Advice for first time to Italy, honeymoon, and jetlag

1) There are two airports in Milan. Linate, a small airport close to the city that has flights to a couple of major European hubs, and Malpensa, a larger airport a bit outside the city with flights to more or less every large European city as well as a couple of intercontinental flights. In addition, Bergamo airport is often called "Milan" by low cost airlines, but forget about that. Both Malpensa and Linate will work fine, Linate will be a slightly better experience as it is a smaller airport but if you insist on flying to Linate your selection of flights will be much more limited.

Rome has one airport to choose from, Fiumicino, apart from a smaller airport used by low cost airlines, but forget about that one. Alitalia once had direct flights from Rome to Los Angeles, it remains to be seen if ITA will pick up the route.

but if it saves us more than $500 bucks, it could sway me, lol.

Is that total or per person?

As it is you have 13 nights in Italy; cutting it to 11 seems unwise

May 7 -21
Do you leave LA on the 7th or is that you arrival day in Italy?
Do you leave Italy on the 22nd?

I think you need to recheck your math on how many nights you have. ( The only way I can get 15 nights is that you arrive on the 7th and fly out on the 22nd-- Or I may need one more cup of coffee)

Badger |
Okay, I’ll look at MXP and FCO

Joe32F |

$500+ total.
I agree with you, unless we can save more than $500+ total, it might sway me
May 7th travel day.
May 22nd is Sunday, but we both have work the next day, so I don't know how bad jet lag will affect us, coming back to California.
It would be nice to fly out of Rome on Sunday, but I wanted to reach out and hear people's feedback.
As far as the schedule, it will need to be adjusted as you have already guessed. I will adjust based on what people hear have to say, especially if Sunday is feasible.

If you use a website like Google flights, it will be easy to check fares for multiple dates on the same itinerary. I suspect you'll find Saturday is a comparatively inexpensive day to fly, but I suppose that could vary by origin and destination. Business-class seats tend to be very, very expensive (the extra charge will swamp any $500 saving you might find by shifting dates); I don't know how business-class fares vary by day of the week, because I've never been willing to pay the freight.

I looked at coach and business-class fares for your dates, and it doesn't appear there are currently major differences if you shift a day. However, the devil is in the details, and the best way to look at this is to examine the flight options and make a note of the ones you consider acceptable (reasonable number of transfers and amount of transfer time, etc.), then see how those specific fares change as you alter your travel dates. I haven't done that.

Edited to add:

One other thought: It's very difficult to predict what will happen with fares over time, except that it's rarely financially productive to wait to buy the tickets until shortly before you travel. You may be looking at changing planes multiple times. Never fun. One pattern I think often plays out is that the fare gap between the "best" flights on any given day (no extra connections, no super-risky, short layovers or mind-numbingly long ones) and worse flights tends to widen over time. The more important it is to you that you not spend a lot of extra time on the flights, the more I'd advise you not to dilly-dally too much about buying the airline tickets. However, these days we all need to realize that our carefully-selected flight itinerary may be changed by the airline more than once. One might reasonably question how much extra to pay for the "best" flight if the odds that it will actually run on that schedule are not so great. And when there are connections involved, that increases the risk that the original schedule will not hold.

Unfortunately, people vary in how they are affected by jetlag, so other people's experiences are not predictive of yours. I don't have that much problem flying westward (back to the US); I think that's the easier direction for most people, partly because it's not an overnight flight. However, there are plenty of folks who report having more trouble flying back home. I used to fly home on Sunday and go to work Monday without too much difficulty. I'd say whether you should risk that depends to a considerable degree on your jobs. I had a desk job; I wasn't a doctor, a bus driver or a heavy-machine operator.

Google tells me Italy has holidays on May 1 and June 2. You'll miss both of those. There could be something local going on during the time of your visit, though.

@acraven |

I agree with most points. Both of us aren't doctors, lol. But, still need to perform.

Business-class - never done before, but I figure that, if they lie flat, that might help combat any jet lag both ways. I know the price balloons with it, but since this will be the longest flight of our lives, and it's our honeymoon, it might be worth it. I think SWISS is the cheapest business I could find that had lie-down seats. I guess I should have said if I can save more than $500 on a flight then we would consider losing a day.

