Italian travel and itinerary recommendations

Some feedback:

1. Overnight trains would be horrible for a 1 year old. For all of you, actually.
   1.5. Specifically, an overnight train from Milan to Venice makes absolutely no sense as these cities are very close together.
2. Are you sure you want to do Disneyland Paris with a 1 year old? That sounds horrific to me. Maybe when they are 6.
3. Zurich? Why? That is about the most uninteresting part of all of Switzerland.
4. Generally, way too much moving around and one night stops. You will hate this trip.
5. Railpasses in Italy make no sense, ever.
6. Fly from Venice to Paris

If you feel the need to do a day trip from Rome, Orvieto would be the place to go.

It is a good thing you are as young as you are, as your trip looks like a brutal expedition, not a enjoyable vacation. Your youthful stamina will be an asset to get you through the trek.

You say your plans are set and unchangeable, so hopefully this trip will be a learning experience, for future planning.

Flying Venice to Paris is a good idea.

Milan to Venice is about 180 miles. Its a 2.5 hour train ride, not an "overnight" trip. Why were you looking for an overnight train from Milan to Venice? The itinerary you lay out does not have you making that journey. If you meant to say Milan to Rome , even that is just a bit over 3 hrs. Again , not an overnight trip

We are more interested in the lifestyle and beauty of Europe than waiting in lines every day.

And you're going to Disneyland Paris?

Your itinerary looks like the trip from hell.

Day trip from Rome- Tivoli Gardens with it's plethora of fountains. Pretty small town too.

I hope with your Milan time you are actually staying at Lake Como, not in the city.

With only 3 full days in Rome, you really do not need a day trip. Rome is full of things to do, but Ostia Antica, Tivoli, or Castel Gandolfo are good ideas if you must.

Advice above re overnight trains is excellent. Fly to Paris.

Buy your tickets in advance for the best prices. You have to commit to the date and time but the discounts are considerable. Since this is your first time, use the site www.Trainline.EU to buy your tickets. It is very easy to use and does not charge any extra fees.

I don't think it's a trip from hell, but please note that if you want to cover long distances in a short amount of time, odds are that something can go wrong. Your itinerary doesn't have a lot of wiggle room.

Orvieto would be a great day trip, or the places Laurel mentioned.

Fly from Venezia to Paris and give Paris an extra day. Skip Disneyland, go to Chartres instead. Nice little city apart from the stunning cathedral.

Sorry. That was a mistype. The overnight train would be from Milan to Paris, but we would be leaving from Venice to Milan to Paris.

The idea was to save money on a hotel and daytime to get back to our departing city. (Norwegian was doing very cheap direct flights in/out of Paris so I only had a few weeks to make this itinerary.) are the airports way more convienent than the train? Is there customs at each? Seems like I can get back to Paris on train for under $120 in nine hours or take a plane for $160 with baggage plus the cost of another hotel.

Thanks again for your responses.
- to reply to some of them, we ourselves enjoy Disney and zoo trips. Zurich to me sounds amazing a beer and sausage town, specially since I wouldn't take my kid to Germany during October fest. I wanted to do a more relaxing nice/marseille trip but I believe the route was under construction at some point to italy. I know we are traveling every few days but we are going from Marriott to Marriott and when we get there we don't have any plans other than when our next train our will be so the plan is to relax.

Switzerland is alarmingly expensive. You might want to check on what the beer and sausage will cost you. Zurich is pleasant. It's darn hard to find an unattractive town in Switzerland, but I think folks who've been there will all agree that there are many better options than Zurich. And it's hard to get travelers to agree on anything.

I believe the cost you were looking at for the overnight train involved sitting up all night long, not some sort of sleeper accommodation, right? Are you prepared to do that? That strikes me as possibly an unpleasant experience for someone planning to stay at Marriotts. If you can't sleep sitting up, the next day will be miserable. Fly.

My wife and I are traveling with our to be one year old on our first trip over seas together. Our hotels and flights are booked so don't have too much flexibility.
Sorry. That was a mistype. The overnight train would be from Milan to Paris, but we would be leaving from Venice to Milan to Paris.
I know we are traveling every few days but we are going from Marriott to Marriott and when we get there we don't have any plans other than when our next train our will be so the plan is to relax.

