Rough outline for May/June northern Italy trip

Five nights in the Lakes District is a bit long. I'm assuming you're visiting Como and Maggiore, but not sure if this includes Lake Garda which is more convenient from Verona. After four nights you'll probably be ready to move on. You want to focus on Varenna, Bellagio and Stresa and skip Garda. You also want to take a direct train from Milan to Varenna (check www.bahn.com) 1h.
I assume you can rent a car in Varenna (or nearby) and drive to Castelrotto and explore Alpi di Siusi and Bolzano. From there you can drive to Bologna (3h 30m). After visiting the Ferrari plant and Ravenna, I would drop off the car and take a direct train to Verona. You can easily get to Vicenza, Padua and Venice by train.

Unless you have a great reason to spend 2 nights in Milan, I would take at least one of those nights and add it elsewhere. Especially since you will be flying from Europe and not in jet lag recovery mode. (Unless you just mean you're connecting through Europe). Otherwise, those allocations look pretty good to me. Have fun.

In my opinion, 3 nights for Verona/Vicenza/Padua is hit and run. 3 nights = 2 days. I recommend taking a day or two from one of your other destinations and adding to that segment of your trip.

"You also want to take a direct train from Milan to Varenna (check www.bahn.com) 1h."

The web site for ticket purchase is :

https://www.trenitalia.com/tcom-en

For some other routes:

https://www.italotreno.it/en [private competitor with lower fares on some routes]

Leaving Varenna if renting car there is a Hertz in Lecco.

Bolzano I suggest you dump a Hertz rental at the airport, direct train late AM/early PM to Bologna. Read this about driving in Italy and restrictions involved [ZTLs]; never leave anything of value in a vehicle when parked:

http://driventoit.blogspot.com/

I agree with Rosalyn. 3 nights is less than 3 days, which seems tight for both Verona/Padua/Vicenza and Bologna/Ferrara/Ravenna, though I have been to neither Verona nor Ferrara.

If you can't extend those times, I'll point out that Vicenza is fairly small and could take less than a day unless you're a fanatic about Palladian architectcure, whereas I though Padua needed more than one full day because of the number of sights there.

Ravenna's a full-day sort of place assuming you want to enjoy the lovely town as well as see all seven of the mosaic sights. Bologna has one of the largest medieval centers in Europe. Maybe Ferrara doesn't take so long?

Thank you for the helpful responses. To expand further, we will be arriving in Milan late afternoon or evening on May 27 after having flown ORD-LHR, so spending two nights in Milan nets us one full day there as well as time to adjust to the new time zone. For the Lakes District, we had planned on visiting all 3 lakes, though going to Lake Garda from Verona is an interesting option. Based on what @Rosalyn and @MaryPat commented, perhaps 3 nights between Maggiore and Como (stay in Stresa?), an overnight to Garda from Verona, then add the extra day in Verona/Vicenza/Padua? The rental car from Varenna to Verona also makes sense.

Looking forward to other feedback!

@acraven, I agree that Padua looks like it will warrant more time. We were thinking Verona/Vincenza for one day and Padua for two days. I'd love to add another day to Bologna/Ferrara/Ravenna, too. Perhaps we could shave a day from the Dolomites.

Perhaps Verona can be seen in about half a day; never having tried it, I'm not sure. Remember that it is a 1-1/2 hour round trip on the Frecciarossa or 2+ hours by car. You could save considerable travel time if you saw Verona in transit, on the day you relocate from the Dolomites to Padua. However, that presumes you're coming from somewhere in the Bolzano area and can find a safe and convenient place to park in Verona.

Where in the Dolomites and will you be wanting to hike? Things don’t really get rolling (i.e., seasonal buses and lift openings) in the areas I am familiar with until mid-June.

@acraven: yes, the thought is we'd see Verona/Vincenza en route from the Dolomites to Padua, possibly staying a night in that area and then 2 in Padua. Your comment that you're presuming we "can find a safe and convenient place to park in Verona." Is this an issue we should be aware of - finding safe and convenient parking?

@Laurel: "Where in the Dolomites and will you be wanting to hike?" We are considering staying in the area of Ortisei, but we're open to other suggested base locations. We would love to do any day treks of easy-to-medium difficulty. Based on a rough itinerary, we'd likely be in the Dolomites approximately June 3-7. Is that too early to sight-see, drive around, and/or trek a bit? I know the temps at altitude are much lower than down in the larger towns in the area.