So I might need to adjust the itinerary (although people say Bologna is amazing for food, So I'm torn on where to lose a day/night)...

Congrats on planning your honeymoon to Italy! Others have weighed in on the flight situations, so I will just say that I strongly recommend NOT planning to return to work the day after you arrive home. Even if everything goes perfectly, you are going to be exhausted and having to deal with a major time zone change. I've traveled to Europe five times over the years and always gave myself at least two days after arrival day before I went back to work. Flying first class home might help a little, but I think give yourselves at least one full day after arrival day before returning to work. Buon Viaggio!

Is there a reason you’re not flying into Venice, with your itinerary that makes the most sense.
It also saves a day and is a much softer intro to Italy.

You could also do one night in Bologna, it’s only 38 minutes by fast train to Florence.

Consider both of these.

@gerri |
I didn't think about that. I'll look into Venice as well. Any cons flying into Venice? Price? major airline exclusions, etc.?

Thanks for the feedback. We will probably fly out on Sat. based on the jet-lag feedback.

Wanted to see the outdoor mall and the duomo was the main reason for stopping by, plus we will be in a funk, so people say this is a good, easy, intro into the trip and not be overwhelmed the first day.

The first day back is hardest to acclimate to the time change, but I still fly home the day before going to work. If you can begin work earlier in the day instead of later that will help because you may wake up at 2a and not be able to fall back to sleep. Your body will begin to shut down late in the afternoon and trying to stay awake until 9p will be challenging. I hope you don’t have a long distance to drive home from work if you aren’t able to work from home that day.
I question on whether you would sleep on the return in business class seats because I can’t. Unless you get up during the middle of the night to fly home then maybe you’ll be able to sleep a bit but the sun will be shining on your way back. The more rested you are the more challenging it will be to sleep.
Sometimes Sundays and Fridays are more expensive days to travel so check returning on Saturday. Trust me you’ll appreciate having an extra day before returning to work so you can grocery shop and do laundry and be more rested on Monday.

Flying IN to Venice is easy
Great place to start your trip

Flying OUT of Venice is often an issue as flights leave super early and getting to airport is a bit of work ( not impossible just more complicated)

re: airports. The way you should look at it is that you are more likely to find direct flights to and from MXP and FCO than the other airports.

Many of the flights from the US to Milan will have you arriving in the late morning, when you won't be able to check into a hotel anyway, so you might as well take the train to Venice, rather than spend a jet lagged afternoon and night in Milan. But I too would fly into Venice even with another connection, since you're spending no time in Milan anyway.

Everyone reacts differently to jet lag, but think of it not so much as a result of lack of sleep, but as a change in your body's clock. When you arrive in Italy, it will be morning, but your body will think its the middle of the night (as it is back home) so it wants to be asleep. On the return, when you arriving home, your body will think its the time of the place you left from. It takes longer to adjust, but since you are home you'll just be getting up earlier than you normally would. There are a lot of tips on how to deal with it.

I normally fly business class and hardly ever get jet lag. It takes me a couple of days to change my body clock but I can still function.

There is a train the goes directly from MXP to the center of Milan. There is also a train that goes from Rome to FCO.

Hi there and congratulations! We honeymooned in Italy and celebrated our five year anniversary there as well so I have to say you’ve made a wonderful choice ;)

I definitely agree with the suggestion to fly into Venice. It’ll save you time and a train ticket. Even if it costs a bit more than Milan, it could be worth it. I hope you go out to Burano while you’re in Venice; it’s really special.

I’d recommend a subscription to Scott’s Cheap Flights if you travel much. It’s saved us a fortune in flights over the years.

My husband and I are in are late 30s and so far do ok with jet lag going back to the US. I think it’s easier than going through opposite direction. YMMV. I just can’t ever bring myself to splurge on business class tickets. I always think of the nice meals I could eat, the experiences I could splurge on, or the souvenirs I could bring home, etc. But maybe it’s worth it for you!

