Driving vs. trains???

Laura, My suggestion would be to use a rental car "strategically" to reach places not well served by public transport. Use trains or Buses for the remainder, as it will be much easier, faster and more efficient. You may want to read some of the other Threads here regarding "traffic tickets" and the dreaded ZTL areas which are increasingly prevalent in many Italian cities. One important point to note is that for driving in Italy, each driver must have the compulsory International Driver's Permit, which is used in conjunction with your home D.L. These are valid for one year, and easily obtained at any AAA office (two Passport-sized photos required, which in some case is offered at the issuing office). Failure to produce an IDP if requested can result in fines on the spot! Have a look at This Website for more detailed information. A GPS along with a good Map would also be a good idea. Be sure to also give some thought to the question of CDW. If you accept the CDW offered by the rental firm, it will be expensive but will provide "peace of mind". Some "premium" credit cards provide rental vehicle insurance, however I've found this to be somewhat complicated so I just accept that offered by the rental firm. Check the Car Rental section in Europe Through The Back Door for further information. Could you provide a bit more information on your trip? For example: > where are you planning to visit in Tuscany? > the length of your trip? > which airports are you using? To answer your last question, YES, trains are definitely a good option, especially the fast trains. If this is your first trip to Europe, I'd highly recommend pre-reading Europe Through The Back Door, especially the "Rail Skills" chapter. Cheers!

maybe in tuscany you need a car but depend on how many days you have. florence and sienna can be easily done with train or bus and that'll take easily 3-4 days out. after that you should consider a car. other places you mentioned can easily be done with train. because train ticket is cheap compare to rental car, I'd take train and not worry about parking.

No cars permitted in Venice. You have to park the rental car. In general, no tourist cars in the CT. There are parking lots above the most towns. Exceptions are the few hotels with their own parking lot and the parking lots by the water in Monterosso. In all cases, you cannot drive around in the CT. You will be penalized by computerized camera taking pictures of your license plate if you drive in almost any part of the historic areas of Florence. It's all a restricted zone. Rome is not that bad but you'll find yourself parking the car and mostly taking the great public trainsportation. Other than he above, a rental car for Tuscany, the areas between Venice and the CT as well as the areas between Tuscany to Rome could be just fine.

There are places (Venice, Rome, and probably Milan for example) where you certainly don't want a car. I've never been to the CT, but I doubt a car will be useful there. And keep in mind the relatively long distances you're going. Rome is hardly "north" except perhaps to the Sicilians. Depending on how much time your spending in Tuscany and what you plan to do there, you may want/need a car. (But search ZTL on these chat boards and be forewarned.) On my only trip to Italy, I relied on trains throughout the country with the exception of a three-day rental to explore hill towns in Tuscany. We hated driving in Italy so much that we returned the car after a day and a half. Others will tell you that you can't really do the small towns properly without one. What are you looking to do in Tuscany and for how long?

Laura, We have been to Italy many times and have driven all over Europe our one CAVEAT is never, EVER to drive in Rome, it is a MADHOUSE! Romans view traffic laws as a very loose set of guidelines.

You might want to do a little of both. In Tuscany it's fun to have a car and explore little towns, stop at wineries etc. but in Milan and Rome it would be a nightmare to have a car. Cinque Terre would be hard to reach without a car but once you are there you don't ever need it until you leave. Trains are great if you travel light. You'll have fun no matter what!

Thank you for all the quick replies! I am hoping to go for 10-14 days total and am leaning toward using trains for the most part, except perhaps for Tuscany as mentioned. Haven't done enough research yet to know where to go in Tuscany but am thinking at least 2 or 3 days there, and the same in CT. Since we want to cover from Venice to Rome, any suggestions as to where to fly into/out of? Also, I am hoping to rely on family in Belluno to help us cover that area and Venice and will probably spend 2/3 days there. Would 2 nights in Rome be enough to see most everything?

