Advice on two weeks Italian roadtrip

Did you use google maps for the drive times? Did you correct the time to the daytime hours you would likely be driving? ( google defaults to 'now', which likely means if you are in the US the drive time estimates were for late PM or early AM hours in Italy. I find google is optimistic and doesn't account for any finding parking and getting from car to whatever it is you are going to see and then back to the car, will add significantly to the 'drive times'

Hello and welcome.

That's an awful lot of driving for first timers. Have you figured out where you will park? Have you tallied up gas, tolls, parking?
I'll have to come back and read thru again- but my first reaction is- that's an awful lot of driving to see a lot of nice places too quickly.

Where will your luggage be while you are parked and just doing a "brief stop" at a town?
Getting up to Perugia will take a bit of time. Have you figured out where you will park here?

Each check in/check out takes a chunk of time.

Rent at a car and Leave Rome on the 24th, Rome to Perugia 2 h 16 min,
brief stop. Perugia to Pisa 2h 45 min, Lunch in Pisa, spend afternoon.
Pisa to Pistoia 55 min.

If lucky you leave Rome by 9- allow 3 hrs to Perugia- then at least 2 hrs there. It's now 2 pm- lunch is almost over.
It will be 5 pm by the time you get to Pisa. Time for a quick peek, quick dinner and then drive 1 hr or more to Pistoia.
It gets dark at 7?

Anyway- whew- it's a lot.

Hi Kari, check a map of Italy because you’re almost at Cinque Terre when you are at Pisa on #2. But then you go across the width of Italy to see Ravenna, only to return to the Cinque Terre on #5.

Please look up ZTL fines, so your trip doesn’t have some unpleasant extra expenses after you’re back home.

You are certainly free to do whatever you would like, but my advice as someone who has been to Italy numerous times, LOVES IT and stayed in 40+ places there is that this trip is going to be a big blur. The best part of being in Italy is exploring the large & small cities. Walking around, seeing the sites, being able to enjoy the atmosphere. I am afraid that your percentage of time inside a car, waiting, checking into/out of lodging, etc. is overwhelming compared to actually doing what is fun.

My advice would be to mark this trip in detail on a 24-hour graph. Color-code the hours you’re sleeping, in a car, eating. Then see what you have left to have a much better idea of how much or little “spending the day” is left for your family. Adjust the itinerary per your family’s top priorities.

Have you been to Rome before? I ask because of all the wonders of that city, Bomarzo would be very far down on my list for a day trip, even with the additional day in Rome at the end.
Similarly, I wonder what the attraction of Lavertezzo is. Long drive and just one day there.
In general, driving times as provided by viamichelin or similar are a bit misleading for your planning, in that
they do not account for pre- and post- drive times. You will need to pack up and check out. At the other end, you will need to check in and unpack. A 4 hour drive can easily eat up 6 hours of your day.

”Stay in Marghera (near Venice) Sep 29 to Oct 1. Leave car here and go to Venice by train/bus.”

The islands of Venice (the set shaped like a fish) are fantastic! Don’t settle for staying over in the Marghera area. Park your car in one of the main parking areas and take the ferry to stay on the islands. It will change how you feel about Venice! : ) Instead of going back & forth off the islands, you will be there in the midst after the day trip crowd is gone and before they arrive the next day.

I am exhausted just trying to read your itinerary much less actually do the stops. Two nights in Rome with jet lag is one day to sightsee. For 12 days (not two weeks as you say) I would pick 3 places max and skip a car. Stop, slow down, enjoy the trip. Travel is not a race.

You haven't told us if you're arriving from the US (sounds like you are) and what your main goals are for this trip (sightseeing, relaxing, adventure, history, art . . . . ). So my responses may not be altogether useful for you.

First is a general observation that 4 people move only as fast as the slowest one at any given time, whether it's a window-shopper, a sleepy-head, a slow eater . . . well, you get the idea. Every time you move to a new hotel you have to pack, check out, get to your transportation (maybe a train station, maybe a parking lot), travel time, get to your new hotel, check in, unpack. If you are driving, you will want hotels with parking Edited to add: hotel rooms are usually for 2 people, sometimes twin beds are available, but the standard in my experience is a double bed - this may or may not be okay for your kids. You may be considering apartments or hotel suites. You really want 2 bathrooms to be able to save time.