@N_Kingdom: I neglected to give a big thanks to you for your links and detailed info. Much appreciated!

I have never rented a car in Europe, so I know nothing about parking in Verona. It's just that I know parking isn't necessarily available close to the historic centers of Italian cities, and you must be very careful to avoid ZTL (limited-traffic zones) while you look for parking, else you may be gifted with costly traffic tickets after you return home. There's also some concern about theft from cars parked near tourist attractions. I assume we have some folks on the forum who have driven to Verona and can comment.

I didn't mean to raise undue concern; it's just that visiting the historic center of a European city by car isn't the sort of thing you should try to do without planning ahead.

Ah yes, the infamous ZTLs. Despite being extremely watchful for signs in Florence in 2009, we were caught in one. (Lodged outside of town and needed to get in for an evening event.) They are quite clever in sign placement, usually posting the few signs they have several feet inside the ZTL so that you only see them after they've taken your picture. Must be a great source of revenue for these towns. I will look into these in the towns we plan to visit.

And yes, sadly thievery of rental car contents is a huge industry. The beauty of staying for several nights at a time is we don't often have anything in the car to steal, and when we do it's a single suitcase each that can easily fit in a trunk.

Thanks for sharing the concerns. All info is helpful.

The Lakes and Dolomites are best done with a car but the second half a car will be more trouble than it's worth - both parking and the restricted zones. Ten nights between those places is pretty generous, you could take one or two and add to the other places.

I've done Verona, Vicenza and Padua as day trips and you can get a nice taste of them in a day, I have also spent way longer and each deserves more time if you've got it. I think Vicenza is the least interesting of the three. However, it is between the other two so one option would be to book three nights there and do a day trip to Verona and another to Padua and see Vicenza in the late afternnon/evening after your day trips. I'm talking about taking trains between these towns.

Both Ferrara and Ravenna are easy day trips by train. I'd probably add one more night here.

Here are my photos of all those places - https://andiamo.zenfolio.com/f739967755

@Isabel: We enjoyed your photos and appreciate your feedback.

All: Based on your comments, we're thinking of tweaking our rough itinerary as follows --

• Milan - 2 nts (May 27-29)
• Lakes Maggiore & Como - 3 nts (May 29-June 1)
• Lake Garda - 2 nts (June 1-3)
• Domomites - 4 nts (June 3-7)
• Verona/Vincenza - 1 nt (June 7-8)
• Padua - 2 nts (June 8-10)
• Bologna/Ferrara/Ravenna - 4 nts (June 10-14)
• Venice - 4 nts (June 14-18)

Some questions we're working through:

• Are we going to be in the Dolomites too early in the season to really do anything?
• Where/how long to have the car vs taking trains/buses?
• Central locations to stay in each area?

Further comments/suggestions/input are appreciated.

I’d recommend doing either Maggiore or Como. Whether train or car, they are not direct. 2 nights in one and 1 night in the other breaks it up. Of course I’m partial since I live on Maggiore, but 3 nights, 2 1/2 days gives you a good taste. We’ve had many visitors there is so much to do here using ferries for primary transportation.

In addition to the Boromee Islands, there is the Angera castle at the south end of lake, the Monastery across lake to east, the bucket Gondola in Laveno, a day trip to Switzerland, visit to Cannobio, the cable car from Stresa to Monterone 1309 meters), and our lakeside town of Verbania Pallanza. All reachable by ferry/and Or foot.

Two little data points:

Bologna to Ferrara takes only about 30 minutes by hourly regionale veloce (cheap but not stopping everywhere) train. There are also Freccia trains that are a few minutes faster but much more expensive, and there are slower regional trains as well. Driving would take longer than 30 minutes even aside from the additional time likely required for parking.

Regional trains to Ravenna are also frequent, and a lot of them take about 70 minutes. ViaMichelin gives the driving time by the fastest route at 64 minutes.

I assume that Padua-Bologna and Bologna-Venice are a lot faster by rail, but I haven't checked.

This Val Gardena site lists lift opening times. Some are in May (Ortisei to Alpe di Siusi is on May 16 for example) some not until June (Dantercepies and Gran Paradiso). There will be plenty of lifts open. Some of the direct buses will not be running yet, but there will be alternatives with the probable exception of the #11 up on the Alpe di Siusi which usually does not run until mid-June. The buses really are great and with the free pass from your lodging establishment make a lot of sense versus trying to find parking. Just ask locally how to get where you want to go and make sure you know how to get back and what time the last transport is. Good practice in any season.

