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Food Safety in Italy

Does anyone know if and how food safety is regulated in Italy? Or if markets and restaurants have health dept. ratings like in the US? My husband has immune issues and is very susceptible to food borne bacteria. I read a web article about foods to never eat when you're traveling abroad (due to high rates of food borne illnesses), but with no mention of particular countries, I couldn't tell whether they meant anywhere in ALL countries (which I cannot imagine!) or in the jungles or favelas or what! We'll be living in Rome-Florence-Venice for three months next year and my husband is nervous about food safety. Any help would be appreciated. THANKS!

Posted by
8889 posts

Stop worrying. Italy, and all other EU countries, are very strict on food safety.
European countries consider their standards of food safety above the USA, that is why there are problems importing some foods from the USA which are legal there but do not correspond to EU standards (hormones, genetically modified etc.).

Posted by
32173 posts

Susan,

Not related to food safety, but be sure your three month stay in Italy doesn't exceed 90 days.

Posted by
9462 posts

Italians take a lot more pride in preparing their food and what they eat than we Americans do, that's for sure.

Echoing Ken, if you are staying approximately three months, make sure that you have the proper visa or that you are not exceeding the Schengen convention's rule that you can not stay in any Schengen country (of which Italy is one) more than 90 days out of any 180. You can search on this forum for other threads, or Google the principle.

Posted by
7981 posts

Eating in restaurants is risky anywhere in the world. I have observed in Rome a well known restaurant recycling food off dirty plates coming back to the kitchen. e.g. prosciutto not eaten on a prosciutto/melone plate being put out on the next plate going out. e.g. olive pits being scooped out of a bowl of olives coming back from a table being scooped out and the olives being returned to the common olive jug. It is quite routine for bread to be recycled with a bread basket being topped up and sent back to another table although it may have been handled by previous customers.

If I were immune compromised I would order things that are hot e.g. pizza from the oven or other well cooked hot items and would also stay in an apartment where I could prepare my own food.

Posted by
23178 posts

Eating in restaurants is risky anywhere in the world. Come on, don't you think that is a little bombastic. I mean, if it was serious problem you would have a lot people getting sick. And that is rarely report by anyone. We have spent nearly a year in Europe over the past 20 years. Only once had a food problem and that was a German restaurant in Munich. A little tough for a couple of days. But we have had several bouts in the US over time. Personally don't think there is much difference between here and there.

Posted by
8293 posts

Jane travels, unless you were an employee working in the kitchen, how did you see what happened to the plates after they were cleared from the customers' table? Inquiring minds and all that ....

Posted by
712 posts

The best way to handle your fears, whether in Italy or anyway, would be to prepare your food yourself. You can control if it washed properly and cooked properly and under proper sanitation. I don't blame you for being extra cautious considering your husband's situation, and it is true that different cultures may have differing standards as far as what we Americans may view as "proper regulations". For example, not all people wear gloves when handling food. Some products (like marinated olives) may sit in the open uncovered. For someone with immune issues, this may cause a problem. But the facts do speak for themselves: there would be huge outcries regarding food related illnesses if it was a problem. I have never gotten sick from food in Europe, and like the other poster, I have spent over a year there in the past 6 years, including 6 months total in Italy. Actually, my illness comes when I get back home and eat processed food again - blah!!!!!!!

Posted by
7453 posts

To bring it back to your original question, I would exercise the same precautions you would in the US. Your biggest issue is food handling and holding. Focus on hot foods, from markets find a wash to use to clean vege's and fruits, Generally in restaurants, if the food is made to order or hot on arrival, a good sign. You will need to decide your own tolerance for cured meats and funky cheeses.

But in General, should be no different than in the US.

Posted by
2111 posts

Susan,
I would check with your husband's doctor (or better yet, a dietician that specializes in whatever immune issue your husband has). When my husband was undergoing chemotherapy, I was extremely careful with ANY food he ate.

Likely the article you read is applicable to ANY country, including the US, but with greater risks in third world countries or places where the water supply is not as pure as it is generally in our country. But, with global import/exports, I would guess that even Italy imports foods from some of the same places our country and other countries import food. If you are eating strawberries in November in Rome, likely they were imported from somewhere else, etc. etc.

