel abroad. I have seen with my folks that things can change in a blink of an eye. My mom told me her biggest regret is they did not travel to Europe more when they could.

I would make sure had apartments with outdoor space (to relax) and plan to do take out or eat outside at restaurants.

The advantage of the car is would not have to wear a mask and travel might be easier on your mom. On the other hand, cars are a disadvantage in urban areas.

At the moment only returning EU residents are allowed from outside the EU, and even in that case they must quarantine for 14 days and are not allowed to use public transportation for 14 days. Non EU residents, even Italian citizens like me, can travel to Italy only for proven and documented necessary reasons, like health reasons or non deferrable work reasons or health workers, but still subject to the 14 days self isolation. Pleasure trips from countries outside the EU is currently not permitted and I doubt things will change in the next two months.

I’m sorry James if you felt that my posting the current travel information was rhetorical but right now with people obviously chomping at the bit to get going (and I’m one of them) it seems they should be reminded that travel to Italy from the US is not open to tourists yet and with the current spike in Virus cases, the July 1 open date is still debatable.

@Pstiener1 Sun 11am

I have not been to the village of Velo d’Astico, but the surrounding area is beautiful. I have spent some time with locals to the west in the Lombardy villages of Nazio, Incudine and Malonno. At the little village of Pesariis and town of Udine to the north east of the Veneto and just over the northern border at St. Moritz. Coming from a mostly flat sunburnt country, my family and I were, on first visit, awestruck by the terrain. Had plans to revisit in a couple of months. It will wait. Plenty of YouTube videos to give you an insight into the vistas and history. Mum, you, and family will not be disappointed. As you have already been on a previous tour of Italy, it would seem prudent to concentrate on the family’s historical roots.

My boys and I have found driving in Italy enjoyable, including what appear to tourists to be the driving eccentrics of the locals. We have learnt to dive the Italian way in their country. And loving it. Driving between big cities can be done on freeway style equivalents in the area you have in mind. We prefer the more leisurely routes of a scenic nature and build in ample time to absorb them. Have read some horror stories on these forums but have not experienced them. Maybe it is in the preparation and attitude to the country.

A couple of suggestions for air travel. Contact the airline get your seats allocated and ask for a wheelchair to be available on arrival at the airports for your mother. At her age it is unlikely to be questioned, I think she deserves it, courageous lady. Curb side maybe available at the airports you use. You and your party should then be looked after well. Do not know about USA airports, but my experience and observations in Europe and Asia has been positive. Your family may consider letting the moths out of the purse’s or sell some family jewels, and upgrade mum to business. Still get the wheelchair. You should all be able to accompany her to the business check in counter for processing and receive priority security and customs clearance. Perhaps an invite or two to accompany mum to a lounge may be offered. Normally a call is made to board those needing assistance and their family members first. Cuts waiting time and keeps you away from the hoards.

In 2018, just as we were leaving Italy, my wife attempted to take a snap while doing a ballet pirouette from her youth, fell and cracked 4 ribs. The type of incident she has become adept at. Contacted Thai for help on our flights home. I was carrying 2 vials of liquid Morphine and syringes. Already had business class. Where meet at Brussels airport with a wheelchair, an attendant and escorted through check in, security and collected from the lounge for departure. Same procedure for transit at Bangkok and on arrival at Melbourne. I was hoping to set off the drug detecting machines, but the operators were too smart to test me.

You already have received lots of medical advice and insurance needs. Not my area. I trust the GP knows what they are talking about. From a pure maths and statistical viewpoint, the USA is the most dangerous place on the planet for this rapacious virus. Total numbers and trends. The worldometers website conclusively demonstrates that the incidents in Italy are currently retreating, while in the USA they have levelled off and could go in any direction.

I am impressed by the tenacity of your mother and hope all her wishes come true. It would be an honour to meet her.

Care for all humankind. Time is a traveller.
Regards Ron

Ron,
I like you, hopeful and helpful!
We already have business class - purchased before Covid for myself and mother. My Mom is in great shape lives alone, gardens, and walks daily. Her choice on a wheelchair. If she doesn’t want it maybe I get one for the perks. 2 family members cancelled their flights and have to rebook 2 other family members- waiting on that. 4 total going now.
Driven in Sicily and Spain, hoping to ditch the rental car for Rome and Florence. Staying in Padua and day trip to Velo d’Astico. Hoping to get tours by locals for Velo. I have great grandmothers birth records, looking for church and baptism record and area they lived.
Wondering if Pope will open up to audiences?
Alas all depends on if borders open for US tourists.
Yes, the US has covid- I live in Illinois and that state is trending down, but Europe may not want us. Waiting to see.
Stay well.
Pat
PS been to Thailand 3 times with military- loved it.

Hey psteinert, sorry to be so negative and unhelpful!

Thank you to all the advice received. I greatly appreciate everyones’s opinion on travel during these difficult times.

Hi psteiner1,

I may appear redundant with my reply, but I agree with Diane from CA. --- If my Mom/Dad were in their 80's, I would not risk any travel abroad or even to some US states.

I appreciate your Mom wants to travel. I doubt anyone will be allowed into Italy from America right now. Don't cancel flights yet. If the airline does, you should receive a credit or a voucher (whatever is the policy of the airline.)

We all know this, a year flies by pretty darn quick. Hopefully, by next year, travel will resume again.

My friends in Rome, one of them has not been back to work yet. A few others are in the retail/hospitality business, and it is very slowly starting to dust off.

Although I did not make travel plans to Italy this year, I feel for those who did. I hope you get your refunds or however it is being handled.

My best to your Mom. I surely hope she gets her dream.

Rental car logistics depend on your itinerary. Driving in Italy is pretty demanding, there are many directional signs on a single pole, street systems are complex and ZTLs require extra navigation. ZTLs are traffic limited zones and you will not have an access permit. If you are arriving in Rome Fiumicino and departing directly to Padua, then you would get the rental car right away. However, if you are going into Rome and leaving later for Padua, take the train into the city and pick the rental car up later. You don’t want to drive and attempt to park for multiple days in Rome. Think of driving and parking in New York City with the added difficulty of huge areas of restricted traffic (ZTLs). You are much better off taking taxis which have ZTL privileges.

It may seem nice to have a car for convenience for your mother, but you will find you can’t use it in the historical centers of almost every city, so you have to store it and obtain some other transport to get from parking into the center. Do consider you would have a pretty simple and comfortable train trip from Rome to Florence and Padua, all set up in a row. You could then rent a car at Padua Station for Velo. I realize the sanctuary of a car seems more protected from virus, but you cant use the car in city centers so you have to change travel modes repeatedly.

We took the train between Venice, Florence and Naples and only drove during our Chianti/Tuscany loop. That worked out quite well. BTW, take no chances with insurance. Get the car rental coverage. My car was fine but two friends returned their cars damaged in 2019.

Have a look to news as it may be that US travelers may be still banned from Europe after July 1st; there is much fear that allowing people from the Americas could be exactly what is needed to restart a second wave in autumn.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/23/politics/eu-us-coronavirus-travel/index.html