If you end up flying directly into Venice and have an extra night to allocate, you might consider a quick overnight in Orvieto. It’s a magical place. We spent a few nights there on our honeymoon and really fell in love with the place. I can’t recommend it enough!

One more suggestion - Villa d’Este in Tivoli makes a lovely day trip out of Rome in the spring. It’s really charming and a breath of fresh air from the city.

I hope you have a fantastic honeymoon!

Wow! Great responses! Let me clarify some things to help:

Both work from home, but demanding jobs, starting at 9am PST.

Sounds like business class might be a good option flying into Italy, then Premium/ Economy plus flying back into California?

I thought the Duomo and Outdoor mall might be a cool intro into Italy (remember, never been before). Those two things and dinner before going to sleep to catch the the fast train to Venice the next day?

As far as flying into airports, definitely will use the main ones (MXP or Venice, and FCO). We will definitely be flying home through Rome.

Wow, I'll I can say is one big city per trip is enough. All the joy and fun is in the small towns. Venice, Rome, and some small towns in the middle work best for me. No more that two to four hours per move or your day will be wasted. Venice-Orvieto-Sorrento-Rome is a nice mix. Enjoy your trip. J

One important bit of advice......book your airline tickets directly with the airline. You might see great deals through third party websites but don't. If problems occur, most of these sites can be very difficult to deal with.

We will probably fly out on Sat. based on the jet-lag feedback

Excellent idea. The day after you get back, come 2PM, your body will think its 11PM and start to go into 'sleep mode'.

@ Aimee

Unfortunately, we can't request more than 10 business days. so it looks like we will be flying in sat and leaving on a sat.

As far as jet lag, are you saying it's easier to adjust to going to Italy, vs leaving Italy? One of the things I'm trying to figure out is if we fly there in business class, or fly home in business class; can't afford both. But this is our honeymoon, so want to surprise her with one. So, got to figure out which route to use it on...

are you saying it's easier to adjust to going to Italy, vs leaving Italy?

For me it is. Since you’re coming from the west coast, I would fly business on the way there. You’ll sleep better because it'll be night time. When you’re coming home it will be daylight.

@ MaryPat

|| That makes sense! thank you!

Are you able to take a flight Friday at ~7PM? ( to Milan)
OR
I see a 9PM LAX-VCE

Definitely biz class going over and premium econ on the way back

@ joe32F

I can try to ask the wife. She gets off at 5 pm.

However, LAX is 1.5 hrs south of us, with no traffic.

So highly unlikely that we could make a flight before 9 pm. don't want to cause any unnecessary stress.
Don't you need to be at the airport 3 hrs ahead of the flight, plus extra time for covid screening?

I think SWISS is the cheapest business I could find that had lie-down
seats. I guess I should have said if I can save more than $500 on a
flight then we would consider losing a day.

For good business class, look at TAP and SAS as well. Both offer great business class at not that horrible prices.

Any cons flying into Venice?

Venice is a much smaller airport so the selection of flights will be smaller. But, who knows, you might find a flight that suits you?

You've received a lot of good advice from the other posters so I won't belabor their points.
What caught my eye was the fact that you'll be flying to Italy from LAX. That 9 hour time change is going to be a real bear for you to deal with, not only on the flights over and back but while you're in Italy trying to "see everything" ... all while your body clock is crying out for sleep.
Nothing generates more discussion here than how to deal with jet lag. There are plenty of home-grown strategies about how to prepare and how to pace your days in order to minimize the effects - none of which ever worked for me back when I had to travel on business across multiple time zones. The lifesaver for me was the solution that most professional business travelers rely on - which is to pick up a prescription for Ambien, a sleeping aid that my wife and I still rely on for our international trips. With it we're able to sleep soundly on the redeye flight over, but more importantly are able to slip seamlessly into a new sleep routine once we arrive at our destination, ie no more tossing and turning all night because our inner clock is insisting that it's only 4 PM body time.
Talk to your doctor about it and consider whether it might be the best solution for you. It sure has been for us.