I think if you follow the cooked well, peel it (if fruit/veg), avoid any buffets or unwrapped food that is out in a grocery for public to help themselves (steam trays or bakery), avoid honey, and avoid any luncheon meats, as well as practicing very careful sanitation of shared serving utensils (if eating out), he would likely be okay. Certain cheeses likely should be avoided. But, even with the absolute best restaurant rating, when my husband's immune system was compromised, we still avoided salads in restaurants and all cold cuts (grocery or restaurant). In fact, the only salads he had during that time were made with lettuces/vegs from my personal garden!

But, like I say, check with a dietician who specializes in his condition, as they will likely give you much better advice than your husband's doctor (from personal experience).
But, as many others have said, it will likely be no different that the US, and you can likely take the same precautions as you do in the US. Best to cook/prepare the food yourself, though, for the best guarantees.

I'm guessing strawberries, grapes, certain seafood (and of course sushi), luncheon meats, mayonnaise, custards, yogurts, certain ice creams, and any dishes made with eggs that are not thoroughly cooked are at the top of the list in the article you read.

Just the flight over would give me some cause for pause, if air borne viruses or surface bacteria could affect his immune system. But, likely his system may not be as compromised as my husband's was when his neurophils readings dropped dangerously low for several days after each chemo treatment.

Below is a chart (while advised for cancer patients) that might be helpful for general guidelines), but I personally think that for an person who is extremely immune compromised, the chart is rather liberal:

http://www.cancer.org/treatment/survivorshipduringandaftertreatment/nutritionforpeoplewithcancer/nutritionforthepersonwithcancer/nutrition-during-treatment-weak-immune-system

Safe, happy, and healthy travels. With proper precautions (and you are to be commended for doing your homework on this), he'll have a wonderful time traveling as far as food goes.

Posted by
2261 posts

"Eating in restaurants is risky anywhere in the world."

I suspect that Janet's point here is the same as Monique's, that the safest way is to prepare your own food. As has been stated, freshly prepared and hot is a good start. I might also suggest ordering a'la carte, or whatever the Italian is…instead of ordering plates with four or five different items on it. Keep it simple, and segregated.

Posted by
7181 posts

Without going crazy about it, I do think that it's fair to say that some restaurants in some cities are less careful about maintaining the temperature of already-prepared food that's held near, say, a tapas bar. In New York, the Health Department is famous for savage use of thermometers. I certainly have seen pre-made sandwiches left in unrefrigerated cases in Paris, Rome, Florence, and London. (I've eaten it in all those places, when I'm in a hurry and not looking for fine food.) Although U.S. food is not "better", this sandwich practice is simply uncommon, anyplace I've been in the U.S.

On the plus side, a sit-down meal in Europe (that is, not a pre-made sandwich on a tourist street ... ) is much more likely to be made from scratch and cooked fresh for you than it is in the United States.

I think your husband is suffering a bit from the internet stories about " ... a friend of my sister-in-law's nanny ..... [insert horrible story] " If he has a chronic health condition, he needs to take charge of his life and avoid pre-made food sitting in glass cases with no refrigeration! BTW, I know a few people who got sick from R-O-S grill carts in my own Manhattan, so I don't eat at them. And they are also ruthlessly inspected.

Posted by
5835 posts

In New York, the Health Department is famous for savage use of thermometers.

The Chinese Roast Duck Bureaucracy story is an interesting case. The ducks failed the temperature rules but nobody seemed to gets sick eating the ducks.
http://opencitymag.com/the-roast-duck-bureaucracy/

The cooks at these restaurants refused to keep the ducks at 140
degrees lest it dry out the meat. Restaurants complained to the
community board, and the community board complained to the department.
The dispute dragged on for years. Finally, the department sponsored a
study on the ducks, and found that the method by which they were made
was, as Kerwyn Mark put it, “pretty much foolproof.”

