Rick Steve's Itallys Best 3-week trip

The part that you are miss is that an organized trip like Steves is very efficient. No waiting for trains, min check in and out times for hotels, no looking for the hotel when you arrive in a new cities, quick orientation by the guide and info during the bus ride so you are ready when you hit the new cities, etc., etc. A lot of the things that can be very time consuming for the single traveler is handled quick by the organized tour group. If you try to match his trip on your own, you cannot do it. You best bet is about half of what they accomplish. With 16 nights, I would plan no more than 5 or 6 site changes. Otherwise all you are going to see is the inside of trains and train stations.

I'm traveling with others. We'll pay for hotels in advance, museum tickets and not standing in museum lines, eliminate all time consuming things, pay for efficient transfers, stay in RS centrally located hotels, eat how RS suggests and do what RS published in his Best of Italy trip to 11 sight destinations. My purpose of this inquiry to to discover whether anyone actually did the RS Best Italy Trip to 11 sight locations in 22 days as RS published could be done.
Howard

Doing it on your own is not the same as having a tour operator do it all for you. They plan all of the transportation, the check=in/check-out of hotels, the meals..... they plan it all. Trying to duplicate one of these tours but only duplicating half of it will lend itself to disaster. You are planning too much in too little time. You say you're a travel cheapskate but this isn't being a cheapskate. This is not having a grasp on what's involved. You're going to lose at least half of your trip with just changing hotels every day or so. I know you want to pattern this after one of RS's tours but his tour is 11 cities in 22 days. That's 2 days per city (to many for my taste but it's his company) and yours is 10 cities in 16 days. That's not even 2 days per stop. I suggest you slow down and cut out half of what you have planned. If you don't want to do that then you can find information about train schedules and costs at: http://www.trenitalia.com/cms/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=ad1ce14114bc9110VgnVCM10000080a3e90aRCRD You can find hotels at venere.com Donna

I've always been puzzled at the disconnect between Rick's suggested itinerary and his encouragement for people to slow down. His itineraries are much too aggressive. Plan for no fewer than two nights at any one location, with three being better. Florence, Venice and Rome all deserve at least three nights. Why don't you spell out your itinerary here, and then people could make more specific suggestions?

Rick Steve published his Best of Italy 13 sight destinations in 22 days wherein he traveled some long distances such as the Dolomomite Road from Cortina to Bolzano to Varenna. Being a Rick Steves advocate, I believe his Best of Italy trip could be done with a lot of timing, drive times, RR times, transfers, advance hotel bookings, museaum tickets, no waiting in museaum lines and so forth. There will be 10 adults to share the transfer and timing costs, because I know it's going to cost more than typical RS travel to have more daylight hours at the various sight destinations. We'll stay in RS suggested hotels near the central areas and eat in recommended places. I'm trying to find anyone who did Rick Steve's Best of italy trip in 22 days to see how you did it and not people who doubt Rick Stev'es Best of Italy trip to 13 destinations in 22 days.

Howard, I sent you a private message

OK. I get it and thanks for your input. The 10 of us need to hire and pay for a tour to handle escorted tours, transfers from the airport, train stations and sights, bus, fast trains, hotels, museum tickets, figure out the timing, when things are open or closed to do as much of Rick Steves Best Italy trip as will fit. The places I want to see are: Dolomites, Lake Como, Cinque Terre, Naples Archiological Museum, Rick Steve's Naples Walk, the Amalfi Coast and whatever else reasonably fits into my 16 days. Thanks my fellow travelers

My fellow travelers, Everyone has been kind and responsive. I'll hire a professional tour to do as much of the Best of Italy as fits 16 days, that includes Dolomites, Lake Como, Cinque Terre, Naples Archeological Museum and walk sugested by Rick Steves, the Amalfi Coast and whatever else reasonably fits my 16 days. Thanks again
Howard

FWIW, Howard ISN'T referring to RS' Tours; these are Rick's suggested itineraries for independent travelers, published in his books and right here on his website. Howard is NOT trying to compete with a professionally-run tour operator. Having said that... I know from experience that traveling with my husband and traveling with ONLY two additional people Took.So.Much.More.Time.To.Do.Anything!!! And you're talking about 10 people. BTW, who are these people, and what ages are we talking about? Any physical limitations? Do these 10 people need to go everywhere, do everything, together? Or, can you base yourselves somewhere and various clusters of the 10 go on day trips/excursions? Maybe some want to see the Uffizi, while some prefer to wander the streets or see churches...or sleep in... (The above is 'pasted' in another of Howard's threads.)

