Florence 4 nights including a day trip to Milan, Rome 5 nights. ("Staying 3 nights in Venice")

If you can get tickets for the Last Supper, I would stay one less day in Florence and stay a night in Milan between Florence and Venice.

Milan is not a practical 'day trip' from Florence. You are not really loosing any time in Florence by doing this ( i.e. staying a night in Milan) as you would be gone ALL day anyway to do a 'day trip'. Also save a bit of train fare as well.

EDIT-- with the number of days you have Rome, the items on your wish list look easily manageable. Florence is definitely busier.
You may want to consider 4 nights each in Rome and Florence and 1 in Milan

hey ed & evelyn
have you booked your flights? you could do multi-city, fly to milan and out of rome. saves time, train fare and backtracking, spend night in milan see the last supper, take the train to venice. what are your dates? are you wanting hotels or apartments for your stays in florence and rome? check booking.com with your filters and areas or cross-pollinate.com has apartments in both cities. one bedroom, one bath with small kitchen, living room, balcony to sit with your glass of wine or coffee and watch the world go by, some have a washer, lifts/elevators, $$. read fine print and reviews. up to individual decision, we like apartments, fill fridge with drinks, fruit, deli foods buy breakfast stuff and don't have to eat out everyday, can just relax. you have your other post too. keep your eye on the last supper tickets when available and book it, they go fast.
have a map with all your wants marked and see what's in same area and see those, buy your tickets ahead of time. lots of research but these posters here will guide you through.
aloha

On Florence: 4 nights is usually thought to equal 3 days. Plus you want one for a trip to Milan. I don’t see how you can squeeze all you want to see into the 2 days in Florence. At least, you need to set priorities. In my view, a better plan would be to cut out the trip to Milan.

I'd absolutely cut the day trip to Milan. Your 4 nights in Florence come down to 3.5 days of sightseeing after you subtract travel time from either Venice or Rome. You will need most of it to accomplish your list. In what order are you doing these cities, and which are you flying in and out of?

Rome looks OK: you should have 4.5 days of sightseeing with 5 hotel nights. "Must Sees" are up to personal discretion but you can definitely fit more into your itinerary there. The Vatican (St Peter's, Vatican Museums/Sistine) will take the better part of one day. The Sistine, BTW, is IN the Vatican Museums. Colosseum'Forum/Palatine is the better part of another day, and I'd add the Pantheon to this day as well. The Borghese is a 2-hour visit - the amount of time you are allotted - plus time to get to the museum.

A good guidebook will help you determine what else in Rome may be of interest. I could, say. send you to great churches and their artwork/architecture all day long but if those aren't your thing, then that's not helpful? Same with a long walk on the Appian Antica: that's been was our favorite day in Rome so far but it takes some interest in Roman ruins and the willingness to do some homework prior to taking it on.

You haven't mentioned any of the major piazzas - Navona, del Popolo, Santa Maria in Trastevere, Campo de’ Fiori... - so I'd add some of those in en route between your listed attractions.

It looks like we are going to revise our itinerary, we also want to be able to enjoy our visit to Italy and not be rushed doing it.
We have already booked our hotel in Venice, so flying into Milan will not work.

We are open to anymore suggestions that will help us on this trip.

Have you booked your flights ? If so, what are they?

Knowing what the 'fixed' point and dates are can help in giving advice on the most efficient routing to get you to where you want to go

hey ed & evelyn
happy memorial day
are you locked in with venice hotel or you have free cancellation? let this forum know your dates so we can advise you. you can fly into milan, spend a night see the last supper and train to venice and continue on your trip. watch your arrival and departure times as not too early or late to arrive at airport or hotel/apartments.
aloha

We are locked in to the hotel in Venice. We fly in the first week of Oct and depart the third week. I think that we will have to take Rosalyn and Kathy's advice and not do Milan on this trip. That would give us an excuse to visit Italy a second time.

Any ideas of day trips that we could easily do in a day from Florence or Rome? My wife would like to visit wineries and I like visiting with the locals.