“The fact of the matter is that they cook the crap out of it, the skin
is dry, they baste it when it’s up on the thing so there’s very little
water activity, and the stuff underneath has been killed pretty good,”
said Dave Arnold, a food science writer who owns Booker and Dax, a
food and drink research lab, on Eldridge Street.

Posted by
15043 posts

All I can tell you is that restaurants in Italy are held at much stricter standards than in the U.S.. And that is based on what many friends told me who have run restaurants in both California and Italy (Tuscany to be exact). I've lived half of my life there and the other half in the U.S. (And traveled to Italy yearly during that half), and I have been food poisoned by restaurants only a handful of times, all of them in the U.S. and once in Santorini (Greece).
Having said this, nobody can guarantee you of any restaurant anywhere. If that is a big concern of yours, cooking your own food in an apartment might be the best option. Supermarkets are held at even higher standards than restaurants.

Posted by
11613 posts

To echo Roberto's statement about grocery stores, if you buy from the prepared foods counter, you will get each item packaged separately (I tried to put together a mixed antipasto in one container, every item was the same unit price). I asked the counter-person why and she said it's the law, to avoid cross-contamination.

Posted by
506 posts

All my trips to Europe I only had food poisoning once and that was Pesto in the Cinque Terre. Also I know most people drink the tap water but I have a touchy system and always buy bottled water and that has always worked good for me.

Posted by
7981 posts

Anywhere in the world includes the US. And there are Hep A outbreaks from time to time in the US as well as elsewhere. Most food born illness is not traced. You get sick on a trip with GI flu it could be the door handle of the restroom, or the seat on the plane where the last passenger was sick, or the dirty hands of the food prep person. The epidemics on cruise ships are not unique -- they are just contained and so the cruise hygiene gets blamed -- the same kinds of bugs are spread everywhere, just not traceably so.

As to the restaurant recycling. Anyone with any observation capacities at all knows that in Italy it is customary to recycle bread baskets-- you can see this if you look almost anywhere. You should just assume it is the norm.

In the specific case of recycling food (which I hope is not widespread) I stood next to the area where the plates for appetizers were being returned to the kitchen and were being sent out. It was near the Captains stand who was directing groups to tables. There was a huge waiting list for tables and locals were being privileged so I thought my family had better odds of getting a table if I stayed visible. This was near a sort of open kitchen area where the appetizers were assembled and sent out to tables. I saw the appetizer bowls being sent out and returned. I saw the dirty pits scooped out of bowls returning from tables and the remaining olives returned to the cask of fresh olives. I saw prosciutto being stripped from plates and being used on new plates going out. This was a well known restaurant with a reputation for its wonderful generous appetizer service. It was obviously their practice to mix spit.

The only illness we can trace to food was an incident of food poisoning my husband had as a the result of a salad composee in Paris; it was classic right down to the timing. Any other illnesses we have had traveling were of the 'who knows where we got it' variety but then we are also not immunocompromised like the OP is.

As I said, if I were immuno compromised I would be careful about what I ordered and order hot foods (I remember reading a study about food born illness in Mexico where people who ordered hand assembled items like tacos had a much higher illness of travelers diarrhea than people who ordered baked items that didn't have ingredients handled after cooking) When I worked in the middle east I stayed at a posh hotels and those beautiful salads sure did look familiar coming out on the buffet night after night. Maybe they threw yesterday's salad away and these were new -- but maybe not. I couldn't afford illness with a heavy work schedule that involved public presentations and so stuck to the roasted, baked, hot items which were very tasty and I was fine.

Posted by
5835 posts

CDC recommends for immune compromised travelers to Italy:
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/destinations/traveler/chronic.immune_compromised/italy?s_cid=ncezid-dgmq-travel-single-001

Hepatitis A

Hepatitis A outbreaks occur throughout the world and sometimes in countries with a low risk for hepatitis A (including the US). You can get hepatitis A through contaminated food or water in Italy, so talk to your doctor to see if the hepatitis A vaccine is right for you.

Immune-Compromised Travelers

Talk to your doctor about whether you should get a dose of immunoglobulin before your trip, in addition to hepatitis A vaccine.

