Firs time Italy first international trip since Covid.

My husband and I went to Italy in late September last year as our first trip since Covid started. We actually took 5 weeks, and it included Rome, Bologna, a small agriturismo in Umbria, a return after 20 years to the Cinque Terre, and a week in the Bolgheri wine country/Etruscan Coast area in southwestern Tuscany. Out of all that, the C.T. is the one place we probably have no to desire to return.

While it was a vacation to Italy after all, and a bad day in Italy is better than a good day some other places, the C.T. was way more crowded than it had been back in 2001. Too crowded. By the time we reached there, it was actually mid-October, so it might have been even busier 3 weeks earlier. Rockslides had closed most of the main trail between the 5 towns, so the hiking opportunities were restricted. We were able to find a small apartment in Riomaggiore, but lodging was largely taken. Took a trip to Vernazza one day, and it was a packed mob of people in the streets. Gelato in Corniglia was outstanding, maybe the highlight of the C.T. last year.

Amalfi coast, while staying in Sorrento, was almost 10 years ago, and we haven’t gone back yet, but would like to do so. We went kind-of far north up the coast to reach the C.T. last year; if the option for you is to go kinda far north to C.T., or pretty far south to AC/Sorrento, I’d go south, no question.

If saving AC/Sorrento for another trip, and having an extra couple days each in Rome and Florence is any option, that’d be even better for this trip. Cinque Terre isn’t as good as it was when it was still a Rick Steves “back door,” before everybody discovered it. And storms and rockfall haven’t been kind to the C.T., either.

In terms of time, is your flight day to Italy considered one of your travel days? When you say 2 days Rome, how many nights is that?

You have stated you like a go,go style of travel, but I think that you are going to need to edit your plans.

1. Be realistic about what's possible. Your guiding principles should be "this your first trip, not your only trip" and "less is more," it's better to enjoy what you can see than to see everything you can.
2. Count nights in Italy, not days on the calendar. Your first day in Italy is far from a full day. It's (at best) nearly 3 hours to reach your hotel. Will you be zonked that day (little sleep on the plane, jetlag)? Your last day in Italy will probably be just going to the airport to catch your flight home.
3. Use trenitalia.com to see train schedules. Work out how long it will take you to get from A to B and factor in the time to get to/from the train station and allow a few minutes to find and board your train. Rome to Florence to Venice is efficient, fast trains and the station in Florence is walking distance to everywhere you'll want to go. That can be true for Venice as well. Spending a night anywhere else will use a lot of travel time. Day trips are possible, though not to the CT or the AC.
4. Are you flying open-jaw? If not, Venice to Rome uses up a lot of time. If you're going open-jaw, best to start in Venice and end in Rome.

Lastly, any town in Italy will afford you architecture, culture, food, museums. The "big 3" you're looking at are at the top of the list for most visitors. Heck, I went to all of them in April after having been to them all at least 4 times. September is still high season, choosing less popular places may give you a better experience.

... I’m packing too much.

It is as you say.

Have you made your air reservations? If so, your airports will guide the itinerary. We took a 10 night (so, 11 days) trip to Italy this spring. Our itinerary was 4 nights Rome, 3 nights Florence and 3 nights Venice, flying open jaw into Rome and out of Venice. We had a fantastic trip but we had no time to take any day trips and we were super tired at the end! Italy is incredibly dense with amazing sights and experiences. Much more so any other country in Europe that I've travelled to . That's a good thing but if you rush around the country, you'll spend too much time packing and moving then experiencing. I haven't been to the Amalfi coast but if it's at the top of your list, I would cut Venice. It is even further north than the CT. The others here can help you with the logistics way better than I can but you will need to make some difficult choices with only 10 days.

The unfortunate thing about the Amalfi coast for a short trip is all the time wasted getting to where you are going, whether it is arrival, departure, or just getting around.

Getting to Naples from Rome is not bad, but then the last bit from Naples to Sorrento or Positano can take as long by public transport.