Joe,
We fly in to Venice the first week of Oct and depart Rome the third week. We have decided to not do Milan on this trip. We are looking to train it to Florence and then to Rome after reading a few posts.
Any guidance that you can give us on hotels in Florence and Rome will be greatly appreciated.

hey ed & evelyn
are you still looking for places to stay? don't know if you looked at casa rabatti (san zanobi) in Florence, it's an apt on ground floor near train station. some amenities and a place to sit and relax, plus thought in was the $$ range.
saw a couple places in rome that may interest you:
pettinaryvillage.com near the piazza navona and campo de fiori.
cancelleridieci,com also near piazza navona.
and now I'm gonna throw something off the wall at you,
olivetreehill.com it's out in the countryside of rome, 30 minute train ride. some friends of friends stayed there and loved it. a total different experience. a couple own it and wanted to live simple life. they take you on excursions, wine tasting, cooking class. just read up an all they offer, if interested.
I know there will be all kinds opinions or offers out there, so I just put in my 3 cents :)
if something you see and like just call or email them. I will send you some other thingd later. happy travels GO WARRIORS!
aloha

Hey, your 3 cents mean a lot. We are going to start looking for a place starting tomorrow, and will look at the places that you suggested. I need to get moving on hotels, train tickets from Venice to Florence to Rome and the Firenze card to mention a few, before you know it October will be here.

Can we get some info on Gondola rides in Venice? That is a must do for my wife.

Ed: As far a riding gondolas in Venice; you can just walk up to any Gondola "Station" or dock, and negotiate with the gondolier of the one you like the look of.

Or, what we did was pre -book a walking tour with Viator, which was very informative and interesting, and at the end of it was a 20 minute gondola ride, which; after walking around in the heat for an hour and a half, was very welcome!
I think we paid about $60 for the tour with the gondola included.
You can find it on the Viator website.

Thank you, a tour and a gondola ride sounds like a good plan. I will check the website.

hi ed & evelyn
gondolas are set prices by the "big wigs", and not negotiable. can have you go overboard and evelyn doesn't know to laugh , cry or scream! i'll send you a link this afternoon to one we used, set up a date and we met him in the jewish ghetto plaza in cannareggio and he can serenade the both of you.l
aloha

Evelyn will probably laugh. Thanks, you are the greatest.

hey ed
evelyn is my kinda gal. she'll throw you a lifesaver, inflatable mermaid or a doggie paddle and meet you at the bar with her glass of wine or two.
i would stay away from viator, it's a third party consolidator. we reserved luca (luckyluca6@hotmail.com). have your date, time, how long and he will get back to you. before 7pm is 80euros for 30 minutes, after 7pm is 100euros for 35 minutes. there is other time limits he will let you know and where he goes. he will sing to you two just ask him. look up on youtube.com (luca and the gondola in search) and it shows you him. if an early gondola ride, i had a tote bag with a bottle of wine or prosecco, corkscrew, plastic glasses and we celebrated. if an early ride check out cicchetti.it and do a crawl with local guide and learn about venice, just email him.
I'm just trying to keep in contact with my family about the volcano eruption and lava flow. yes i'm from there and it's getting to be like the wild wild west with neighbors nerves razzled, and guns drawn. it's an OMG moment so let's call in Dog the Bounty Hunter and Beth or Steve Mc Garrett and Book'em Dano. Madame Pele, goddess of fire, has blown her top and mad. was there for 1990 eruption and lava flow through Kalapana but this flow and eruption just doesn't want to end. People staying till surrounded by it and will call the helicopters to save them or tourists crossing security lines to get up close and personal get are arrested. It's crazy, get out!!! anyway hope this helps, any other questions just ask.
aloha

Princess pupule, Hope all goes well with the family. Will try to get in touch with luca.

I've been to Italy 3 times and have never felt the need to go to Milan because it is my understanding that the Last Supper is in poor shape since Da Vinci used a non-durable experimental technique to paint it. It's a long day but Pompeii is doable as a day trip from Rome. You can get a bus tour that includes a drive on Amalfi coast, or when we went, Enjoy Rome had a bus just to Pompeii for the day. Sienna is a good day trip from Florence.

