Northern Italy Itinerary

Should I try to replace something with Portofino or Bologna? So many places to see, not enough time!

I assume you've read all about ZTL's in Italian towns. Really, the only place a car would be handy is Day 8. Rest of the time it will be a headache.

Yes, definitely. How about day 3 also?
I was thinking of using the car to get between the regions even if we don't use it inside the cities, but not sure if it's a hassle to do so.

Car=Hassle. It may seem faster than a train but usually it is not and parking is a nightmare in several of your locations. If you must, rent it when leaving the Cinque Terre (perhaps at La Spezia) for days 7 & 8 then return it.

A friend of ours visited us in Italy a few years ago and we spent some time together in Florence. It was his dream to drive the winding roads of Tuscany. I could not talk him out of it so he rented a car and the 4 of us headed out into Chianti for the day. A few weeks later, he got a ticket in the mail. He'd gone throught a speed trap 5 minutes after we left the car rental lot!

Omg! I read about some stories of people getting tickets in the mail. Definitely not fun!
My husband is convinced it's easier to drive the car than to go in and out of train stations. Perhaps we can compromise and just rent it out for a few spots as you said. Other than that, what do you think of the itinerary?

Have you looked at the actual map to see what the route from Lake Como to CT? I'd say either Lake Como OR CT but not both.

it's true that it's far from Lake Como directly. If we're going by train, then we'd go back to Milan then take the train I suppose. By car it is far.. What do you suggest?

Where are you going to park the car once you get to the Cinque Terre? From Varenna, you can get to Monterosso by train with one change in Milan in 4 1/2 hours. Change there to other CT towns.

I haven't really been to Lake Como (just spend a night in transit in the city of Como), but folks have said on this forum that you don't get very good views if you drive around the lake. Apparently, the roads don't hug the lake in most places. The best views are from the ferries. There are some buses if you need to go somewhere without ferry service.

Is there no where to park the car outside of one of the five villages? it seems more convenient than getting on two trains from lake. Otherwise it could be an option to drop the car in Milan and take the train to Monterosso.

The logistics seem complicated to get right as you also have to plan the details like how to get from the train station to and from the hotel with luggage.

The train transfer is a piece of cake. You arrive on one platform at Milano Centrale and just walk to the new platform and board the train. If you take the 10:35 am train from Varenna, you have 30 minutes in Milan to make the connection to the IC train to Monterosso.

This MAY?

I'm not sure you would be able to rent a car in the small towns of Lake Como or CT.

Ah cars, well besides the fact that there is really not much parking in Varenna/Bellagio or the CT towns, driving around Lake Como is a nightmare. I might look into a private driver on train routes that aren't direct. We have hired private drivers from Milan to Bellagio because the road is a nightmare. The Lake is beautiful, and you won't need a car to get great views.

You could take the bus to/from CT to Florence it might be more direct as I believe the train goes through Pisa.

I'm not sure it's an age thing as much as a travel style. Fast pace is one thing, but this seems to me like a trip from National Lampoon. Stop -get out -see -move on but as I said it's a travel style. In my opinion 2 full days (which would be 3 nights) in Varenna or CT is a minimum.

I know we're ambitious to try and fit so much into this trip. We don't think we will be back to Italy anytime soon after this trip, which is why we'd like to see as many of the places on our wish list as possible.

Some people even suggest Lake Como as a day trip from Milan! It is interesting how preferences vary from one person to another. How would you suggest I rearrange the itinerary?

My nephew and his wife are planning a trip to Italy in July (they are in their 30's) 8 nights boots on the ground and wanted to see it all. They took out Lake Como and are just hitting Rome, Florence, Venice because Lake Como took them out of the way. Are you wanting to see Lake Como in particular or an Italian lake?

Are you getting into Milan late? If not, I'd go straight to your first destination.

With 11 nights boots on the ground - If CT is a must I'd start there from Milan to CT (2 nights) - head to Florence (4 nights) - head to Lake Garda (2 nights) head to Venice (3 nights). Or some variation- maybe add a night to Lake Garda and 2 nights in Venice.

