Dinner time in Italy?

Going to a popular restaurant in Milan at 6:30 pm, I noticed it was mostly fellow tourists. About 8 pm, it seemed like that is when the Italians started rolling in.

Yes. Many Italian restaurants open for dinner at 7:00 or 7:30 but will only be serving tourists at that time. A few cheaper places (such as pizza by the slice) are open through the afternoon.

During the two or three times we have been to Italy we survived by eating Tapas (little plates) around our normal dinner time of 5:30. We were lucky to stumble upon them as we never would have lasted until 7:30 or 8:00 even by eating a late lunch.

In my experience, most Italian restaurants are open for dinner around 7:00 or 7:30. More rare is 8:00. You'll often have the place to yourself or other tourists until your desert course.

...I'd rather hang around til the local folks show up

Jim,

I typically dine a bit earlier, sometimes at around 18:00. I've never had any problem finding restaurants that are open at that time. On rare occasions when I want to dine at a specific restaurant, I may have to wait until 19:00 but that's never been a problem.

Jim, I've heard that many Italian restaurants pretty much have two sittings. The early one is almost all Americans, then later almost all Europeans. Once for a highly-recommended restaurant in Burano, I made a 7:00 pm reservation by Internet from the States, as Venice was my first stop, and I knew I would have a long ride then walk back home. After wandering around for quite a while, I showed up at 7:00 pm to find the restaurant not yet open, they said they were closed until 7:30. I did not have either the Italian vocabulary or the chutzpah to say "so why do you take reservations for 7:00?" I wandered some more and returned at 7:30, and between the leisurely service and my leisurely pace, I missed the 9:30 pm vaporetto back to Venice. Fortunately there was another at 10:30. But I tell you, Burano is really dead late in the evening, and there was only one other passenger on the vaporetto at that hour, a seemingly vagrant type who was asleep in the back row. And, believe it or not, a transit guy who checked my ticket! Late to bed that night, I assure you.

We find it very easy to adopt the local eating schedule. Decent breakfast, mid day break around 2 or 3 and dinner at 8 to 9. We find it very relaxing. We have seen more than one restaurant in Rome with a bunch of Am tourist gathered around the front waiting for the doors open at 7. They rush in like it will be there last meal.

There are not two formal seating times, if you are seated, the table is yours until the restaurant closes. Informally, many North American and some Northern European tourists finish dinner by 8:30 or 9, so the table is available again. But don't count on being able to hover until a table opens up.

Yes Zoe, I guess that's what I meant by "pretty much". There are not actually two separate sittings, just often two waves of diners passing through. And certainly, meals can go on and on, more so for Europeans than for Americans, in my experience.

Depending on where you are. If you are in the major cities, you'll find places to eat earlier. In smaller towns, and out of the way places, usually 8PM is the starting time. You may not be able to be seated until 8PM

If the location caters to a lot of tourists, you can eat earlier.

We just returned from Sardenia, and ate at 8PM each night. Lunch was at 1:30/2PM...breakfast at 8AM

Dinner time has regional variations, it is early (say, 7.30-8.00pm) in northern Italy and late (say, 8.30 to 9.00pm) in southern Italy.

So while we're on this topic, what's the typical daily routine for Italians? I'm usually in bed by 930-10pm. If they're not eating dinner until 8-9pm, when do they usually go to bed/wake up?

I'm curious about that too Stephen

asps2 is correct. It varies from north and south, and between big city and country folk.

In Florence, my family and virtually all friends I know, start dinner at 8:00pm, almost religiously. I think it has to do with the start time of the evening news on RAI (at 8pm). So dinner usually starts at 8pm and is usually over by 9pm. After which, at least during the nice weather months, we all go out (for strolls etc.). However whenever we organize dinners or pizza out with my friends (even nowadays), we would show up at the restaurant a bit later, usually 8:30-9pm. Many restaurants, especially outside of downtown, close the kitchen at 10pm, so you need to order before then. Downtown they stay open later.
In the countryside of Tuscany, the country folks eat earlier. Generally they start dinner between 7pm and 730pm and they are done within one hour.
In Rome, they eat later. Generally people show up at restaurants at around 9pm or later. However at home people eat a bit earlier (but still after 8pm).
In cities in the south, they eat later still (9 to 10pm), almost Spanish time, but in the countryside they eat earlier.
Milan and the north in general dines earlier, generally starting between 7 and 8.
I have never heard of people eating at 6pm or even 6:30pm before coming to the US. That is 'merenda' (snack time) not dinner. Even my grandmother in the country ate later than that.
Still today after decades in the US, I still dine after 8pm.

As to when people go to bed, generally if you work the next day, I would say by 11pm most working people are in bed. Italian dinners are not as heavy as the luncheons (or American dinners) so it's not a big problem. Only the 'galline' and the elderly go to bed before 10pm in Italy. However it's also rare to see people commuting at the ungodly times people commute in America. For example at 6am the bridges and the freeways in the Bay Area are already all full of cars. If you go out in the morning in Florence at 6am, there will be nobody on the road. Most offices open at 8-8:30am, but very few Italians are crazy enough to live 40-50 miles (or 1.5 hr drive) from their workplace in order to afford a bigger house, so the commutes are much shorter (20 min on avg) than it's typical in American metropolitan areas.

well there ya go. Thanks Roberto.

Roberto has inadvertently given out a secret. If you manage to hit the road at 6 or 6.30am, there will not be crowds in the center of Florence and it will have a different look. If you are a photographer this is a golden time.

yeah, I should go there before sunrise ...works for me

Roberto, I appreciate your insight on Italian routines!

However, I think you vastly underestimate reasons for long commutes in America. I too live in the Bay Area, and commute for an hour. For many, it has nothing to do with a big house, but has to do with what we can afford, as my 2bd 800sq ft apartment is anything but big. Additionally, we have almost no public transit, so there's no incentive to live within a close range of train or bus stops.

". . .but very few Italians are crazy enough to live 40-50 miles (or 1.5 hr drive) from their workplace in order to afford a bigger house. . ."

Stephen

One main reason why housing is so outrageously expensive in the Bay Area is due to zoning laws which impose very low FAR (Floor Area Ratios) in many communities.

This is done to incentivize construction of low density high cost dwellings (single family houses) instead of lower cost high density dwellings (multistory condos, apartments, townhouses). The reason this is done is because many local governments want only high price dwellings in their area that only upper income people can afford. That is done to increase the tax base. However this policy of favoring low density housing has the unintended consequence to increase land use (more land is necessary to house the same number of people) and therefore the price of the land made available for development becomes scarce more quickly and increases in price.

Obtaining a building permit for a multi-story high density dwelling is also very difficult to obtain, that also contributes to increases in real estate cost.

The absence of public transit options are a consequence of this low density development, not the cause. Public transportation is not economically feasible in low density areas typical of American sprawling suburbs because there isn't a sufficient number of passengers per square mile to justify the investment. As such only high density localities like San Francisco can support a viable transit system.

This policy of course plays perfectly into the hands of American oil companies and car manufacturers, who benefit from forcing people to log thousands and thousands of miles in their cars to get to work. The Bay Area used to have a very extensive railroad system up to the early XX century (including the Key System in the East Bay). Guess who bought those railroads and transit systems in the mid 1900's and replaced them with roads? I'll give you a few names: GM, Firestone Tire, Standard Oil of California, Phillips Petroleum, Mack Trucks.
Read here for some info on why America has no trains like Europe.