Thanks Cala, we have decided to skip Milan.

Thanks to all for all the great info.

We are looking at "Absolute Italy" they offer Rome City Tours, St Peter's Basilica and the Sistine Chapel, with reserved entrance. They also have a Private Vatican Tour which includes the Vatican Museums. They all have a private guide.
We have not checked on prices yet. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

We would also like to do a walking tour of Rome. Should we try to book something in the states or Rome?

We are looking at "Absolute Italy" they offer Rome City Tours, St
Peter's Basilica and the Sistine Chapel, with reserved entrance. They
also have a Private Vatican Tour which includes the Vatican Museums.
They all have a private guide.

Ed and Evelyn, the Sistine chapel is IN the Vatican Museums so you do not need a separate tour for that. I'm uncertain what you mean by a "private guide" but unless you are with a small group, a truly "private" guide - no other people along at all - is very expensive. I'm concerned with the text on the tour site you're looking at which states, " Our special relationship with the Vatican enables us to reserve your entrance to avoid waiting in the immense lines that one finds most of the year." Those lines are avoidable with ANY pre-booked tour, including those offered by the Vatican itself. In all cases you will have to go through a security check but that line moves quickly: it's the TICKET line that is so long.

The other thing you need to consider is the mass of humanity in the Sistine during high and shoulder seasons. NO guide, private other otherwise, is going to be able to circumvent that during regular hours. The only way to see it without the mob is to book a tour which allows entry BEFORE the general public. There are multiple options for that including the Vatican's "breakfast" entry and Walks of Italy's "Pristine Sistine" tour (very highly rated by RS posters who've done it). One other way is to book tickets for Fridays night late openings during the summer, either with a Vatican-offered tour or independently. Some links to explore:

http://www.museivaticani.va/content/museivaticani/en/visita-i-musei/scegli-la-visita/musei-e-collezioni/colazione-ai-musei-vaticani.html

http://www.museivaticani.va/content/museivaticani/en/visita-i-musei/scegli-la-visita/musei-e-collezioni/musei-vaticani-e-cappella-sistina.html

https://www.walksofitaly.com/vatican-tours/pristine-sistine-chapel-tour

This is a very highly-rated early-entrance tour as well:
https://theromanguy.com/tours/Rome/Sistine-Chapel-Vatican-Tour

Thanks Kathy, the words "very expensive" always gets my attention. We are going to explore the links that you sent.

You're welcome! And to clarify, one person's "very expensive" might be peanuts to another so it's all relative?

To give you an idea, I punched up the Vatican's 3-hour Museums/St Peter's tour with "exclusive guide" for 2 adults on a random date/time and it gave me a price of 345,00 € ($399.45 U.S. in today's exchange) with the 300,00 € guide's fee paid in advance. That would be a pretty big "Ouch!" for us but maybe not for you?

Private tours can get down to more manageable rates when the guide's fee is averaged over larger groups - such as a family of, say, 8 or 10 - but when two people have to carry the weight alone, well, you get the idea?

If you’re that interested in Renaissance art I think the Firenze Card is the way to go (72 sites, 72 hours, 72 Euro). Plenty to do and see in three days, especially if you do not go to Siena, which we felt was very comparable to Florence. I would recommend Montepulciano in between Florence and Rome. It’s very doable by bus, train and/or car, and made a great base for exploring the Val d’Orcia. We found the small towns in Italy to be much more enjoyable overall than the big cities. I highly recommend making time for a smaller town like Montepulciano.

Note that the Firenze Card is now €85; however, the admission prices of some of the big museums it covers have also gone up.

Kathy, that is a very big "Ouch" that we are not going to undertake. We are going to definitely book one of the
tours that you suggested. We are leaning towards the Pristine Sistine or the Roman Guy tour. We are still
looking for decent $ or $$ hotel in Florence.

afranke77 - We are going to make time to explore either between Florence and Rome or once we get to Rome.

The Firenze Card looks like it can be a good deal if you use it to your advantage even thought the price has gone up.

