Just back (July 2022), ZTL, IDP and more advice

Its Bitter Lemon that you want 😉

That fact that you were not asked to show a IDP at the rental means nothing -- only that you were not asked. The last time we rented at FCO airport we were asked and they wanted to see the IDP for both drivers on the car.

I agree with Frank. We were asked for the IDP when we rented a car in Italy.

You have failed to state the car rental company you used. I have seen folks who used Avis say they were asked for their IDP which is why I mentioned the rental car company. I also wasn’t asked for an IDP the last time I rented a car at FCO though that was 20 years ago.

I think we’d probably have to stand by the counter and watch several transactions over several days to get a sense of if rental companies ask for it or not.

As I said, I had an IDP..

Doesn’t matter which agency
It’s required by law and good that you had it
If Enterprise didn’t ask, that’s their mistake
If you hadn’t had it and were asked for it by a police office they wouldn’t care which rental agency you used

Thanks for the update alcoh71

I am worried about the ZTL thing also. I have booked a hotel right next to the Dumo in MIlan and my rental car drop off location is also in that area ( I rented with Sixt)

Should I ask the hotel or the rental car company to 'report' my license/tag information so that we dont get flagged for ZTL violation?

I’d ask them both about the ZTL.

One more driving point. I saw signs about speed checked electronically somehow, but many drivers seemed to ignore them so hoping I don’t get a ticket/bill from rental car company in the mail in a couple of months.

Periscope
My intent was not to take anyone to the “woodshed” and it’s unfortunate you read it that way

OP shared their experience with IDP
I simply pointed out that one experience doesn’t matter, it is required by law
This topic comes up a lot and it’s important for readers to understand that.

OP
Yes they do use cameras for speeding
You might get lucky and escape fines or you might not
You’ll get charged by the rental agency for providing your contact info to authorities- this is usually when you will first be aware of the violation
AND you’ll get the actual notification of fines from the authorities- that could come anytime later

Just because you thought others were ignoring speed limits didn’t mean it was OK

alcoh71,

Thanks for posting your update regarding COVID card, masks, ZTLs and IDLs. Our 2.5 wk trip begins in Sept and we are renting/returning vehicles in Naples, Rome, Venice, and Milan. Keep us posted should you receive any "mail" from Italy in the future. Happy to hear your experience was favorable with it all.

A few years ago in Marsala, Sicily the hotel was within a ZTL. One was limited to 30 minutes for loading and unloading. Worked fine, no ticket. Had a couple hotels recently in vehicle exclusion zones in Spain. Same thing; limited to 30 minutes for loading and unloading. We’ve never been asked for our IDP when picking up a rental car in any country; just our stateside license. We’ve always rented through Avis or Enterprise. Odd there’s no Fanta lemon. Hope you found a substitute. In Spain Kas Limón is hard to find in bars and restaurants so we get Fanta limón when out and buy the Kas in grocery stores.

Not sure how to quote a part of someone’s reply in this forum. ChristineH you wrote…

“Just because you thought others were ignoring speed limits didn’t mean it was OK”

Not sure what you mean by this.
I would have caused a multi-car crash had I slowed down to the random posted speed limit for the portion of the road where this seemed to apply, as no one else slowed down.

Also, I assumed these signs were likely just warnings that are rarely, if ever, followed through on.
EVERY car in my vicinity far exceeded the posted speed limit and didn’t appear to be ambulances or police cars. Hard to think they are ALL going to receive fines. There are signs near me in the U.S. that say “speed checked by radar” and “speed checked by airplanes” (something like that) and I have NEVER gotten a ticket in these areas. Maybe in Italy people are fined, don’t pay, and face no repercussions. We’ll see.

Curiously, on the main A1 Autostrada I never saw a speed limit sign. I only saw signs when the speed limit was lowered for a section. Someone mentioned in a conversation that 130km is the limit, but that was never posted which was odd and was not obeyed by many.

OK -- that is your story and experience. Lets know if you get any additional thank you notes from the Italian authorities in the next year. Italy on their express ways have a lot of rolling speed zones. They extend for maybe 10,20 km and they determine your average speed within the zone. A bit tricky. The locals understand them and probably have figure out ways to beat them. We have always found it beneficial to stick to the limit and let them pass.

rental car drop off location is also in that area ( I rented with Sixt)

In Milan there is also a congestion charge area Called Area C.

