Fluent Forever: How to Learn Any Language Fast and Never Forget It - The Book

cr,

I've never read the book, but it seems to get mostly good reviews on Amazon. It seems to focus on the theory of learning a language, rather than learning any particular language, so you'd probably still have to buy language-specific learning materials.

I find that the Pimsleur language system works best for me. I've looked at Rosetta Stone but it seems too expensive and relies on sitting in front of the computer, a method which doesn't work for me.

IMHO, don't get your hopes up. I'm very good with languages and have learned French and Portugese. But after 3 college semesters of Italian with an excellent professor(essa), plus regular reading in Italian, plus nearing completion of the Italian Duo Lingo program and having lunch twice a month with Italian-speaking Italians and Americans (no English allowed) I feel as if I've barely scratched the surface of this gorgeous but sometimes grammatically complex language. I hope to live long enough to confidently say that IO PARLO ITALIANO! Mr. Wyner doesn't tell the truth when he uses fluent and fast in the same sentence! Buona fortuna a te!!

I've read his book and he does incorporate a lot of the most recent findings about learning that I've read elsewhere such as spaced repetition, not learning words by themes because they interfere with one another, etc.

He has a forum that you might want to post on, there is also an interesting site at http://www.forum.language-learners.org/ But I'll say this; I haven't run across anyone who says "yep, used his method, now I'm fluent". The same with just about any other method.

I don't want to sound discouraging, a method that works is a method you believe in and spend the time following. You'll certainly be much farther along if you try something, anything really, than if you don't. And Italians are appreciative of efforts to speak their language. But if you think this is going to be a magical method that brings gains that nobody else in human history has been able to achieve, it might be expecting to much ;-)

I bought this book in February 2015 and used its methods to prepare for a September 2015 trip to Italy, after a stint with the Rocket Languages program proved unproductive. I thought many aspects of the book's methods were useful - the Anki flash card program he suggests in particular. However, I found it extremely time-consuming, stronger for vocabulary than for grammar, and it didn't prepare me to understand the language spoken back to me at all. If I had it to do over again, I would have used the flash card methods he suggests, but focused on survival Italian. I think the method was fast for the author because he has extraordinarily high aptitude for language learning. For the rest of us, it's just a long, slow slog, whatever method is chosen.

I used Rosetta Stone and was very successful with it. My hubby bought it for me for my birthday. I got all 5 levels, but only made it through 3, with a start on 4, then it just got too difficult for me. Getting through 1-3 levels though taught me enough vocabulary that I was comfortable listening and understanding (mostly) what was being said to me and I could reply in simple sentences.

Example. I used my Rosetta Stone Italian at a ceramics shop in Assisi. the owner asked me where I learned my Italian and I told him, "on the computer" He said he has friends that studied in college and didn't understand, or speak as well as I did.

Example. Took my daughter to Florence for a quick vacation, we checked into our hotel in the city and the front desk/owner spoke only in Italian to me, and I understood, and replied. When we walked away to our room, my daughter told me that not ONE word of English was used in the exchange. I hadn't even realized that!

Learning from reading books is OK, but interactive is best. I for one, really like Rosetta Stone, it works for ME. That said, I wouldn't invest in all 5 levels again if I'm only using the language for travel, 1-3 would cover enough to understand, communicate on a basic level. Thinking about getting French next to brush up on my high school learning (45 years ago) and to prep for a vacation in France in the fall.

Thanks for all the commments!

I understand that this won't be a magical transformation, and I don't expect fluency in the short time that I have to study. I am really just looking to be able to communicate on a somewhat basic level.

It's always going to be work to learn any language, but this seemed like it might stick with me a little better, and be a more fun way to learn.

I wouldn't mind trying the Rosetta Stone method, but it seems a little expensive.

Another thought.........have you considered Rick's Italian Phrase Book? It's excellent and will get you through the majority of conversations you might need help on, unless you are really in the backwaters/small villages with few tourists. In the most visited places there are so many English speakers living there that language won't be a problem. I also liked Roberto's post on this topic several months ago, noting that a huge number of workers (restaurants, bars, markets, etc.) are immigrants so one would be just as well to learn Albanian or Farsi as to learn Italian!!

I understand that this won't be a magical transformation, and I don't expect fluency in the short time that I have to study. I am really just looking to be able to communicate on a somewhat basic level.

