Prague-Germany-Amsterdam itinerary help please

I think your desire to see some cities, some WW II historical sites, a pretty little town, a castle, a picturesque river, and lovely countryside makes sense. It's just that you have a lot of miles to cover in a relatively short time period, and you don't want to spend a huge percentage of your time in transit. But take heart, our German experts (I am not one) will be able to help you. I know they've posted in the past about towns equally as attractive as Rothenburg, with similar architecture. I'm sure they can suggest some geographically-appropriate possibilities, then you can Google for photos to be sure you select one that's appealing to you. The same goes for the castle. There are lots of castles in western Germany, and I bet you can visit one in the area of your day on the river without having to make a special trip to Neuschwanstein.

I've been to Rothenburg, and it is very cute, but if you can find similar architecture in a town where not every building is a café or shop selling tourist kitsch, for me that is a very good thing.

You might consider visiting the Dutch Resistance Museum while you're in Amsterdam.

For Germany, that's pretty much the standard American tourist itinerary. Nothing wrong with that if that's what you want to see and like to stay with the crowds of American tourists.

As we just talked about in some other thread though, it's not like you've seen Germany when you've seen Neuschwanstein and Rothenburg. You've seen what all guide books tell you you need to see. There are many other options, and most of them will give you a more authentic Germany experience.

Why don't you, just for the fun of it, enter your starting point (Prague) and your destination (Amsterdam) into Google maps, and see where that takes you in between:

• Fascinating towns like Dresden, Meißen, Leipzig, Berlin, Braunschweig on your route, or, if you take the more southern route, Nuremberg, Würzburg, Frankfurt, Rhine valley.
• Beautiful nature reserves like the Elbsandsteingebirge, Harz (if you like trains, check out the Brockenbahn!) etc. nearby or almost on your route.
• If your children are such history buffs, you should really have a look at Berlin. There is no place with more history in Germany than Berlin.
• Castles and palaces: Tons of them in the Rhine area. Or check out Potsdam.

But I also want to do some non-touristy stuff

Like what?

Hahaha, y'all don't hold back, I love it. I admit I feel a little bad for being told I am (in different words), basically, just a dumb American, but I want to get educated. I will look more carefully over the posted replies and I truly do appreciate them. I want to expose my kids to other cultures, eat delicious food, and see beautiful art, architecture and nature. I know 11 days is just a moment, but I want it to be a memorable, fun, adventure for us.

So in my defense, I used RS for planning a lot of Italy and it was perfect for my family. But I get it now that Germany is a different animal. I agree we are attempting to cover a lot of ground, maybe I can revise and not do Munich (not set in stone). I like the idea of Berlin, I did want to see Bavaria, but it isn't the end of the world if it doesn't happen on this trip, I know there will be others (!) I will see if my kids are game. Does anyone have a Prague-Berlin-Amsterdam itinerary to propose? Or something totally different? (I did see some interesting ideas on a reply), I'm sorry I don't have the name of the poster, but thank you!

I don't know exactly what non-touristy stuff I want to do, but maybe see a working farm, bicycle or hike somewhere beautiful, visit a winery or monastery or something...? I'm open to suggestions. What is the most awesome thing you did in Germany?

(Gotta go back to work, but will think more about this!) Thanks to the posters who have replied.

Hi,

Read up on The Rough Guide Germany. It provides a good overview and more. The non-tourist stuff are esoteric historical sites if you are into history. If not, then forget it. Different nationalities of tourists generally have different tourist agendas, the German tourists have theirs, likewise with American tourists and British tourists.

On WW2 unless you are well familiar with the history of events/sites you want to see, I suggest A Beevor's on WW2, as well that of Andrew Roberts to get the recent literature on the subject. If you want to see Germany, go elsewhere than just Bavaria.

Since Lubitsch mentioned Buchenwald:

It's a particularly interesting site since after the war it was used to house enemies of the state (DDR). There's an English-language binder you can borrow to read about that period. The camp is outside the small, historically-important city of Weimar and accessible by public bus, though for a family of four a taxi in at least one direction might make sense. Weimar is attractive, but the university city of Erfurt (where I based myself for seeing Weimar and Eisenach--a pretty town with an interesting if not outstandingly beautiful castle) is visually special. Erfurt survived the war and has beautiful buildings, a merchants' bridge and two cathedrals. Its streets are lively because of the university. This area also has a number of Martin Luther connections. (Sorry to be vague, but I'm not religious.)

I loved Berlin for its museums and 20th-century historical sights, but I wouldn't recommend it on such a short trip when you're already committed to Prague and Amsterdam. After giving due time to those two cities and allowing for travel, you don't have many days left, and I know you want to see some smaller places. Berlin would suck up just about all the time you have left. Maybe you can include it in your next trip. For a capital city it's very affordable.