Google it because the charge can be paid online within a couple of days.

have figure out ways to beat them.

They just exit the freeway before the 2nd camera. Or stop at a rest area.

I assumed ...were likely just warnings that are rarely

In case you are not joking: You were wrong, they aren't what you assumed. I doubt there is such a sign under the Vienna Agreement.

Do you know when the different speed limit on the sign ends and you are supposed to obey again to the speed limit set for that type of road?

A1 Autostrada I never saw a speed limit sign

Here I really hope you are joking, if not I hope you are going to drive in France next time. Anyway, in Europe we are all supposed to learn the speed limit depending on the type of road before driving a car.

Guests driving into the country should spot the Xmas-tree-style signs at the borders.

when there is a National Speed Limit (in most European countries) it doesn't need to be posted. It is indicated by a circular white sign with a diagonal black stripe. Every driver in each country is expected to know what the various National Speed Limit is in various situation.

Each country has at least three - urban, rural, highway. Some countries like France add others. In Italy the National Speed Limit unless overridden by other signs on the Autostrada is 130 kph. Urban is 50 kph. When you see illuminated speed limits on an overhead gantry they are lowering the speed - with the full weight of the law - for a hazard, traffic, curve, or other important reason, and they are camera enforced.

The speed limits in Italy are indicated on this wiki page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speedlimitsin_Italy

The sign showing derestriction, maximum is National Speed Limit is: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/78/Italiantrafficsigns-vialibera.svg/180px-Italiantrafficsigns-vialibera.svg.png

The sign that Dario refers to looks similar to: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/00/Italiantrafficsigns-limitigenerali.svg/109px-Italiantrafficsigns-limitigenerali.svg.png

I hope you were lucky

Lots of venom and attacks here.

I never saw one of those “Xmas tree” signs showing the speed limit on all the different types of roads including the autostrada. I realize that has no bearing on my responsibility to know and follow the rules. Just responding to the point.

Not sure what this next comment misquoting me means from a previous poster…

I assumed ...were likely just warnings that are rarely

In case you are not joking: You were wrong, they aren't what you assumed. I doubt there is such a sign under the Vienna Agreement.

????

As to the point about every European country not posting speed limit signs on the highway, ok. Seems silly to me to not post speed limits regardless, but it’s a cultural difference. I also find it silly that many light switches in Italy have three buttons where only the middle one works, but maybe there is some explanation for that.

To reiterate, I was going with the flow of traffic. Yes, that doesn’t mean I was right or without fault. I didn’t study the Italian road book before driving there, but had driven there before with no issues.

Lots of venom and attacks here

I did not misquote, In the way I think you're implying, I just did not want to edit for the 10th time my message. You took it too seriously, relax.

also find it silly that many light switches in Italy have three buttons where only the middle one works, but maybe there is some explanation for that.

Man you need either an hobby or a cause.

i think we were just trying to be realistic. There are frequent postings here from other drivers getting ticket about 9 months to a year later and complaining that is a scam to suck money from Am tourists. Just trying to give warning to other readers that Italians have a fairly aggressive enforcement and collection procedures when it comes to traffic violations and fines. Mostly this is for the benefit of future drivers. You can come back in a year and tell everyone how wrong they were.

While we’re taking about Italian roads, the highways are generally good quality roads and well marked.

They do tend to give you little warning of a lane closure. There would be a sign with an arrow and the land would be closed right after that. If you don’t move over quickly, you are in trouble. That’s different from U.S.

Also, I’m sure many of us have seen pictures of those spots with a dozen or more directional signs. That can be an issue trying to find the one that applies to you. The other issue is they aren’t always right. With the advent of GPS— specifically Google Maps here—- the technology finds better routes which can conflict with the signs. I was in hilly Chianti much of the time where this occurred. The technology does make life easier, but takes the fun away of ending up in some amazing town you wouldn’t have found otherwise. I downloaded all the Tuscany maps from Google Maps so I always had them accessible even when mobile phone connection was not available or weak.

We've rented in Italy from Europcar, Hertz, and Budget and no one ever wanted to see my IDP, even though I always present it at the rental counter along with my U.S. driver's license.

But the police who were stopping cars at a spot check just outside Pienza definitely wanted to see it, so I'm glad I had it - from what i understand it would have been a 200 Euro fine if I didn't have it.

alcoh,

Some forum members have reported in the past that their hotels / garages or whatever notified the authorities that a particular vehicle would be passing through a ZTL. However, that doesn't always seem to be the case, as some travellers have still received ZTL tickets several months after returning home.