From that base, to go anywhere will be an hour of time, at least. This is all manageable for 3-4 nights, but makes a night, even two, a waste.

That is one of the advantages of the CT, depending on your itinerary, getting there and around is not bad, two nights would be fine. However, as a previous poster mentioned, if you hit the crowds, it can be oppressive. We have been 3 times, and each the crowds were worse, the last time being a decade or more ago.

Maybe those that have been more recent have some tips or insight, but I guess, for the time, I would focus on Rome, Florence, Venice, maybe add a stop along the way (Orvieto for example)

Wondering if I’m packing too much.

Short answer? Yes.
2 FULL days in any location = 3 nights.
Subtract 1/2 a day for every location/hotel move.
Arrival day does not count as a sightseeing day; could be too jet lagged to do much beyond a walkabout to stay awake.

You get the idea. :O)
So, if you want 2 FULL days apiece for Rome, Venice and Florence, you need 3 hotel nights in each.

Day 1: Fly into Venice: partial arrival day
Day 2 Venice
Day 3: Venice
Day 4: Transfer to Florence, 1/2 day Florence
Day 5: Florence
Day 6: Florence
Day 7: transfer to Rome, 1/2 day Rome
Day 8: Rome
Day 9: Rome

There's not much left over for anything but maybe the addition of one day trip from Florence or 1 more day for Rome; I consider 4 nights/3.5 days the minimum for 1st-timers to that one. There's definitely not enough for the Amalfi Coast so save that for another trip when you can give that region quality time.

Alternately, you might be able to squeak in the CT between Florence and Rome for your 10th day/1 night. All-in-all, I love to see you push for adding another couple of nights to that if at all possible so you'd end up with 4 nights for Rome, an extra night for a day trip from Florence, and a 2nd night in the CT.

@ Kathy, that is a practical, sweet-spot itinerary - I personally would want, at a minimum, 1 more full day in each, but it is what it is, given the time constraints.

Well, sometimes more can be found with a 'lil encouragement. :O)
Mr. J, what do you say? Is a 10-day trip length set in stone?

I'd consider dropping one of the "big three" OR eliminating the CT/Amalfi idea. It is just not enough time for both. Ten days is a good amount of time, but not if you pack too much in. Even for people who are more energetic than me, you don't want to pay all that money and go all that way just to waste time in transit.
Look carefully at your multi-city flight options, or share if airfare is already a done deal, and we can suggest ways to maximize your time.

Cyn - that makes me sad - but not surprised - about CT. I explored the area solo with a backpack in the mid- late 90s - it felt relatively undiscovered to the masses - probably last visit was 2001. If I only knew then it would all change and not for the better. I was hoping to take my kids there but I know it won’t be the same experience and probably not worth it during July crowds. Had planned a day trip from where we are staying a few hours away - but now rethinking.

mggtravel, don't worry--there are tons of places that are still out there to enjoy without crowds, even in Italy. My partner and I have been the only people on more trails than I can count--CT is the only place I have ever not enjoyed hiking in Italy.

Thank you all for the advice this is great. As I mentioned this is very early stages. We decided to completely cut AC and the south.

Really we have different priorities so we are trying to accommodate both.

We want a mixture of hikes/outdoors and views hence CT. And culture / food / sights hence cities. We are not city people at all and beyond seeing a few major points We’d likely move on. I am considering removing Florence since the art appeal doesn’t really do much for us. We’d love to explore Tuscan areas for hills vineyards etc but I’ll need to dig into that more.

In terms of CT it seems to be mixed feelings based on when folks have visited, time weather etc. we hate extreme heat.

I think it helps to make a thorough list of what you want to see in Rome and Venice and then decide--there is not a hard and fast rule for what is enough or too little time.
Full disclosure: I've been to Italy seven times and I have not set foot in any of the big three (I will one day--perhaps when I am too old to hike--I've seen some amazing tiny villages instead!).
It will probably still be fairly warm in late September, but no guarantees when it comes to weather. The train from Rome to CT is not that bad, you do lose some time en route to Venice, but I think limiting it to three destinations is a better overall use of time.
You've got time to decide, but I'd be working on airfare, as that is the biggest cost.