Hi,

You have very much a time constraint. That being the case, just focus of two places, Berlin and Munich, or Berlin and Leipzig or Dresden, or Frankfurt and Berlin. To get the most time with these 11 days, I would include taking the night train between Berlin and Munich via Hannover. No problem at all with me on that, but your kids may not be so delighted. So, if you leave early in the morning, with 4-6 hrs, you'll arrive at the next destination.

It's fine if you focus Bavaria but it is representative of Germany, only Bavaria.

For your kids' interest in WW2, there is a lot to see in Berlin connected with war's history, even sites in Potsdam. Just a matter of time and energy expended to track them down.

I think you are just fine. First time in Germany, stick to the tried and true. You have kids along and may well have your hands full. Rothenburg is great. Because it is touristy, it has tourist infrastructure and things to do, like the Nightwatchman tour with Herr Baumgartner's well timed dry humor. The Crime and Punishment Museum will be hit with your son. Just make sure he doesn't get any ideas about things he can do to little sister.

I would not rent a car to go from Prague to Munich. Bus is the fastest, but the direct ALX train is only an hour longer and you can move around the train and stretch the legs. There is one at 7:33 will get to Munich early afternoon. You might find the best price buying tickets in Prague. There are child-parent compartments available, at least to the German border.

You can use a Bayern ticket to get to Rothenburg from Munich on local trains, and it is just a little longer than with more expensive fast trains. It is only 31 EUR for the whole family. I like staying 2 nights as the town settles down after the day trippers clear out. My calculations show that will be a Saturday, so you can travel earlier than 9 am.

Now here is how I suggest you do the trip to Cologne. Buy a "Quer durchs Land" ticket for 52 EUR, again that covers the whole family. Should be a Monday, so you must start after 9 am and use local trains. That will get you to Bingen Stadt by 1:59 pm. Walk 10 minutes to the K-D dock and take the 2:30 pm K-D boat to Boppard by 4:50 pm. 15 minute walk to Boppard train station and get a 5:52 pm train to Koblenz and change to a local train to Cologne arriving at 7:28 pm, or wait for a 6:12 direct train that gets to Cologne at 8:02 pm. You don't need to buy tickets because the Quer durchs Land ticket is still valid. I think, (but am not sure) that the QdL ticket also gets you a discount for the K-D boat as well.

For Cologne to Amsterdam, buy Saver tickets at least 3 months ahead of time to get a good price, and go ahead and buy seat reservation for 4.50 EUR each, perhaps around a table.

PS and all this presumes you will be traveling RS style. Kids with small roller boards with their own clothes and toiletries, parents add small back packs for family items.

Nice try but the first one isn't very good. To expand on one of Anna's routing suggestions... Here's a doable itinerary with the suggested number of nights in each stop. It includes Bavaria and some (real) castles, and provides good variety.

• Prague (3)

• Nuremberg (3) (with a day trip to Beer Mecca and World Heritage Site Bamberg and/or Rothenburg)

• Würzburg (0) - but stick your bag in a locker and spend a day there on the way to...

• Rhine valley (3) - that's 2 days to cruise, tour 2-3 castles, hike the Rhine Castle Trail, sip wine. (St. Goar is good for train users.)

• Cologne (0) - but stop there like you did in Würzburg on the way to...

• Amsterdam (3)

It's fine if you focus Bavaria but it is representative of Germany,
only Bavaria.

Am I right in thinking that you may have forgotten a tiny little word in there that would give this sentence a whole different meaning? ;-)

maybe see a working farm

Too bad you have such a tight schedule, or I'd recommend a couple of days of "Ferien auf dem Bauernhof" (vacation on a farm). There are a lot of those around, and kids love them. Not sure if this makes sense for only a day though.

For finding a working farm where you can just sort of take a tour and look at everything, maybe do your itinerary first and then see where you will be going. There are rural areas everywhere, and it would make most sense to find something nearby where you are going anyway.

bicycle or hike somewhere beautiful

Bicycle: There are dedicated bike lanes in many parts of Germany, and lots of routes you can take. You can bike downhill along rivers. Or bike in the flat areas of Northern Germany. Or mountain bike - well, in the mountains, I guess.

Hiking: As I mentioned before, the Harz or the Elbsandsteingebirge for instance. And just about everywhere else. You see a forest, a mountain, a trail... you can walk there. It's not like in some countries where everything is private and full of "no trespassing" signs. :-)

visit a winery

Along the Rhine it should be easy to find one. Of course along the Moselle or anywhere in the state of Baden-Württemberg.

or monastery or something...?