We fly to Europe out of SFO, so the time and issues are similar. For me, jet lag is worse flying west. If you can swing bc, do it. That transatlantic haul is a real torment.
For a 1st visit to Italy, I would skip Milan and just fly to Venice. As for the Duomo, there are so many spectacular churches in Italy (Rome, e.g., not to mention the Duomo of Florence) you’ll get your fill without that one. I’d also drop Bologna. There is great food all over Italy. With that extra time you can include some day trips from the other 3 cities, and you will save the time lost to transit, at least half a day each time you move.
If you decide to do as I am suggesting, let us know. People will be full of suggestions for fabulous day trips out of any of the “big three.”

@ Badger

I will look into TAP and SAS as well. Thank you!

@ Robert

Hey, Robert. My mom lives in Colorado Springs! is there an over-the-counter alternative you would recommend in place of Ambien? I currently don't have a doctor (military vet, in-transition). Or do I need a doctor to get Ambien?

@ Rosalyn

Hello! So if we drop Milan and Bologna, per your suggestion, and fly straight to Venice...

What do you recommend as a day trip from the big "3'? Also, the goal is to use fast trains and not rent a car, so hopefully, that helps with your day trip suggestions. Unless we really need to rent one! Trying to relax and cut out unnecessary stress if possible, lol.

Day trips... choose one for each city.

Venice...Padua, Vicenza, Verona.

Florence... Siena, Lucca. Lots of availability of combined tours to several towns.

Rome... Orvieto, Villa d’Este, Ostia Antica.

When looking at flights, try to have your layover in Europe, more availability of additional flights. In case your flight is delayed. Make sure you have ample connection times. I prefer at least somewhere around two hours.

Cory, There really is no OTC alternative nearly as effective as the real thing.
You do need to consult with a Doctor in order to get the prescription. Some people (less than 1% I think) have reported a bad reaction to it ... a blood chemistry thing apparently, so you'll want to try it at home in a controlled environment before departing on your trip.
As a recently retired Vet maybe you could hit the walk-in clinic on a nearby military base (Pt Mugu or Vandenberg?) - they can probably do it for you there at minimal cost.

@ Robert

Good idea, I can try to see if the base has an option, although I don't have a primary Care Doctor, or any doctor/insurance currently.

I could also try the VA maybe? If I can get it, any recommendations on how to use I prior to the trip, to get adjusted? (I guess that's what the Doc is for)

Try it once before the trip to verify that you're not one of the very small percentage of users who have a reaction to it (other than sleep that is). Once that's established just get yourself some soft earplugs, some eye shades, and maybe a wraparound pillow to keep your head from wobbling around and you'll be good to go on the day of travel.
As mentioned before, it's real value is to help us settle into a new sleep routine once we arrive in Europe - something we always struggle with otherwise.
For info, our Air Force son reports that they prescribe Ambien to deployed flight crew personnel to help them adjust quickly when on overseas exercises.

Edited to add: we've found that a particular advantage of Ambien versus most OTC sleeping aids is that there's no drug hangover once we wake up, so we're able to head out immediately, - clear-headed, alert and well rested - for a day of exploring.

If it for some reason doesn't work out to get the Ambien (which I have never used), you could try Melatonin or Dramamine (not the non-drowsy variety). Those make most people sleepy. So do antihistamines. All of those are available over-the-counter. But it's important to do at least one test run at home to be sure you don't have an odd reaction. I wouldn't do it when you need to work the next day, because you might end up fuzzy-brained. I have a relative who gets hyper if he takes an antihistamine, and a whole Dramamine really knocks me over, so I take half a pill. Melatonin doesn't hit me as hard if I take a small dose (3 mg), and some people definitely need more.

Note: I'm not saying any of those OTC options are as effective as Ambien; I suspect they're better at making you sleepy than at keeping you asleep for 5+ hours. Also, I am not a doctor!

Staying hydrated, eating lightly and avoiding alcohol are other common recommendations for getting through long flights. Some people go to the trouble of trying to shift their sleep schedules prior to the trip so they're closer to European time. I've never done that. I can tell you one thing that's the kiss of death: Not getting any sleep the night before you fly. Starting out totally dead and then barely dozing (if at all) on the plane is not something one recovers from quickly.