Bus route and schedule planning here:
http://www.sii.bz.it/en/siipdfOldtimetables

Thanks to all for your additional information, specifically the best "hub" locations and suggested train connections. These and all feedback given are invaluable and much appreciated.

Can you do the trip in reverse, into Venice and out of Milan. It probably doesn't make much difference unless you have a morning flight out of Venice - it can take a very long time to get to the airport. You could also go round-trip Milan and change your route to a loop (lakes, Dolomites, Verona-Venice-Padua-Bologna-Milan). You can continue from Milan to Como on arrival day and spend your last 1-2 nights in Milan before flying home. A car will be helpful for the Dolomites, maybe for the lakes (haven't been to any). For the rest, the train is better. You said you're flying via LHR. Are you spending time in London on this trip? If not, are you booking your flights to/from Italy on the same ticket as the ORD-LHR flights? If so, you might also consider flying in or out of Bologna. If not, be aware of the substantial risks of connections on separate tickets. LHR is notorious for long connection times.

You'll be in the Dolomites about the same time that I was (RS Alpine tour). It was lovely, lots of spring flowers. That year - 2015 - the late May RS tour had better weather than mine did. Also expect rain in the afternoons. It's usually not too long, my tour had bad luck and it poured from about 2-4 pm. It was still a wonderful day.

Verona is one of my favorites in Italy, especially in the evenings. There are a number of interesting sights (google Verona Card). I haven't been to Vincenza. I was less impressed by Padua. If you are going to take the University tour in Bologna (highly recommend it), skip the one in Padua - it isn't as good.

Ravenna is much better as an overnight - or even 2, arriving late and leaving early, so you'll have one full day there. It has a very nice historic center, just a few minutes' walk from the train station, and good restaurants too. You'll walk everywhere except to the must-see Basilica of Sant'Apollinare in Classe (take the bus or a taxi). I stayed at palazzogallettiabbiosi, loved it.

If you want specific hotel recommendations, we need to know your price range and minimum requirements.

@Chani: Wow, what an awesome response! Thank you for taking the time to post such great info and so many details. Replies to some of your points:

• "Can you do the trip in reverse, into Venice and out of Milan" We have flights already purchased into LHR and out of VCE. We originally were going to go to Croatia/Slovenia and were able to score bus class upgrades on those two flights, figuring we'd book the intra-Europe flight LHR-DBV when there was a nice sale. Subsequently, we decided to go to Italy instead and visit Croatia/Slovenia at another time. So we can fly into any of the cities, even VCE, on entry from LHR but we cannot change our point of departure. Note: we are not spending any time in London, but will make sure there is plenty of time to connect to the ongoing flight, based on your comment. I'm assuming it's due to customs/immigration and/or crowds?
• "You'll be in the Dolomites about the same time that I was (RS Alpine tour). It was lovely, lots of spring flowers" I'm glad this will end up being a nice time to go as we were concerned the trails would still be pretty icy. We're not mountain hikers or climbers by any means, but it would be nice to do a couple of walks from the top of the lifts/gondolas. And thanks for the heads-up about the rain. We figured spring would give us rain, but it's always good to prepare for specifics.
• "Verona is one of my favorites in Italy, especially in the evenings. There are a number of interesting sights (google Verona Card). I haven't been to Vincenza. I was less impressed by Padua. If you are going to take the University tour in Bologna (highly recommend it), skip the one in Padua - it isn't as good." Interesting. I've gotten the impression from some of the posts that Verona & Vincenza are, at best, half-day sites that pale in comparison to Padua, especially with the faux Romeo and Juliet attractions. What did you particularly like? What are the University tours you mention? Why were you less than impressed with Padua? We will look into the Verona card.
• "Ravenna is much better as an overnight - or even 2, arriving late and leaving early, so you'll have one full day there. " Yes, we're really looking forward to Ravenna. In our revised schedule, we allocated 4 nights among the three towns (Ravenna, Ferrara, Bologna) - should it be more like 5 nights? We might be able to move a night from somewhere, perhaps just staying one night on Lake Garda or cutting a night from the Dolomiti. (There are never enough nights, no matter how many you have).
• "If you want specific hotel recommendations, we need to know your price range and minimum requirements." At this point, we're only at the point of finding the best home base locations for each area. Once that is established, I can research the lodging in those spots, perhaps asking for recommendations if needed. Thank you for the offer of assistance.