Wonderful trip itinerary! Milan is BIG! Lake Garda nice, but have been to Lake Como twice and hpoe to go back - do NOT miss Lake Como. We stayed in Varenna on the water and had a balcony! We did have a car both times. Didn't drive AROUND the lake, took the ferry and stopped off in Ballagio and other towns. Just wonderful and NOT to be missed. Likewise, loved Cinque Terre and have been there twice. When in Tuscany, try to get to Castello di Verrazzano. We did the tour and lunch - TWICE. Just wonderful. Yes, purchased some wine to ship home!
https://www.verrazzano.com/

In Europe, taking a train is often faster than driving. There's one morning train departure from Milan that gets you to Monterosso in the Cinque Terre in 3 hours; you don't even have to make a connection. ViaMichelin estimates the driving time via the fastest route at 3 hours 4 minutes, and that doesn't include the time spent dealing with the rental agency twice, stopping along the way, getting lost, traffic delays or looking for parking at your destination.

you do realize the CT has been loved to death yes? it may not give you the experience you are hoping for, and dropping it would make the rest so much easier. young or not, you've bitten off a lot and you should assume that one day you'll be back.

@Donna We heard Lake Como is the most beautiful so we would like to see it specifically and it is not out of the way since we are landing in Milan. We only want to spend a day in Milan the day we arrive to see the main square. Our flight gets us to Milan at 10 am.

Honestly, no American couple should drive in Italy. There are all kinds of issues there. Do a quick scan for "Italy" "tickets" etc. Italy has more posts about terrible stories about car rental.

As to the ridiculous idea that you can get closer to the town center on a car than on the train, this is foolish. Trains are often right in the center. Right where the ZTL zones are. If you do not know what ZTL means, drop the car rental idea immediately.

@Marna That sounds wonderful! Where did you stay in Varenna? Since we're booking last minute, I'm having a hard time finding available hotels, which is to be expected. Also, did you keep your car the entire time? I would love to hear about your itinerary because it sounds similar to what we want to do!

@Paul-of-the-Frozen-North We may rethink the car rental idea for the entire duration of the trip. Perhaps it would be useful for visiting Tuscany's countryside. What do you think is the best way to get to and from the train stations to the destinations?

@phred Why would CT make it complicated? I thought it fits will within our itinerary and is not out of our way. Is it not worth seeing? I think that a day trip there is a crazier idea since it's far from all our bases, but staying there 2 nights seemed nice.

Americans who have not driven in Europe think that driving in Italy is like driving in NY. It is not.

Take trains. It's much less stressful, likely to be cheaper, and you will not get a ticket.

Consider driving from City A to City B. You get there. Where do you park? How much per day? Since you have rented the car, you pay for parking AND you pay to hold the car. Why is that good?

We have been to Europe 6 times since 2011. We rented a car in 2011 since we had 5 in our party. We rented for a short time in 2017 since we were going to rural France. Other than that, 5 trips on trains, buses, and planes. No tickets.

@acraven our last trip, taking the train from Naples to the Amalfi Coast was a bit complicated (getting from Naples airport by bus to Naples train station, then hopping on the train with our luggage and with a ton of crowds. Maybe it was just a bad experience ?

We were in N Italy last Sept - Oct. Walking from the Train station was the approach. We chose our hotels to be close. We had walks of 1 hr (Milan), 10 min (Ravenna), 10 Min (Padua), 2 min (Torino), 20 min (Pisa), taxi (Siena), and 20 min (Florence). Walking is no problem for us (70, 73). We enjoy seeing the town as we walk.

As you make your reservations, ask them how long the walk is from the train, and is a taxi a better approach.

Part of our travel enjoyment is getting away from the US car culture. Italy is far more a train/ public transport culture. Isn't that why we travel? To experience the life of local persons?

@Paul-of-the-Frozen-North Even when we travel light, I've always thought of transportation with our luggage as a hassle, perhaps because of past experiences (taking the metro in Paris with our luggage and going up and down manual stairs and walking on cobblestone streets... not very comfortable), but for sure taxi is the best option if it's a far walk.

Also, should we book train tickets in advance? If so, how much in advance?

As to advance bookings, I think that this is not necessary. You might save a little, but not much. We took trains 5 times, bus one time. The most in advance we reserved was 1 day. We never had a problem getting a ticket.

If your trip is next month, do you have hotels set? For Milan, we stayed in Ibis Milano Centro. Not very posh, but not expensive, good breakfast.

Good to know. I was more so scared of tickets not being available anymore! Since we decided on our trip this week, I'm currently in the process of researching itineraries and hotels. Not many hotel options left, but I'm sure I'll end up finding something...