Gerri’s day trip suggestions are all good. I think that when choosing, you might try to touch on the different periods of Italy’s history. Orvieto, for example, is strong on the Etruscans, as well as having an extraordinarily beautiful cathedral, built mostly in the 14th century. Vicenza is famous for its Palladian architecture (high Renaissance). Ostia is a remnant of ancient Rome. Most of the towns have buildings from the medieval period. A guided day trip out of Florence to some towns in the Tuscan countryside and which included some wine tasting sounds very appealing.

@ Rosalyn

These are great suggestions as well! Thank you.

For our first trip to Italy, we really don't want to deal with driving or the extra stress that comes from it. So for the most part any day trips, out of the big "3", (maybe 2 nights in Bologna, based on the feedback from here) we would ideally like to use fast-trains or the next smoothest/easiest option.

Good day,

I will attempt to address your points individually.

1. The "best" is such an opinionated term it's hard to nail down one absolute best airline/airport. I have never had a problem at FCO, MXP, or VCE, the only airports I have ever arrived at when traveling to Italy. I am a Delta Sky Miles user so you won't be surprised that KLM (a Sky Team member) is my absolute favorite airline. I look for the three "C"s when flying, comfort, courtesy and cleanliness and KLM exceeds in all of these areas. If you are an inexperienced international traveler I'd suggest giving yourself plenty of time if you have layovers. I prefer 2-3 hours but, once you get the hang of things you might be comfortable with less time. AMS (Schipohl) is an easy airport to navigate as all of the terminals are under one roof. We made a 50 minute international connection there once but I wouldn't recommend it. But if I had to say which airport I prefer I'd have to be vague and say that I prefer the one that offers the flight/layover schedule that best meets my itinerary. KLM is my airline, the most accommodating airport for my schedule, Those are my pick and suggestions.

2. Jet lag has never been an issue for me but you're return is a bit longer than mine. When fly into IAH or DFW and we just force ourselves to stay up until the local bedtime hour when we get back home. That makes for a long day but it also makes sleeping easier and the next day more manageable. I'd suggest Business class for the trip overseas but not coming home. It's more conducive to hit the ground in Europe running when you have had a good sleep on the flight over. Heading home my intention is to stay awake so Premium Economy is good enough and much cheaper.

3. I have found that Tuesdays and Saturdays are the cheapest days to fly internationally. There have been some exceptions to this but for the most part I have found it to be true. Of course you have to consider the bang for your buck too. Check all of the flights associated with your trip and I'd suggest checking a day or two earlier on the departure and a day of two later on the return. Often I have planned a 10 day trip and ended up making it 12-13 days because the airfare was cheaper if I extended and often by enough to offset the cost of additional hotel nights. I typically book my flights first and then book hotels but that's a personal preference.

4. I think your itinerary sounds amazing. The only thing I'd suggest is that you give Milan one more day, which could be taken from Florence. Of course this depends on your tastes and what you like to see/do on trips. I am a lover of art and history and Milan has so much to see in those areas. I'd love to see your detailed itinerary for each of your days too. Many sites require advanced reservations which fill up quickly so keep that in mind.

We are flying into MXP on May 29 ourselves. We are focusing our trip on the small towns between Milan and Venice (Mantua, Cremoa, Vicenza, Verona, etc). I don't think you have any major Italian holidays to deal with and I think we just have one (June 2).

Good luck and if I can be of any further assistance please let me know.

@ Jack

Great points, Jack! I will try to post our detailed itinerary next week when we discuss it with our agent.

since we only have 13 nights, I think the wife wants to do this schedule now:

3 nights in Venice --------> Fast train to Bologna (2hrs)
2 nights in Bologna --------> Fast train to Florence (1hrs)
3 nights in Florence --------> Fast train to Rome (3hrs)

5 nights in Rome

Hi and congratulations, Cory!
I like your itinerary, and think the advice to fly into Venice was a solid. That's going to be a good spot for your intro to Italy. Honestly, I wouldn't obsess too much about the jet-lag thing? As expressed many times above, it affects all of us differently so there's no telling how it will hit (or not) you and your bride.