Second general observation is that Italy is not the US. Everything is different. On your first few days, you have to get used to a new currency, signage in Italian, finding your way around (and this again in each new place), learning how to use public transportation, streets that dead-end, trying to find the name of the street you're on, so much that's strange and potentially disorienting.

These are just a few considerations when planning how long to stay in each town and how many towns to visit. There's also the kaleidoscope effect - when you cram in too much, it all gets mixed up in your head.

I've rented a car twice in Italy, after several visits without one. Unlike your visit, both of mine were in off-season. I rarely had difficulty finding a parking place and rarely had much road traffic. Actual driving times were always longer than Google estimates, not even counting getting lost, getting bad Garmin GPS and Google map directions (which sometimes conflicted), and looking for parking. I also had the advantage of having a compact/economy size car and being able to store all my luggage (1 person) in the trunk and out of sight when I parked the car. You will need a fairly large car for your family to be comfortable. Even the larger European cars have limited trunk space. The rental company descriptions will show the number of large and small luggage pieces possible. Also, the bigger the car, the harder it will be to maneuver on narrow streets and roads, and to find parking.

Just sayin' . . . .

Thanks a lot, everyone, for your helpful advice.

We have certainly re-consider our plan, and are now looking to reduce our stops and use our time more efficiently. I think there are a few places we definitely want to visit: Rome, Ravenna, Venice, Pisa, and Cinque Terre. So, Im looking now into an efficient route for these locations.

For Venice, and regarding this comment:
"The islands of Venice (the set shaped like a fish) are fantastic! Don’t settle for staying over in the Marghera area. Park your car in one of the main parking areas and take the ferry onto the islands. It will change how you feel about Venice! : ) Instead of going back & forth off the islands, you will be there in the midst after the day trip crowd is gone and before they arrive the next day."

We found a place in Marghera,
https://www.booking.com/hotel/it/appartamento-venezia-venezia12.en-gb.html
which says that you can take a bus from their location and reach Venice in 15 min. So, this would be fine to spend the day in Venice and not worrying about parking. I didnt really find many good options (affordable) to stay in Venice, hence why this option in Marghera seemed fine.

You plan to visit Ravenna, the go across the country to visit Cinque Terre and then Switzerland, then cross the country again to visit Venice.
Look at a map and consider going from Ravenna to Venice, then cross the country to Cinque Terre.

Also, that is a lot of driving on this itinerary, especially going to Switzerland. Consider spending more time in places like Rome and cutting Switzerland.

Also, many people that rent cars get expensive tickets in Italy, consider taking the train. Parking can be very difficult.

You have 13 nights
You are flying RT Rome

Please consider dropping the car as this whole trip is easily done by train

Suggestion
Head to your furthest location immediately on arrival
Put all Rome nights at end

Land in Rome
Train to Venice-stay in Venice 3 nights
Train to Ravenna 2 nights
Train to CT 3 nights
Stop on Pisa on your way to
Rome 5 nights

If you don’t feel you can handle travel on arrival
Then stay just 1 night in Rome on arrival or maybe go as far as Orvieto and spend first night there

"You plan to visit Ravenna, the go across the country to visit Cinque Terre and then Switzerland, then cross the country again to visit Venice.
Look at a map and consider going from Ravenna to Venice, then cross the country to Cinque Terre.

Also, that is a lot of driving on this itinerary, especially going to Switzerland. Consider spending more time in places like Rome and cutting Switzerland.

Also, many people that rent cars get expensive tickets in Italy, consider taking the train. Parking can be very difficult."

Thanks for your comment. We are no longer considering Switzerland, see my update above. But, Im not ready yet to let go of the car rental. I like being able to stop along the way if I want to.

I don’t think you fully grasp what a headache a car will be
It can also turn into an expensive nightmare if you get home and your mailbox starts filling up with tickets/traffic violations

”We found a place in Marghera,
https://www.booking.com/hotel/it/appartamento-venezia-venezia12.en-gb.html
which says that you can take a bus from their location and reach Venice in 15 min.”