Hopefully you'll be able to let us know whether that happens in your case.

Fanta Lemon

Fanta Lemon IS present in Italy, but not so common. We prefer other brand for lemon soft drinks: Fanta one is probably too sweet for Italians.

I learned in Italy that one CAN enter a ZTL (limited traffic zone) when active to enter a garage.

Remember that ZTL are local areas, so each city has different rules. In general yes: if you enter into a garage or to an hotel within the ZTL they tell the plate number to the police and you are not fined to enter and exit. In any case is better ask to your hotel/garage in advance to avoid fines, because in some cities you have a route to be followed or some areas where you cannot go even if you can access a general ZTL.

I saw signs about speed checked electronically somehow

90% of times are general waring, often to say that the speed could be electronically checked (maybe with mobile cameras installed on police cars). There are fixed speed traps somewhere, but not on 100% of the time. In general follow the locals behavior is a good advice. Or better respect the speed limits, but sometimes are really crazy!

I was never asked for my international driver’s license

IDP is mandatory if you are a driver from outside European Union. In the past was more important. Now we have a lot of driving licenses from everywhere in Europe written in English, so if your DL is written in that language almost nobody asks for the IDP.
But remember: if there is an incident or a formal complain and you don't have it is like driving without license! So you are fined and the car is taken by the police! Or maybe the Insurance Company use that matter do don't cover the damages!

on the main A1 Autostrada I never saw a speed limit sign

The speed limit is in a big sign when you enter the Autostrada. There are all the limits and the vehicles not allowed to enter. Being a big panel always present almost nobody pay attention to it! :-D
On the most of Autostrada (A1 for sure) there is the "tutor system". Every some Km (20 or 30) there is a camera who can be used as a standard speed trap, or sometimes are on several ones and they do a calculation of the average speed reading your plate number.
In general, as others say, if there is no sign the speed limit is the standard: 130Km/h on highway, 90Km/h on rural roads and 50Km/h on urban streets.

The other caution about Florence ZTLs to remember is that even though the hotel or garage may report your license to avoid a ticket, it is for the zone (there are five zones) the hotel or garage is in. You can not go driving all over Florence and in multiple ZTLs, or enter and leave ZTLs multiple times to use the exclusion. You are expected to enter only the ZTL you will be in, in some cases using the most direct route.

One more driving point. I saw signs about speed checked electronically somehow, but many drivers seemed to ignore them so hoping I don’t get a ticket/bill from rental car company in the mail in a couple of months.

I hope you don't get a surprise ticket in the coming months.

The concern some of us have is that those looking for information regarding driving in Italy or any European country may think it is similar to the US, which it is not. In the US, you are given some leeway regarding posted speed limits. In Italy, you are not. Also, Americans expect to see police cars and assume if none are around, you won't get caught speeding. As you mentioned, speeds are monitored electronically and cameras are tripped by speeding cars.

We saw few speeders on the Autostrada and took that to mean speeds were closely monitored. We did see some locals speeding in rural Tuscany but the scenery was so pretty we weren't tempted to go fast. There were a few times that a local would come up behind us pretty fast. I'd look for the nearest place to turn out to let them by. We'd exchange waves and they would be about their business.

The good news is that by knowing the rules of the road and applying them, we had no surprises when we got home. That was also the case the last time we had a rental car in France.

Have a look for Lemon Soda, Al Limonata.
It's in a thinner black can.
Not too sweet, but so refreshing!

I'm back home now where we have San Pellegrino Limonada and others, but not sure whether the one you mentioned has made it to the U.S. Fanta Lemon is more of a sentimental favorite of mine, so I was disappointed not to find it in Italy as it is not available in the U.S.

Expensive, but available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/stores/Fanta/page/05558ED1-EC9C-4B8B-9568-700127E4C1DA?ref_=ast_bln

Better link? https://www.amazon.com/Fanta-Lemon-330ml-Pack-12/dp/B09Y6669TW/ref=sr_1_8?crid=2OX0GZCG21Z5I&keywords=fanta+lemon&qid=1657564052&sprefix=fanta+lemon%2Caps%2C404&sr=8-8

alcoh71:

Please come back in 4 MO to indicate delayed tickets, if any.

We are going to Italy in September.