There are lots of beautiful and famous monasteries, usually with amazing medieval churches. Maulbronn. Maria Laach. Loccum. Münsterschwarzach. Heiligengrabe. Erfurt. Wouldn't know where to begin. You would have to tell us where you are going first, and then we'll find one for you.

What is the most awesome thing you did in Germany?

Live here? ;-)

Joking aside, the most awesome vacations I spent in Germany were nowhere near Neuschwanstein. They were in parts of Germany that are probably blank in your guide books. :-)

The assertion that "the last thing you should be reading is the RS Germany guide" is ridiculous! If you've never been to Germany then it is a very good place to start! Of course there are a lot of really great places that RS doesn't mention, but for a first trip the RS guide is an excellent starting place!

The only thing I see wrong with your original proposed itinerary is that it is indeed covering a LOT of ground in a very short amount of time. Since you've already bought your tickets that's really a mute point. I'd stick with it!

Sorry, Lubitsch, I was also dealing with questions about Spain and Italy today. I'll correct the spelling. My comment about the castle was meant as a warning that it isn't all prettified like Neuschwanstein. I took the tour and know that it has historic importance.

Sorry...the sentence is meant to say "If you focus ON Bavaria, it is NOT representative of Germany, only Bavaria." I had better proof read.

Hahaha, y'all don't hold back, I love it. I admit I feel a little bad
for being told I am (in different words), basically, just a dumb
American, but I want to get educated.

We Germans do have the reputation of being direct. :-) However, I would never say or even think that anyone is "just a dumb American". I'd be just as dumb traveling to any place for the first time.

Now when we are traveling to a place for the first time, of course we all want to see the iconic sights. We may move on to the smaller things on a second trip maybe. For the U.S., those iconic sights might be things like the Golden Gate Bridge and Niagara Falls and the NYC skyline.

The thing is, Americans and foreign travelers can probably agree on most of those iconic sights in the U.S.. Germans and foreign travelers to Germany cannot. We are not thrilled by the idea of having a second- or third-class attraction like Neuschwanstein turned into "our" iconic sight while Germany has so many first class attractions to offer. Just have a look at the list of UNESCO world heritage sites in Germany.

Wouldn't you feel ridiculed if everyone came to the U.S. to see Hearst Castle and Alcatraz and then say they've seen America?

The one recurring problem that I indeed see with American (and
Australian) tourists is that they directly transplant their travel
style of crossing huge distances ... which might be appropriate in
their own countries which are much more thinly populated and much
larger, but is totally wrong for Europe.

That is certainly true. No European would ever think of doing Amsterdam and Prague in a single vacation. Why would anyone want to do that? They are in completely different parts of Europe. Even Americans - used as they are to traveling great distances - would not travel New England and the Grand Canyon in a single vacation, would they?

The fact that Americans usually have so little vacation time makes many of them feel like they have to experience all of Europe within two weeks, which doesn't make any sense and simply isn't possible.

(Not meaning to get into politics here, but there is something to be said for a regular six weeks annual vacation entitlement. :-) And as anyone can see, it hasn't hurt our economy, no matter what your employer lobbies may try to make you believe. ;-) )

The assertion that "the last thing you should be reading is the RS
Germany guide" is ridiculous! If you've never been to Germany then it
is a very good place to start! Of course there are a lot of really
great places that RS doesn't mention, but for a first trip the RS
guide is an excellent starting place!

I don't want to get into matters of taste here, and reading anything for a start is a good idea rather than relying solely on Wikivoyage and travel blogs. And I'll have to add that I haven't seen the RS Germany guide itself, so I really wouldn't want to pass judgment.

The table of contents in the Amazon preview does make me wonder though:
- 200 pages on Bavaria (Munich, castles, etc.) and Tirol, which is Austria, not Germany
- 100 pages on Salzburg - which is Austria again -, and more Bavaria
- 30 pages on Baden-Baden and the Black Forest
- 70 more pages on Bavaria (Rothenburg etc.)
- 100 pages (approximately) on the Rhine and Moselle valleys
- 40 more pages on Bavaria (Nürnberg)

Three or four of the other states of Germany get to share what's left of the book. The remaining ten or so states - many of them with world class sites - are nonexistent.

I am sorry to say this, but he might, in all honesty, have called the book "Bavaria and a few places around it".

BTW, this book probably is the reason why people on this forum keep writing things like "I am traveling to Munich, Nuremberg, and Bavaria". Looking at that table of contents, who would think that all those places - Munich, Würzburg, Nürnberg, Rothenburg - are located in Bavaria? They are not even in the Bavaria chapter!

Just to get the connection from this general guide book discussion to the OP's questions:

What is the most awesome thing you did in Germany?

I could name several things, and several places. None of them in this guide book.