Hi Karl,
Use the link below to get the full picture of the transportation time. If you’re wanting to go from your apartment on the mainland and arrive at St. Mark’s Basilica, a prominent location to enjoy, it’s going to take 90 minutes. It’s fine if you’re okay with using that amount of time. I just want you to be able to know what your trade-off is at that location. …and those ferries can be very crowded!
Walk 6 minutes
Bus 15 minutes
Timing to catch the correct ferry & wait time (extra if standing in line to purchase tickets) 30 minutes
Ferry from the bus station to San Marco Piazza 20 minutes
Walk to the piazza

https://www.rome2rio.com/map/Via-Fratelli-Bandiera-178-30175-Venezia-VE-Italy/St-Mark-s-Basilica#trips/transport/Via-Fratelli-Bandiera-178-30175-Venezia-VE-Italy/St-Mark-s-Basilica/r/Line-1-ferry

Something that might be helpful to save you time, the mosaics in Ravenna are gorgeous! But there are also churches in Rome that have beautiful mosaics. If that’s the only reason you are going to Ravenna, I would just add the day to Rome and enjoy them there.

@Jean
Thanks for your advice.

So, it would be best to stay somewhere within the Venice island, and leave the car somewhere outside Venice (say Marghera) in an all day parking place. I wonder if that would be a solution.

Leave the car at the rental agency in Rome ;)

If you insist on renting a care then choose locations that actually need a car, not locations where a car is an expensive headache.
Rome and Venice do not need a car, getting to those cities does not need a car
Cinque Terre towns do not need a car

We rent a car strategically,
Example— spend a few days in Florence then rent a car as we are leaving a Florence to explore the Tuscan hilltowns- that area needs a car.
Drop the car and continue on our way by train

You can’t drive IN to almost all Italian towns unless you are a resident, you have to park outside the walls in an unguarded parking lot- each time you do this you risk theft of your belongings left in the car.

ZTLs, bus lanes, speeding cameras are all waiting to give you a violation that you won’t even be aware of til months after you return home

Hi Karl, yes, park your car and stay on the islands of Venice. I haven’t rented a car in Italy during the eight times there, but I know there’s some parking lots near the ferry across the causeway from the mainland.

Thanks again, everyone for the helpful advice.
By the way, we are travelling from Australia to Rome, which someone asked.

Thanks a lot for the suggestions of places where to go and eat. Those are greatly appreciated, and even the potential itinerary some have posted.

Right now, we are looking to simplify the trip, and we have discussed the idea of not taking the car. But, Im still reluctant on doing it all by train. However, Im very thankful to have learned about the ZTL zones. I had no idea, and Im sure I would have ended with $$$$ in fines. Im now thinking on how to use the car to avoid any ZTL zones, and use internal transport while in a city.

Regarding our itinerary, we have a fixed point which we cant change (as the hotel has already charged us), and this is a 1 night stay in Ravena, sep 25 - sep 26. So, we have to build our trip around that fixed point.

Karl, as ZTLs were unknown to you, you might want to take a look at this "Definitive Guide for Driving in Italy" that may cover other differences you may not be aware of. It's the "Free book" offered way down near bottom of the main page on this website:

https://italybeyondtheobvious.com/about/travel-philosophy/

If you feel you must drive then you'll want to be careful not to leave anything of value in your vehicle, and stow your luggage out of sight.

Karl maybe the hotel in Ravenna would let you change the date to help with planning. You never know until you ask.

Karl, mate

Where do you live?

Have you been O/S anywhere?

Have driven in other countries, except NZ?

My family and I always lease cars on the continent. Do not let the train obsessed contributors put you off.

Regards
Ron

Hi Ron,

We live in Australia and yes, I have driven in different places, US, South Africa, but never in Italy - and it does sound like this ZTL system is a bit of a tourist tax. But, I think with a bit of care, you can avoid it. We have thought hard about just using the train, but I really like the freedom of being able to stop anywhere if we want to, or make last minute changes and go somewhere, without having to look at a timetable, etc.

"Karl, mate
Where do you live?
Have you been O/S anywhere?
Have driven in other countries, except NZ?
My family and I always lease cars on the continent. Do not let the train obsessed contributors put you off.
Regards
Ron"

Mate

Others will give you the run down for the train network connections. Should not be discarded as an option.

I will look at using a car.

Do you have Italian relatives, friends etc.

I know Bomarzo, Monster Park, though not recently. For the children? Especially the big ones.

What plans do you have for travelling from Rome central to Bomarzo and return?

I Think I can see what you had in mind for your original Route.

Is it important that you go north via Perugia?

Where in the great south land do you live?

Regards Ron

In addition to the ZTL zones, be aware of the speed cameras. You will be ticketed for even 1 km over the speed limit. There are lots of cameras . If five cameras catch you going one km over the limit, you will receive five tickets. In addition to the tickets, you will receive additional charges from your rental car company each time the car rental company gives your info to the police office. The tickets may take 6-8 months to arrive in your mailbox.