Reduce your exposure to germs

Follow these tips to avoid getting sick or spreading illness to others while traveling:

Wash your hands often, especially before eating.
If soap and water aren’t available, clean hands with hand sanitizer (containing at least 60% alcohol).
Don’t touch your eyes, nose, or mouth. If you need to touch your face, make sure your hands are clean.
Cover your mouth and nose with a tissue or your sleeve (not your hands) when coughing or sneezing.
Try to avoid contact with people who are sick.
If you are sick, stay home or in your hotel room, unless you need medical care.
Immune-Compromised Travelers

Keeping your hands clean is the best way for people with compromised immune systems to avoid getting travelers’ diarrhea. Wash your hands often, especially before eating and after touching surfaces that other people have touched (such as door handles and stair rails).

Immune-Compromised Travelers

When changing time zones, take medicine according to time between doses, rather than time of day. Set an alarm to help remind you when to take your medicine.
Develop a plan for how to manage minor health problems or flare-ups of your underlying condition during your trip.

Posted by
254 posts

I ignored this post when it first came out. But we arrived in Venice on May 6 and ate our first dinner out at a small place recommended by RS. There was a dog sleeping on a mat in the entrance to the kitchen. Staff had to step over or around it every time they entered or exited kitchen. Must have been OK with management because the dog didn't move in 2 hours and we heard one staffer mutter in English "I'm gonna shoot that (expletive deleted) dog". We have never seen such in the US. Makes us wonder what health regs are in Italy.

Posted by
8293 posts

If you disapprove of dogs in restaurants ( see post above) don't go to France. It is quite the usual thing for patrons to take their dogs into restaurants. The animals are always well behaved and lie peacefully under the table while the owners dine.

Posted by
4138 posts

The same goes for Germany.

And if you are in Istanbul or Greece, you are likely to see lots of street dogs and cats around. They are not exactly feral and the dogs at least are usually spayed or neutered and have their shots. They are fed by the locals and we saw no skinny or sick-looking dogs or cats. We experienced lots of cat begging in Istanbul and one occurrence of dog begging near the ferry dock for Chania. I have a very cute picture of a kitten selecting my husband to cuddle up next to while he was sitting near the Spice Market. Of course he couldn't resist petting it.

I'm not sure where you live, but here in Tucson, many restaurants have outdoor eating areas and dogs are allowed in many of them.

Frankly, I think you are more likely to get gut issues anywhere from touching things others have touched than from an occasional dog or cat hanging around.

Posted by
712 posts

There was a dog in a cafe in Florence that had an "accident" right on the floor. There are just some things you should not see while eating, even if it is a coffee and small pastry. I personally feel that animals and food should never mix, even if I am a dinner guest of someone who has a pet. But people have pets in their kitchens at home all the time. Of course, cooking for family at home should not have the same regulations as cooking for the public masses, but I have to view it that way to not freak myself out when dining out in Europe and there is a pet nearby.

Posted by
527 posts

I love to see dogs in restaurants. As a matter of fact we have been to Austria and Northern Italy 3 times with our Jack Russell and he was welcomed in every restaurant,, cafe, and coffehouse we went to. Beats the hell out of a squalling child IMHO.:-)

I never have had any issues with food in Italy or Austria, as a few posters have mentioned, the EU standards are far above the USA.

Posted by
8293 posts

We were joined at our table by the resident cat in a restaurant in Lyon once. He sat quietly on a chair and agreed to accept a few titbits from us. The funny thing was when my friend and I were peering into the restaurant to see if it was open, two French women came along and had a look, too. One sniffed and said (in French, of course) "There's no one in the place, not even a cat."

Posted by
4138 posts

Cats and dogs can be "resident" in B&B's and small hotels, too. We have encountered them in many countries, much to our delight. I guess it might freak out those who do not regularly live with pets, but fairly recent research indicates that kids raised with dogs in the house have stronger immune systems.

Susan, I would like to know what that "article about foods never to eat when you're traveling abroad" is, if you have the link. I Googled "foods not to eat while traveling" and got many results, but I'd particularly like to read the one you referenced in your post.