My purpose is to consider my fellow travelers experiences and use that data to arrive at my own itinerary decisions, that's what I'll do and I'll have to pay the bucks to streamline the details. Thanks to everyone. Apparently, nobody did Rick Steves' Best of Italy in 22 days, including Rick Steves.
Thanks again my fellow travelers

11. escorted Forum, Coliseum, Capital, Pantheon, dine, Piazza Navonnaescorted Forum, Coliseum, Capital, Pantheon, dine, Piazza Navonna 11. Sept 17h Tuesday / Rome Escorted St. Peters, Sistine Chapel, Castle Saint Angelo, Fontana D'Trevi, dine stroll 12. Sept 18th Wednesday / Rome Escorted Catacombs, Villa D'Este, Villa Adriano, dine, stroll Spanish Steps Piazza 13. Sept 19th Thursday / Naples, Pompeii, Sorrento 7:45 / 8:55 am Rome to Naples RR escorted walk to Arch Museum, Pompeii, Sorrento hotel, stroll night 14. Sept 20th Friday / Amalfi Coast Escorted Amalfi Coast, Positano lunch, Ravello, transfer to Naples RR 6/7pm to Rome, dine, stroll. 15. Sept 21st Saturday / Rome Free Time
16. Sept 22nd Sunday / Transfer to airport / D#214 non-stop 9:55 am, arrive ATL 3:35 pm Sun

Howard, The Itinerary that you've suggested in the previous post is extremely ambitious, and perhaps not even feasible. Even if it is possible, it seems more like a "recipe for stress and exhaustion". Good luck!

Yes. I understand that my "wants" are ambitiuous and may result in stress. Wherefore based on the kind input of my fellow travelers, I realize we need to hire a professional to perform those tasks to facilitate my wants, reduce all time-consuming functions, book hotels, pre-purchase museaum and sight tickets, transfers to and from hotels and sight destinations, figure timing, when museaums and sights are open or closed, hours on the bus or fast train and have them perform and reduce most of the stress related elements so that we could do as much Rick Steve's Best of Italy as reasonably fits 16-days, as long as it includes the Dolomites, Lake Como (Varenna), Cinque Terre, Rick Steves Naples walk and Archaeoligcal Museum, Pompeii and Amalfi Coast. Then I'll consider other sight destinations that reasonably fits 16-days such as: Florence, Rome, Venice and Portofino in that order. For the purpose of an order and time, I would fly into Venice then Domomites - Como - Cinque Terre and the rests that fits. Depart from Rome. I'll use private small bus or Florence-Rome-Naples fast trains, whichever takes the least time. Book and pay for Rick Steves-type suggested inexpensive hotels located closest to the most intersting areas, check-in AFTER touring and leave luggage locked on the bus. For me, walkng out of the hotel for relaxed night strolling in the most interesting areas is essential to my trave. Dine in Rick Steve-type restaurants. Eat on the bus or train, or the street. Or wherever time permits. If my wife and I were traveling alone, we'd probsbly do just as you would do. But this is different and I know its going to cost. Meanwhile, I'm still looking for input from people who did Rick Steves Best of Italy trip, whether they did it in 22, 32 days or whatever days. Where else, other than this website, would I find such people? Naysayers' input is actually helpful. Thanks
Howard

Dear Geri, Thanks for you kind input. My number-one destination is Cortina Arrow in the Sky cable car and stay the night in Cortina. Next morning start at 8 am drive the Dolomite Road from Cortina to Bolzano, stop at Marmlolado (cable cars) and Pordoi (cable cars) and then the Autostrada to Varenna (Lake Como). Other musts are Lake Como (Varenna), Cinque Terre, Naples taking the Rick Steves walk from the train station to the Archaelogical Museuum, Sorrento and the Amalfi Coast. My route starts in Venice to Dolomites to Como, then head south. I'll fit in Pompeii, Florence and Rome with what's left of my 16 nights. I'll take thre fast trains: Florence / Rome / Naples to save time, with transfers from the train station direct to the sights with luggage on board and then check into hotel. If Rick Steves' Best of Italy takes 22 days (for him to do), everything on it could also do done in 32 days or whatever days. All nights will be relaxed, strolling charming and interesting areas and my hotels will be as cheap as I could get that's in those areas. Thanks again Howard Thanks
Howard