Guess there's no way to fly open jaw / multicity- into Venice and out of Rome, or the reverse? That saves a day of backtracking. I would also advocate relying on trains, just my 2 cents worth. And- already been said- fewer locations and more days in a location. Folks always say they want to soak up the culture , but design itineraries that have them buzzing thru it.

Are your kids all morning people- your schedule demands everyone be up and out of the lodging fairly early. Also, many places have specified check in hours, such as 3-7:00pm.
For Venice, the mornings and evening are magic, and not crowded. I would highly encourage you to spend a few nights in old Venice, which would allow a midday break of going back to the hotel and giving the feet a break. It's nice to actually feel you're IN Venice.

I'm assuming you're traveling light? I'm a carry -on only person, and would never go back to a big suitcase.

I wish you a memorable family trip, and I'm glad to have decided to modify your itinerary. Safe travels!

Hi everyone,

Thanks a lot for your feedback.

To answer some questions

We live in Perth, WA.

We arrive at Rome on the 22, and I have booked at car from the 24th, so my idea was just spend the first couple of days in Rome without a car, then drive to the other cities. After Rome, we want to go, for sure, to Ravena, Pisa, Cinque Terre, Venice, on the way to those places, we are thinking Perugia, Florence, Ferrara. We are still deciding on the exact itinerary, and mode of transportation. Thus far, two days in Rome art the start and 1-2 days in Rome at the end, an we have a fixed point in Ravenna due to a researvation we cant cancel, 1 night from the 25th-26th, so the trip has to be built around those dates. Then, the rest split between the other places. For some of those places, we would only stay a short while. But, yes, on the other hand, I would like to avoid spending too much time in the car or train, and more time in places. But, there might not be much we can do about that, as going from Rome to Venice and then to cinque terre alone are unavoidable a long trips.

I did find interesting one suggestion made here (Thanks ChristineH):
"Head to your furthest location immediately on arrival
Put all Rome nights at end
Land in Rome
Train to Venice-stay in Venice 3 nights
Train to Ravenna 2 nights
Train to CT 3 nights
Stop on Pisa on your way to
Rome 5 nights"

But that would mean changing all our plans, rebooking hotels, etc, and Im not still sure about ditching the car.

K

Karl, mate

I read what you wrote. Effective use of the spring break holidays.

I am a sandgroper. KE Subiaco. Grew up in Dianella, (East Perth district football, Mount Lawley Cricket Club) and in the hills at Sawyers Valley before we moved to Tassie. Curtin University then UWA when Uni was free until Hawkey changed things. Just a lucky boomer.

Was over at beginning of July for business and last week of July for a funeral. Have siblings, relatives, and many close friends in Perth. And investments in the state. Regularly fly over. Is the best place on the planet to be young and grow up. Glad no one outside Australia knows about Rotto and Margaret River and El Questro Homestead. Tasmania for when you get older.

The following might be of interest. Just to give you an idea of some of the places we have been. You need to go your own way; I will see if I can help.

Last vacation/visit this year. Flew into Rome late afternoon, 12th April, from UK, joined by other family members who flew from Shanghai where they had spent a couple of days after flying from Melbourne. Stayed overnight near the airport FCO. My two sons collect two Citroens they had contracted to lease until 16th May.

Left about 8am, took E80 from Rome to Pisa. Got there around noon. Had a stop at an Autogrill for fuel and a few paninis and chocolate type desserts and drinks. https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=autogrill%20italy&mid=A0D94BEBA9551AD04C9EA0D94BEBA9551AD04C9E&ajaxhist=0 also https://www.autogrill.it/en/

Autogrill is like the fuel and food stops on the Kwinana Freeway/Forrest Highway. Except better. No Maccas.

Stopped at Pisa for about an hour. Had been before. My grandchildren 8 and 10 years wanted to see the tower. Continued past the quarries at Carrara to the village of Mulazzo, where we stopped to check out a factory from which my BIL’s company sourced industrial filters. To filter out water and cyanide for the gold mining and other industries.

Travelled on to our agriturismo on the outskirts of Parma. Bunch of young blokes and shiela’s were having a birthday party. Pretty much franz listz by the time we got there. Harmless lot. Then went to a local restaurant we noticed about two kms down the road for dinner at 7.30. Solely Italian menu and speakers. As luck would have it, the local sports car club was holding a meeting with 60/70’s Alpa’s, Ferrari’s, Lamborghinis, and Fiats. Mouth-watering stuff. A lonely, immaculately restored LHD blue Triumph TR6 convertible was the standout. The owner/restorer and I had a chat. Had to have my photo taken with it. Try that on a train.