First of all, sorry for the "trip from hell" quip. That was not cool. I apologize. I could have chosen a more tactful way of expressing my concerns.

When you say "first trip overseas together", does that mean you've been to Europe before, just not as a family? It sounds like you're pretty much locked in, but if this is truly your first time in Europe, I suggest that you be a little more adventurous next time.

I travel a lot for work and stay at Hilton properties. When we went to Tuscany, we spent our last night at the Hilton at the Rome airport for the convenience. It was nice, but it could have been in any one of a number of American cities. It was a far cry from the wonderful time we had at our agriturismo where we were able to make friends with the staff and get a chance to experience more of the Italian culture. When we went to Scotland, we stayed at working farms that rented out a spare room or two. We got to see 17 calves just days old at the dairy farm we stayed at, helped the owner of the B&B on the Isle of Mull make crab salad on his Aga stove from a fresh catch delivered by a local fisherman and at another farm we got to meet a very pregnant Clydesdale mare. All the while we got to know our hosts as well as local guests.

Amusement parks are a passive activity. There's a great big wonderful and more exciting world out there. Jump in!

Yes. I traveled 15 years ago and my wife has been 10 years ago. Neither of us have been to all these sites and weren't in control of booking.

Yes for the most part we are playing it safe staying at corporate hotels. I think that is what is going to comfort my wife more than anything. I work for Marriott as well so Starwood and Marriott hotels in the center of city are what I booked if they had a great discount. The only one we are winging it on is Rome at palazzo al velabro in Ancient Rome area. I know I want to walk threw monti and campo d'fiori for breakfast and trastevere for evenings.

From what Ive gotten out of RS books The euro rail pass is what is recommended, I buy that and buy Reservations at $10 a trip and its worth it to have everything locked in and paid for no? Then I can still use one or two of my remaining days for a slow train to surrounding sites.
And the Rome three day pass comes with a metro/bus pass no?

I don't know why I posted on here instead of just reading. It is going to make me second guess everything.

I figured you might be associated with Marriot. If I was in your shoes I would do exactly the same thing.

Please don't second guess yourself. You're going to have a wonderful time! If need be, in addition to enjoying what you have planned, consider this a scouting trip scouting trip for future visits.

When our loser son was six months old (he's 44 now), we moved back from California to Georgia. I suggest plan in a little down time mid morning and mid afternoon so your son can recharge his batteries. We found if we pushed too hard, he'd get cranky and no one would sleep that night.

Again, just ignore this old fart, make the trip your own and have a wonderful time!

If your plans are already set in stone, don't second-guess yourselves. You will have a lovely time, and now that you've posted you know some things to be prepared for during your vacation.

In terms of flying or taking the train from Venice to Paris, you'll just need to do the math on which is best. I haven't checked the train schedules myself, but make sure you don't have anything like a middle-of-the-night train change in Marseilles, or anything like that. And in analyzing trains vs. planes, train stations are generally in the middle of cities, and thus easier to get to. Airports are generally outside of cities, and take longer to get to, and you have to leave time to go through security. Another option you might want to price out is whether it would be any cheaper to pay the change fee and change your flights to fly out of Venice, rather than Paris.

In Rome, if you decide to take a day trip (I would suggest that you wait until you get there to make a final decision), if you like ancient ruins, the Ostia Antica is interesting and the train ride isn't too far; obviously, it's not a city/town with lovely views, but I think the ruins are pretty amazing. Gather a bottle wine, some cheese and bread, and have a picnic while you're there. I think you two grownups and your toddler could also have a lovely time hanging out in a piazza in Rome, letting the child cruise around your table as you sip wine and people-watch.

In terms of getting information regarding any possible day trips, figure out how long will take you to get to wherever. For example, I'm guessing your trip in Paris to Disneyland Paris will take at least one hour, and include walking, the Metro and the RER. Everyone on your trip will feel more comfortable when you have more information.

Thanks Doug and Lexma. The ruins and tivilo gardens sound like a relaxing close by trip if we need to get out of Rome.

We are staying at Disney vacation club so I'm hoping to take the shuttle there and back for the day. And it's close enough if little man needs a break.

Thanks for the responses.