Footwear in April for the RS Best of Italy tour: Sneakers or shoes, and waterproofing

We always wear waterproof shoes. It takes about five minutes of rain to soak a pair of sneakers and the last thing in the world you want are wet feet. You should use a shoe designed from the ground up to be waterproofing. Topical waterproofing compounds only work for about ten minutes if that long. An old backpacking trick is to use plastic bags if you are caught without waterproofing. The shoe may get wet but your foot and stockings are protected. Be sure to cut off the top of the bag after your foot is in the shoe so that the top of the bag doesn't collect water or use rubber bands to seal the top of the bag high on your ankle under your pants.

The brand and model we prefer is the Track II Low (http://us.shop.ecco.com/mens-goretex-shoes/). My wife and I wear the same shoe. You want a substantial sole for all the cobblestone streets and rough walking. We use a medium weight wool sock - year around.

Thanks very much, Frank. What you state makes plenty of sense. I have had this "yucky" feeling that bringing just street shoes and/or sneakers (plus sandals) may not work, even if I don't plan on going on any of the more strenuous hikes.

The other feature we like about the Eccos is the interchangable inner sole. It is very important to keep shoes dry even when it does not rain. We carry an extra inner sole so that each evening the inner sole is removed and placed in a window or somewhere with good ventilation so that it drys completely. The shoes are placed in a similar position so that the air flow around the shoe is good. Next morning the other inner goes in and continue to let the previous day's inner sole dry. This solves the problem of having to bring an extra pair of shoes. Taking care of your feet on long trips is critically to a good trip.

You don't have to go on strenuous hikes to beat up your feet. A long day on cobblestones will do just as much damage. And that is another reason to have good, well cushioned, soles.

In my case, it may be critical, as I experience chronic foot and ankle and knee pain, which has made my averse to even walking on the sidewalk (in Seattle). Mentholatum, etc. soothes the pain, but I don't want to be experiencing discomfort to the point that I can't enjoy anything, unless I am sitting down.

Frank,

What do you think of

ECCO Men's Track 6 GTX Plain Toe Tie

http://www.amazon.com/ECCO-Track-GTX-Plain-Toe/dp/B00743SY7W/ref=cts_sh_2_fbt

?

(It's got a better user rating on amazon).

I bought these a few months ago: http://www.amazon.com/Rockport-World-Tour-Classic-Walking/dp/B00629WZVK most comfortable shoes I have ever owned. Over one thousand 5-star reviews agree.

It looks to be the same except for exterior. The smooth toe will probably look at little less causal. Unfortunately Amazon is not a good place to buy shoes unless you know exact what you want. You need to find an Ecco source in your area and try them on. Eccos are commonly sold by most higher end department and shoe stores. You really need to try them on because a perfect shoe for me may not be a perfect shoe for you.

I am concerned that you have a lot of foot, ankle and knee pain. A shoe will not solve that. You do need that evaluated soon. A good physical therapist might be helpful. For example, I use a 2mm lift in my left shoe to square up my walk. 2mm is nothing but makes all the difference in the world for leg/muscle strain.

Denny sounds like what you want are walking shoes, not sneakers or running shoes or dress shoes. But I would rather wear a well broken in pair of street shoes that buy a new pair of walkers without trying them on. Brand and style are unimportant if they don't fit. I have five different pairs of Eccos in five different styles and they all fit different. I only take one pair on trips: the ones that fit the best.

PS I have a pair of the GTX and find them to be relatively heavy, although they are pretty sturdy. Not the best fit for me, might be OK for you

You need to find an Ecco source in your area and try them on. Eccos are commonly sold by most higher end department and shoe stores. You really need to try them on because a perfect shoe for me may not be a perfect shoe for you.

Got it. Will look for an actual store soon.

I'm still wondering, though how much rain to expect in the Dolomites, or, for that matter, anywhere in Italy.

I guess what I'm getting at is that here in Seattle, known for its rain, I could get by with these Nike quasi-hiking shoes with a sturdy Vibram-like outer sole (and added Superfeet inner soles)
because downpours do happen here but it's mostly light to medium rain. It's not like we get a downpour as you would get in the tropics or maybe the Midwest.

Doing yoga does wonders for my knees and ankles and feet. In fact, I can't not do it every day or every other day.

Denny sounds like what you want are walking shoes, not sneakers or running shoes or dress shoes.

I didn't know there was a difference between *walking shoes and running shoes and sneakers, maybe because I don't do that much walking or standing, simply because I find it uncomfortable for long stretches of time (half an hour or mile, for instance).