Had achieved the days’ objective of taking the grandchildren to Pisa and then touring the Mulazzo factory and ending at Parma. The sports cars were a bonus.

Karl, I will put some more stuff together for you later about tolls, and other road/driving stuff. To me it is not as daunting as some make out.

Regards Ron

Here's why you can't just stop along the way to see Perugia, say. You have to leave the main road and drive into the town through the hills, find a public garage ($$$) and hope there's available space, walk uphill (or if you're lucky take the escalators) up to the historic center. That's not a 10-15 minute detour by any means. And, truth be told, you don't have extra time built in to your itinerary for spending 4-6 hours in the middle of the day en route without cutting deeply into the short amounts of time you've allowed for the places you're staying in. Never mind the risk of leaving luggage in a parked car for hours in a public parking place.

Yes, your plan necessitates long train rides, but you really won't save much, if any, time by driving. The fastest trains from Rome to Venice are under 5 hours. Driving takes longer. Without a car you can stay in the heart of Venice and walk everywhere. If you're outside the "fish" you will waste time commuting each day. From the train station to to the sights in Venice, it's 20-45 minutes' walk (if you don't get lost!!) or slower vaporetto travel. So it's not a 15 minute commute each way , it's closer to an hour each way.

Morning Karl

Let us assume you are more likely than not to drive at some time while in Italy.

If you haven’t now is the time to read the info at Smart traveller; https://www.smartraveller.gov.au/destinations/europe/italy

You will need an International Driving Permit before you leave. Get one from RAC. $51 AUD. Perhaps for your wife also. Ignore the BWSL advocates who argue you do not need one. You do. No advocate worth his licence will take your case. At least none of those I know and deal with.

The speeds are the same as us KPH. Speed cameras operate on the same basis as in Australia. And like ours are plentiful. A great productivity tool. Leaves the police to track down real criminals rather than recalcitrant cheaters. They are accurate, do not make mistakes and is waste of time trying to challenge. Only drivers make mistakes trying to cheat.

Probably getting the hang of the Toll system/arrangement is the most challenging. Plenty of YouTube offerings on how to go about them. For example https://mominitaly.com/how-to-pay-tolls-in-italy-autostrada/ Review others for a rounded picture. You will probably need to go over them again after your first attempt. Try and remain unflustered. Easier said than done.

You may wish to share with me how you plan to pay for things. I use Qantas Pay multicurrency attached to my frequent flyer card. Find it easy and convenient. Load it up with Euros. All our banks, Australia Post and others offer related products. Just takes a bit of time to get the cards mailed to you. Forex is part of my world. Not for everyone. USA travellers seem obsessed with cash. Also favoured are credit cards. Stick with what you know and understand.

ZTL as a separate topic. It is easy and not to be feared.

Regards Ron

Hi everyone,

After much thinking, we decided to change our plans, and move by train. I might still rent a car, maybe, but for a smaller day trip, if we find something worth the effort.

In the meantime, I am now changing our reservations, and looking into getting train tickets. Our tentative plan, so far, is to go:

Rome to Perugia
Perugia to Ravenna
Ravenna to Venice
Venice to Florence
Florence to Cinque Terre
Cinque terre to Pisa
Pisa to Rome

How long we stay in each place is not decided yet. We arrive in Rome on the Sept 22nd in the morning and leave on the October 4th. We are staying in Rome from the 22-24 and aim to be back at Rome Oct 3-4. So, this only leaves Sept 25 to Oct 2 to go through those places.

Regarding trains, is TRENITALIA the best website to book trains? Prices seem OK, but it is not clear how or if you can reserve seats, or choose a private compartment. Are there other trains we can choose from?

Thanks for any feedback.

When you book trains on Trenitalia, part of the process is that you select seats, and the seats are displayed on your ticket.
You can get a group of four seats, 2 + 2, facing each other.
Trains have a bar/buffet car.

Karl, I suggest you start a new post, with your revised travel plans. Re Venice, stay in the historical centre. Marghera is an industrial zone. Ditto Mestre.

The app Rome2rio is good for planning, and the app Chebateo for vaporetto (waterbus) routes in Venice.