Howard, it is possible to do the RS tour just as he suggests. We have done many segments of it and could do it on his timetable. And that's the rub. The first time we did it, there was no way we were anywhere close to his timetable. The reason we could do it on his schedule, and that he could easily do it as he describes, is because we've already done it. We know how to work the transportation system, find parking, walk to the museums, find the sights, etc. This is where RS has lost touch with the average traveler. He way underestimates the time it takes someone new to a city or region to find there way around. I'd estimate that it would take 1.5x his estimate to just do his itinerary for the first time, and that would be at a hurried pace.

Dear Martha,
Thanks for your kind input, and everyone's input. My wife and I have traveled lots to various Eurpoe destinations (4th to Italy and Sicily) for 2 or 3 weeks, picked up a car at the airport, returned it 2 or 3 weeks later, booked the first night in a hotel and the rest just winged it using Rick Steves and whatever. This is different because I'll be with my family, who wouldn't risk what I'd do. I'll fly into Venice, then Dolomites, Como, Cinque Terre, Naples ala Rick Steves, Pompeii, Sorrento and the Amalfi Coast...while I'm still alive and as much of the Rick Steves Best of Italy as fits 15 nites with some alterations, such as eliminating Milan, Assisi, Siena, Civita, stay only one night in Cortina,one night in Vernazza and add Portofino. I've allowed 4/hrs to get from Bolzano to Varenna and 3/hrs to get from Varenna to Portofino and take the fast RR Florence-Rome-Naples just to save time. Since all of my fellow travelers opine that doing everything would be stressful, rushed and foolish, adding one-week is realistically needed to do Rick Steves Best of Italy trip. I figure it's going to cost me big bucks to hire a tour-guide to facilitate transfers, book and pre-pay hotels, museum tickets, eliminate long museum lines and so forth. I'm going to stay in Rick Steve's suggested hotels nearest to the interesting areas and meals at his suggested places. Without tour-guide-stuff, adding another week would be needed, which will increase hotel and meal costs, deal with public transporastion, long museum lines and a week lost wages for some. You'd have to put it on a scale and compare the cost to do what I want to do, while I'm still alive. Everyone's input was great. Howard

Have you considered the "Best of Italy in 17 Days" tour (Sept 4-20)? It hits your highlights, except for the area south of Rome. You simply show up...and it's all taken care of for you. Cheap? No, but your trip isn't shaping up to be, either. I finally saw a reference to 'family' - I've assumed all along (because I haven't read any different) that you were traveling with your 85-year-old parents, 94-year-old in-law, a 4-month-old, 10-and 13-years-old kids that are being forced to take this trip, and their parents and your wife. If it turns out we're talking about 5 couples, all in their 30's, that would be different. We wouldn't keep coming back and posting if we didn't want to figure this out with you ;-)

We go to Europe every summer for a month for over 10 years now and while there take a RS tour - #11 coming up in June. We travel independently either before the tour, or after the tour, or both. When we use RS suggestions for going and seeing, we always figure at least 1.5 times his estimated time if not 2.0 times. And, we are in fine shape, the wife being a mountain climber. So, do not get frustrated by not being able to fit everything he suggests into your time frame. But, as he says, just figure you will be back.

Thanks to all my fellow travelers. Little by little I'm figuring it all out. I'll let you know where I went and what I did when I come back, and how much of the time consuming elements I eliminated and what it cost to do so.
Howard

Howard, Not sure if you've noticed it, but there's also a "Trip Reports" section here on the HelpLine. That would be a good place to post when you get back. The information may be of help to others. Cheers!

For my fellow travelers who suggested Rick Steves organized 17-day (16-nites) Best of Italy tour that includes Sienna, Assisi, Citiva et al and excludes Naples, Pompeii, Sorrento, Amalfi Coast and has but 2 nights in Rome. Whereas that tour looks good, I prefer doing Naples, Pompeii, Sorrento and Amalfi Coast, 4 nights in Rome plus Portofino for a similar cost, tour logistics et al.
Howard