I am not going to address trains versus car. There is great advice above. I want to respond to your last entry Haven't done enough research yet to know where to go in Tuscany but am thinking at least 2 or 3 days there, and the same in CT. Since we want to cover from Venice to Rome, any suggestions as to where to fly into/out of? Also, I am hoping to rely on family in Belluno to help us cover that area and Venice and will probably spend 2/3 days there. Would 2 nights in Rome be enough to see most everything? In 10-14 days, it is going to be difficult to cover all the territory you list and still see anything. I like to think in terms of nights spent and then look at how many days I have to actually tour and experience a place. So: 3 nights Venice = 2 full days touring 2 nights CT = 1 full day touring 3 nights Tuscany = 2 full days touring
2 nights Rome = 1 full day touring Remember, every time you change locations you lose at least 1/2 a day. Really! And that assumes you leave wherever you are very early in the morning. If you like to sleep late, you won't get resettled until supper time! Forget Milan unless you fly in-and-out of there. Save it for a return trip if you have more time. Try to fly open-jaw into Venice and out of Rome, or vice versa. (That can be difficult. I know our choice was to fly into Venice via Germany, and we would not arrive any earlier than if we flew into Rome arriving very early, and took a highspeed train to Venice.) You cannot "do" Rome in 1 day of touring. You will barely scratch the surface. Try to get to 14 nights instead of 10. If you only have 10, cut your itinerary down to three locations: Rome, Tuscany (one town, Florence or Siena) and Venice. If you can manage 14 nights, do Venice (4), Tuscany (4), CT (2) and Rome (4).

Laurel is right - you are trying to do way too much in too short a time. Consider that you can spend 5 days in Rome and barely scratch the surface. Venice is a minimum of 2 full days to enjoy. Florence is a minimum of 2 days. CT needs 2 days min. Siena can be a day trip from Florence if you add a day. Pick 3 places that seem most interesting to you and go there. Also try to fly open-jaw if you plan to include Rome and Venice since they are quite a distance apart. Given your short time and likely itinerary, there is no need or advantage to having a car. You'll find it far more hassle and cost than taking fast and convenient trains. A car is for exploring little towns and that's not what you list.

Thanks, Laurel. Maybe we could skip Milan. Venice AREA is a must but mainly to meet/visit family in the Belluno area..not necessarily the city of Venice itself. One day touring Venice will probably be enough there. CT is a MUST after seeing Rick's program about it, as well as Tuscany. Since this will probably be a once-in-a-lifetime trip, I feel we MUST see Rome. I will, however, plan on 2 weeks so as not to have to rush too much. Yes, I am leaning towards flying INTO Venice, taking trains to CT, Tuscany, then renting a car to explore there, then train to Rome, spending few days there before flying home. Does this sound do-able in 14 days?

Yes, Laura, I think your last plan will work if you have the two full weeks. Do go to http://www.ferroviedellostato.it/homepage_en.html and spend some time looking at trains and times so you get a feel for how much time is involved, the options for leaving early or late, and fares. While Trenitalia does not post schedules many months in advance, you can estimate your trips by choosing the same day of the week in an earlier month. The schedules do not change much overall. Highspeed trains will cost more, but save you time, and to me that is the most precious commodity when traveling. Buy your tickets a few days in advance and you may get the "mini" discount. (So arrive Venice, buy ticket to CT or your Tuscany location, and so on.) Buy train tickets as soon as you are sure of your plans, but on the ground in Italy. You can find many posts on this board about that. A car in Tuscany for 3 days would be fun. We did that and while a bit more expensive, it is a time saver. You can stay at an agriturismo and have free parking. Some B&Bs in the towns also have free parking arrangements. We found that in Montalcino, and in Sienna we were able to secure a parking spot outside the ZTL for 10 euro per night. So ask your proprietor about parking options. Planning is half the fun. I hope you are finding it so!