Your trip is shaping up nicely. When you do go to Milan on your next trip to Italy, get your tickets for the Last Supper well ahead of time. We have seen it twice and it ranks among our all time favorite travel highlights, along with seeing Michelangelo's “David” in L’Accademia in Florence. Milan combines well with the Italian Lakes and Switzerland.

Suki, thank you for your vote of confidence. We still have a lot of things to get done, hotel reservations in Florence and Rome, museum tickets, train tickets, ect. but no matter what surprise pops up on this trip, we are going to have a good time.

You'd mentioned earlier that you needed to "get moving" on the Firenze Card? No need to do that in advance of the trip: just buy them when you get to Florence. There a list of places you can do that on the website:

http://www.firenzecard.it/index.php?option=com_cardfi253_panel&view=vistas&task=acquistacard&Itemid=262&lang=en

Just don't try to do it at one of the busiest attractions. :O)

Posters who advice against doing a day trip on a 3.5 days stay in Florence are wise. But, just for the record, with high speed trains a day trip from Florence to Milan is absolutely feasible. In a few cases of business meetings I have managed to leave Florence at 7am, have a meeting in Milan at 10am and be back in Florence at 2.30pm, just in time for a late lunch. Of course you can take it easier.

lachera, thanks for the info but we have decided to skip Milan this trip. If and when we return, we are going to
make it a point of spending a couple of days there.

Thanks Kathy, buying the Firenzy card after we arrive in Florence is what we will do. (Thanks for the link.)

Hi again, trying to choose a good neighborhood and hotel in Rome. $$ to $$$. We have been looking through
RS Best of Italy Book and most of the hotels are booked in October. So far Hotel Raffaello close to the Termini
Station is the only one that has availability. Has anybody stayed there? Would you folks have any other suggestions?

To give hotel recommendations, we need a price range in euros. "$$ to $$$" will mean different things to different people.

Hi Harold, we are looking at between 125 Euros and 200 Euros.

Thanks to all for the advice and input!!

Thanks to all for the advice and input!!

Enjoy your trip. No day trips this time, next trip to Itsly you can complete more of your bucket list.

Thanks Suki !!

We are thinking of getting the Roma Pass. I believe that it only covers two museums (Colosseum, Forum and
Palatine Hill are considered as one) and the rest on their list are discounted tickets. We will be in Rome four
nights. Is it worth getting?

Only you can answer the Roma Pass question. Add up the admission to all the places you are definitely seeing and the places you are possibly seeing, and see how it compares with the pass. As you say, you get free admission to the first two sights you see, and discounts to the others. Note that you only get to skip the ticket-buyer lines at your free admissions, whereas with pre-booked tickets, you can skip all the ticket-buyer lines. Remember that the Roma Pass does not include Vatican City sights at all.

The Roma Pass also includes a transit pass, but you can buy this separately for much less if that is all you need.

On the issue of a day trip from Rome, instead of Pompeii, as someone has suggested, I’d recommend Ostia Antica. It’s an easy train ride from the Pyramid stop in central Rome and will give you the same flavor of ancient times without the loooong train rides from Rome, the crowds and the heat. Ostia has green spaces and trees, whereas Pompeii is mostly stone and hot and crowded.

We were in Rome for 5 nights last September and the Roma Pass definitely saved us money. The guy at the Ara Pacis (another great site to see in Rome if you have time) even gave us the discount after the Roma Pass had expired! Plus the Metro proved easy to navigate so we used it several times, e.g., to get between our lodging in Monti and the Vatican.

Ostia is a beautiful, relaxing and easy day trip. You can spend all day wandering about there if you like. We were back at the Pyramide Metro stop by mid-afternoon.

Thank you for the information. We will get the Roma Pass as soon as we find the link.

Help Please,
We will be staying in Venice at the Hotel Serenissima, they have suggested that we take the Alilaguna
Lines from VCE to the Piazza San Marco stop. It is a little bit over an hour ride. The hotel is about four
to 5 blocks from the Piazza San Marco. (2 suitcases and a carry on) Has anybody on the forum have any
experience with the lines? Should we explore other ways from VCE to the hotel ? (Bus)