My OT and I have never been able to sleep going either direction (we fly coach) and I don't know as a seat that flattens would make any difference. It's the anticipation going over that keeps us up, and who-knows-what coming home. We were also able to hit the office on Monday and function even with a Sunday flight, although our MN location doesn't have us traveling as far home as you will be. Still, if you're more comfortable with a Saturday return, then go for it! :O)

A sleep aid? If you can't get a prescription drug, try OTC Zzzquil. That's what I'm using for my gals-of-a-certain-age insomnia and it almost always works. You'd have to put some into 3 oz. containers for your carryon; the rest in in your checked bag IF checking one. I've not yet used it for our trips abroad, 'cuz the insomnia thing has become more of an issue since the last adventure, but plan to next time. Also, Melatonin didn't do a thing for me but might for you. Pack ear plugs too.

You're going to have so much fun!!!!

3 nights in Venice --------> Fast train to Bologna (2hrs)
2 nights in Bologna --------> Fast train to Florence (1hrs)
3 nights in Florence --------> Fast train to Rome (3hr)

If you mean only the time actually spent on trains, those times are all wrong.

It's 1h33 from Venice to Bologna and 37 minutes from Bologna to Florence. Above all, it takes 1 hour and 32 minutes from Florence to Roma Termini station not 3 hours.

What site are you using to look up the train schedules? The journey times you listed seem the times made by Intercity and Regionale trains, not by the high speed ones.

Maybe Cory rounded up the numbers to account for time at the stations finding the platforms, waiting for the trains, leaving the next station, etc?

@ Kathy

Thank you for the info! I will check out zzQuil. As for travel, we hope to do it in all carry-ons, if possible.
So, maybe see if there is a zzzQuil in a pill form? (So we can carry it in our carry-ons)

That's something else I should have asked: Anyone know what you can bring for luggage. I know in the states I can bring a regular backpack and a small carry-on?

@ Dario

I rounded up for the trains. I like to err on the cautious side; I factor in delays, travel to the station, etc.

As far as luggage-
Each airline will have very specific info about what you can carry on

Z-Quil does come in pill form--we've used it for travel in the past. Doesn't work well for me unfortunately as I just can't sleep in coach. Our next flight over in March will be our first time in business class (booked with points so we aren't paying for it) and I'm hoping that makes a difference!

Just my two cents as a fellow West Coaster: I wouldn't plan your travel schedule around the possibility of jet lag, especially if you work from home. We are flying back to Seattle from Florence on a Sunday in March and will both be working on Monday. As others have said, jet lag impacts everyone differently and you may be completely fine. I have a harder time on the way TO Europe because as I mentioned, I just can't sleep on that flight over and that tends to mess me up for a few days. I find coming back this way to be much easier as it's a daytime flight. Of course we're tired for a few days, but it's never been anything unmanageable. In fact, we spent the entire month of August 2021 in Italy, flew to Boston on a Sunday, and the following day we were up and out of the house to have lunch with my in-laws and then flew to Seattle that evening and went back to work on Tuesday and we managed just fine. Again, these are all just anecdotal and I don't want to minimize other experience who DO struggle with jet lag. Just making the point that I would always go for more time on vacation, personally! We're the same age as you two, btw.

@ Rachael

-- sounds good, I will talk to the wife about coming back on a Sunday, vs the Sat.
I agree more vacation is always better.

Well, rounding up 1 hour and half to 3 hours seems more pessimistic than cautious to me, but better pessimistic than late.

I will talk to the wife about coming back on a Sunday, vs the Sat.
I agree more vacation is always better.

Any chance your wife's employer will let her off early on Friday so you can leave then. I think that is a better solution ( for one more day) than the Sunday return and work Mon AM. Might want to point out to the employer getting off a couple hours early on Friday is better than a fuzzy brained Monday after the return. Play the "it's our delayed honeymoon" card.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

I'm not a fan of the lie-flat beds-I don't find them at all comfortable. My husband is very much a fan, but he always flies back to US in premium economy since it's during the day.

Zzzquill equals mostly Benadryl (diphenhydramine) most commonly taken for allergies. Dirt cheap generically in capsules.

You're right, John. It's just weird that for some reason Zzzquil seems to works better/faster for me. Go figure.