Italy was my last vacation. 1 week prior to going, I canceled my 2 day car rental thru Tuscany and Umbria. I just chickened out. I have been to Europe many times and all times I have said to myself, man I will never drive here. Well coming back from Italy, I realized I did the right thing. I really do not think I will ever try to drive in Italy, especially in a place like Rome. It really was not necessary for us in our 16 day excursion. the only place I had planned on seeing that I did not see was Montepulciano. Oh well.

How did you get around Tuscany without a car? That is the only place I am considering it in order to see the various hillside towns, vineyards, etc. Is it possible to do this some other way?

You can get to towns via bus but on a short trip you won't see many due to bus schedules. If you want to stop at vineyards and small villages you'll need a car. I've not driven in Italy but many do and survive. I wouldn't do it if your not a confident driver or get lost easy. And avoid major cities. And realize you'll park outside of each town you visit and many towns have auto restricted areas that you can't drive through without a permit. Lot's of warnings but the rewards can be great. PS - You must have an IDP to drive in Italy. It's just paperwork purchased at any AAA but necessary.

Can you do Tuscany without a car? Sure. Just depends on where you want to go and on what schedule. I met people in Siena who took a trip every day either with a bus (San Gimignano, Volterra) or a guided tour (Tours By Roberto). They loved their choice. Can you get everywhere and stop when you wish? No. We did not find a car to be scary at all. Challenging? A bit. But I am glad we were able to take the drives we took, see the off-the-beaten path places we saw. (The drive between Montalcino and Montepulciano is fabulous!) That said, we are going to Umbria late this year and are going to throw ourselves on the mercy of public transportation. We have time, so we'll see how it goes. If time is precious, or you want to see some place not accessible by bus or train, then try a car for a few days. IMHO, it does take two: a driver and a tuned in passenger/navigator. Really helps to have someone else spotting roadsigns!

"Would 2 nights in Rome be enough to see most everything?" No, 2 nights is not enough to see most everything in Rome.
If that's all the time you have, you'll want to prioritize by listing your top sights and working down the list.

Yes, I am leaning towards flying INTO Venice, taking trains to CT, Tuscany, then renting a car to explore there, then train to Rome, spending few days there before flying home.
Does this sound do-able in 14 days? just about.

Trains, trains, trains whenever possible. The trains are so easy to use, convenient, punctual and quick, that driving is my last option. We would just walk up to one of those ATM looking machines and buy our tickets for whatever destination, time, price, seat and what kind of train it was (bullet or regular). Keep an eye on the big board for departures and get on the train to our destination. Another thing I was able to do was print on my computer the schedules for that day, before I left home. The only problem we had was in Naples, the machines were malfunctioning and not accepting credit cards. An attendant that spoke very little english came to help me. It was quite entertaining for everyone watching us communicate... But we worked it out and went back to Rome safely.

Thanks so much, everyone, for the great advice. Looks like trains is the way to go. I'm still unsure about what to do when we get to Tuscany. I would love to explore the small towns and hillsides so if it is possible to do that without renting a car, we will..........anyone who has done so, please let me know.

Laura - as people have said, all the major hill towns can be reached by bus from Florence or Siena. Depending on which town, the schedules are pretty tourist friendly except for Sundays. But going on a town-to-town circuit is not so easy. So realistically you can only do one town a day. So decide how long you have to explore Tuscany and what you want to see. The more time and the more places on your list, the better a car is. But given your current schedule, by the time you finish with Florence and Siena, there won't be much time left for just exploring the countryside.

You can easily rent a car at the Florence airport to explore Tuscany, in which case you can drive all over at your leisure and explore many towns and vineyards in one day. I always drive in this area and love the freedom and spontaneity and have found some incredible little villages. Parking in some villages can be a challenge, but worth the effort.

You do not want a car in Rome! There is no parking and it is rather tricky. We do love to drive though as you have the ability to stop when and where you want. Some of our favorite experiences have been stopping at small cafes on the roadside.
Happy traveling!