Ok, let me suggest this. Start with Pimsleur levels I and II if you can find them at a local library. They are too expensive to be worth buying, IMHO. These use the spaced repetition method (eg. ask you to respond with something you just heard, then progressively stretch out the time you are asked to recall it, just like Anki or any other SRS does). They say do each lesson once, I found I got more when I did the lesson once in the morning and again in the evening. Progress is kinda slow for the time invested, so I wouldn't go past the 1st 2 sets. But what you have learned, you will know and effortlessly recall instead of having to flip thru a phrasebook.

Next, get the Michel Thomas Italian. They keep repackaging the series (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michel_Thomas_Method#French.2C_German.2C_Italian.2C_and_Spanish ) but what you want is the set covering the 1st 8 hours or so. Similar in some ways to Pimsleur, it takes you a lot farther in terms of being able to express thoughts and ask for things although it is skimpy on vocabulary.

After this you can go on and use the advice from Wyner's book, but I think the approach above gives you a reasonable base. After doing this we were able to travel on the Adriatic side of Italy, where English is not common, and get by (eg. rent hotel rooms, basic transactions in stores and restaurants, etc).

My experience has been that at this level communication is more one-way. You can ask for things and people will understand, but responses spoken at normal speed are hard to understand and any real conversation is impossible because you don't have the vocabulary of even a toddler, nor can you parse the words to even find the ones you know. This may sound discouraging, so I want to make clear I'm not saying its not worth trying, not at all, but getting by is different from being a temporary part of the community and chatting with local folks,with the merchants at the farmers markets, etc.

Susan, I actually already bought Rick's phrase book. So I am going to be using that as well.

John, that makes sense. I'll check it out.

Thanks!

I also suggest hunting around to see if there is any beginner Italian class in your area. I am using a combination of Duolingo on my phone, Rick Steve's phrasebook, and a once-weekly class where we have to converse with a partner. I will never be fluent, but the class is really helpful and everyone in it is a baby boomer like me so we all support and encourage each other.
Cynthia

Not to throw a wet rag on a well-meaning effort but no language book or CD course is going to make anyone fluent in a language that they don't speak conversationally with locals every day. I have a sister who has a BA in Spanish who found out in a hurry that she needed a lot more work when confronted with ordinary conversation in Spain. Being able to 'hear' local speech - at rapid delivery - is as important as what you know how to speak yourself. It's what John stated above:

"but responses spoken at normal speed are hard to understand and any real conversation is impossible because you don't have the vocabulary of even a toddler, nor can you parse the words to find even the ones you know"

Just thought I'd mention it as I see many individuals trying to 'learn' Italian (or other language) before a trip. It's great to learn the 'manner' phrases, highly recommended, but I wouldn't expect any sort or fluency from a course unless you dealt with Italian - from Italians - every day for a long period of time.

I am not very fluent in languages and I have formally studied only my own (Italian) and English - this one not even with good teachers. But what I found, full and long immersions in a language move something in my head - something gets moving after two weeks, but three weeks are really needed to break the ice. So I managed to learn some German, including understanding answers, without a single minute of formal training but mainly with a one-month job, followed by many holidays in Austria and reading a lot of German music scores. Even keeping the TV on with news in German helps. - The same way I got a little Spanish and a bit of French. - After the three weeks mark even spoken Chinese and Japanese (of course not the written languages needing years also for natives) began to make a little sense to me and probably in a further couple of weeks I would have begun speaking. But I find very difficult to learn a language from formal tuition.

Ditto for Pimsleur. I have used it for basic German and Italian. Our local library had them and I listened to the CDs while commuting to work. For what it's worth, my goal is not to be fluent, or even to carry on an extended conversation; rather, my goal is to be able to communicate with the basics in their own language. My experience has been that native speakers truly appreciate your efforts in trying to speak their language. And, most of them speak English when you run into difficulties. The RS guides always have a section with survival phrases--I copy the page, take it to the local office supply store, and get it laminated to use on my travels.

Download onto your smartphone: Duolingo app.
Excellent way to learn a foreign language.

Also download Google Translate. Pointing your smartphone at something that needs translating, it will translate (as in a menu, sign, etc.) into whatever language you desire.