You're going on an RS tour and you can't walk more than a mile or be on your feet longer than a half-hour? Did you read the activity level information? I counted 3 light days, 8 moderate days and 2 strenuous days. The others are what you make of them.

Light = 2-4 miles of mostly level walking throughout the day.
Moderate = 2-6 miles walking throughout the day with some hills and stairs.
Strenuous = 2-8 miles walking throughout the day with lots of hills, stairs and uneven terrain.

You will also likely be on your feet many hours with no place to sit. These are not the kinds of tours where you spend a lot of time on the bus.

For me at least, I need something much better than most sandals or running shoes or sneakers for that kind of time and activity on my feet. And I need ankle support along with all the other kinds of support my feet need to keep my knees and back happy all day long.

I have tried every brand that has or will be mentioned on the forum posts about this topic. None of them have worked for me, except...

Having been to them, I know there are Walking Company stores in Seattle. Find one and try on some of their Abeo options (http://www.thewalkingcompany.com/abeo-smartsystem-womens). They come in different kinds of support and have a machine to use to see what you really need.

REI also carries my favorite boots for our trips, Ahnu. I have the Montara high-topped ones (http://www.rei.com/product/803672/ahnu-montara-boot-hiking-boots-womens). They are waterproof and have worked in heavy rain and puddles. Something about the ankle support keeps my body in excellent alignment and keeps my fatigue level very low. BTW, I'm 69.

I wear compression socks (which you may not need) that are part wool and part synthetic with the boots. They wick away the moisture and I have never had a blister of any kind. You need some kind of sock that will do that with whatever shoes you wear. That means no 100% cotton and some synthetic or wool in the fiber mix. I also have never had any kind of a blister with any of my Abeos, and I don't wear socks with them at all.

I think that on any trip, what you wear on your feet is the most important contributing factor to the enjoyment of the trip. Especially on tours, you want to keep up with the rest of the group, not slow down the group pace and be comfortable while you enjoy everything with them.

My mid-ankle trail boots with vibrum-type lugged soles are for course trail walking and my low-cut trail shoes with lugged soles for winter city walking are both membrane lined. But I still apply waterproofing to the outside fabric and leather surface.

I am partial to the Nikwax products:
http://www.nikwax.com/en-us/productselector/waterproofing.php

http://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/caring-hiking-boots.html

Waterproofing
Use a waterproofing treatment when water does not speedily bead up and roll off a boot's surface, allowing water to sink into the exterior layer.
Q: My boots look wet. Are they leaking?
A: In almost every case, no. If water is not beading up on the uppers, it means the durable water repellent (DWR) finish has deteriorated due to dirt, abrasion and sun exposure. When that occurs, moisture can seep into the exterior layer of the uppers causing them to feel wet and heavy. A boot would have to be saturated, though, before moisture soaked through the upper.
Q: My waterproof Gore-Tex boots look wet. Are they malfunctioning?
A: No. Boots equipped with a waterproof/breathable membrane (and most use Gore-Tex® membranes) do not allow water to penetrate to the interior unless the membrane itself has been damaged. The solution for wet boots, whether equipped with waterproof/breathable membranes or not, is the same: Revive water repellency by applying a waterproofing product designed for footwear.
Q: When the DWR finish on boots needs to be restored, what waterproofing product should I apply?
A: Your decision depends on the material used in the uppers of your boots and what brand appeals to you.
Material: Some brands make specific products for particular boot materials....

I have been to Italy in April, it was cool and breezy and we had a some rain in the Cinque Terre, but honestly I did not feel I needed boots. We live in the middle part of California and have had a pretty warm winter, I am going to Italy mid May and have realized that lighter shoes would probably be better. It is very hard to get the feeling of the weather when you are living in a colder wetter climate. Italy is kind of like Central California with more humidity.

From the RS preplanning booklet: "two sturdy, comfortable and well broken in shoes (spray with waterproofing. Sports sandals are a good back-up."

It seemed like most of the time would be spent in the cities, with only a day or two in the mountains or wilderness.

So I thought that street shoes (Nike, Adidas, Fila...) with good soles would be adequate.

I typically go the gym 4-5 times a week and am in pretty good physical condition, except for chronic feet/ankle/knee pain, which is not severe enough to be "debilitating." But being one's feet the whole time for several hours is difficult for me. But only half the time is organized, the rest is left free, as I understand.

I always take just one pair that are waterproof, breathe well enough, look good enough to go out to dinner but are good for walking long distances. I have a pair of Clarks sport shoes that are fantastic :)

Could you tell me model of Clark sports shoes you have?

Having been to them, I know there are Walking Company stores in Seattle. Find one and try on some of their Abeo options.

Yes, there is one right in downtown Seattle. Will go tomorrow.