I wonder if something like this would work
Venice 3 nights
Lucca 1 night- its on your way to CT and would give you a bit of Tuscan experience
Cinque Terre 2 -3 nights
Rome 3 nights

I believe that this is all manageable by train. Lucca is a lovely town. We really enjoyed Cinque Terre, but that was years ago, and what I hear now is crowds make it less enjoyable. But it is beautiful scenery and if you are staying over can perhaps avoid the daytrippers a bit.

I agree with others in that you're trying to fit too many destinations into a very short time frame. Does the ten days include your arrival and departure days? Is there any way you could add a few days?

The previous suggestion to limit your stops to Venice, Florence and Rome is reasonable, perhaps with a day trip or two from those locations. Of course, that will mean using open jaw flights. Keep in mind that each change of location will take at least half a day, when all is considered, so it's a good idea to minimize travel days.

If you're really intent on seeing the five towns of the Cinque Terre that is possible as a day trip from Florence, although it will be a long day involving at least a couple of train changes in each direction. Some people choose to take a guided tour for that, but it's quite easy to do on your own.

Thank you all this is great feedback! I think we have been looking at this differently now and thinking along the lines of just basing in the cities or smaller towns and doing day trips to various places.

2.5 days - Venice
3 days - Florence - with maybe 1-2 day trips to Pisa / Tuscany area. I dont think we care so much about Florence so we may pick a different place as a base town we want something more quiet and list busy city.
3 - days - CT
2.5 days Rome

again this is very rough draft but we decided to complete forget about the south and focus more central / north with day trips.

You could skip Florence altogether and take two trains from Venice to Lucca (changing trains in Florence) --- Lucca is a nice quieter town (but still interesting!), and from Lucca it's only a 2.5 hour train trip to the Cinque Terre. And half an hour for a day trip to Pisa.

That’s a great idea! I was looking at Lucca since someone else noted it. I think maybe 1 day in Florence? I guess the hard thing is trying to do a day trip in the Tuscany area. Are there any smaller easy accessible villages in that area?

I would put in a plug for making sure to spend some time in Corniglia when you visit the Cinque Terre. Because it’s uphill as opposed to on the water, it doesn’t seem to get as many tourists as the other towns. From the train station there are 3 options to get up to the town: walk up the switch-back steps, walk up the road or take the shuttle bus. We just made our second CT visit and our first to Corniglia and really enjoyed exploring all the small alleys.

Reading through the thread now, this trip looks to be spiralling out of control to the point of there being a whole lot of movement with so little actual seeing anything meaningful of Italy.

To be fair meaningful to you is different to meaningful to me.

I’ve gotten good insight here but what would you recommended for 10 days?

Right off the top "We want a mixture of city (architecture, culture, food, museums)" - doesn't get much better than that in Florence, then Florence gets blown off with "I don't think we care so much about Florence" - First time in Italy, Florence is meaningful.

To me, nothing that special about tuscan vineyards that you can't see in the Pinot Noir areas of Washington State.

Moving to Lucca, as a base for 2 days, means nothing if you're also planning 2 day trips from there - whole lot of architecture and culture to be seen in Lucca, that will go unseen.

A few more thoughts based on your latest comments.....

For a first visit to Italy, Florence would be a better choice than Lucca (IMO) and it's also a good transportation hub for getting to other locations. Florence is the capital of Tuscany so it's easy to get to other nearby locations from there. One possibility is a day trip to Siena either by train or bus. With such a short trip, IMO I wouldn't bother with Pisa.

For your stay in the Cinque Terre, you'll have to decide which of the five towns you want to base in. Have you got a preference?

Are you using the RS Italy guidebook to plan touring, accommodations, etc.?

I can't recall if anyone has mentioned it, but you'll need to do some research on using trains and other public transportation in Italy, as there are some potentially expensive caveats to be aware of (ie: hefty fines collected on the spot).