None of them feasible on a small side trip between Prague and Amsterdam either.

Wow, so much to take in. I'm going to need some time to sort thorough it. I totally understand and appreciate the viewpoint that Prague to Amsterdam with Germany in between is not the ideal way to see Germany. But with all due respect, comparing it to seeing New England and the Grand Canyon in one trip is ridiculous. It is only a 8-9 hour drive between the two cities (I have made a drive like that on many vacations, easily done in one day). New England and the Grand Canyon are 35+ hours apart. Maybe it is more like trying to see Boston, New York and Washington DC on a single trip (which is not all that insane, if you are paying a lot to get to the area and want to see a few key places while you are there).

A European taking a vacation in Europe is very different than an American, obviously, it takes us a longer time to get there and costs a small fortune. How is it that odd that we would try to maximize our $ and vacation time and see as much as we can? I may only get 4 or 5 vacations to Europe in my life, many Americans may not even get more than 1, and even more may never get there. I am fortunate that this is my 2nd trip in 2 years. But I don't know if there will be another one for a while. I am excited to see both Prague and Amsterdam, and that we will get to go through Germany to do it. I know we will not even scratch the surface, but honestly, that's ok. It's about the experience with my family. I know we will have a great time, we have fun wherever we are. Maybe someday I'll get to come back and do Germany 'right'. But this trip, I have about 6 days to spend in the country and I want it to be as fun and magical as possible for me, my man, and my kids. I'm going to look at routes starting through Dresden, and focus on small-ish towns, and see what I can come up with. I think Munich is a bit far, and I like the idea of using trains and spending less time traveling. Thank you all, keep the suggestions coming and I will keep you posted (if you like) on my tentative itinerary as it evolves.

Here's one question-should I consider taking a day from Prague? I can allocate it to Germany, if that seems like a better plan. I honestly don't know what we are going to do for 3 days in Prague anyway...we are there over a Jewish holiday and I fear some of the sights my kids would be interested in might be closed. Is 2 days In Prague enough to get an idea? (Obviously 3 would be better but given my constraints, is there more for us to see in Germany itself?)

Prague: If you count your arrival day as a day for Prague, and arrival is from North America, you should keep in mind that Day 1 is mostly a blur for many. You've got security and customs, the airport to hotel transfer, check in... Maybe you slept overnight on the plane, but probably not as well as you needed - at least one or two of you are likely to be groggy. You'll want a shower and some down time, more than likely. So 3 nights might be 2.5 days of sightseeing. If you stay 2 nights that's just 1.5 days (unless you spend most of Day 3 in Prague and travel in the evening to Nuremberg.)

Very well said! The reason most Americans visiting Germany for the first time prefer Bavaria is because it is more in line of what we think of when we picture "old Germany", more faulkwork houses, quaint villages etc. There is a fairly big difference between southern Germany and Northern/Eastern Germany IMHO. I liked your original itinerary. I also very much like Rothenberg and would recommend it to any American on a first visit to Germany. I realize that's not a popular opinion with those living in Germany. If you want to skip Bavaria and want to add a small town you could consider Erfurt or Gorlitz. While I really enjoyed both of those I would still recommend Rothenberg over them. I would suggest you get on the DB website and play with times between different destinations you are considering.

Thanks Jill :)

And you make a good point Russ, we may be jetlagged so perhaps and extra day to relax will be good.

Now, there is a fake...Hearst Castle, went to it once since my folks were interested. We took the introductory tour. For their sake I went, otherwise I had no interest in that place at all, likewise with Alcatraz, no interest in that place. Yes, it is history, but I'll leave that to another person's historical interest.

If I were asked to recommend a travel guide on Germany by a first time visitor with more than just a superficial interest, the book by RS on Germany would not be that recommended book. As mentioned, I would tell that visitor to read carefully Rough Guide Germany and plan seeing Germany based on that book as well as other sources.

But with all due respect, comparing it to seeing New England and the
Grand Canyon in one trip is ridiculous.

In terms of pure absolute driving distance, yes. In terms of what Lubitsch correctly pointed out above, by no means:

... with American tourists is that they directly transplant their travel
style of crossing huge distances ... which might be appropriate in
their own countries which are much more thinly populated and much
larger, but is totally wrong for Europe. ... You aren't gaining
anything by jumping from hotel to hotel, you're losing time in
transit.

.

How is it that odd that we would try to maximize our $ and vacation
time and see as much as we can?

It's absolutely not odd at all, it's the most natural thing in the world. The point is, IMO, that it's an illusion to believe that you are going to get that by covering more ground. You are not going to see more by covering more miles.

So actually, all our advice has exactly that goal: help you maximize your $ and vacation time and see as much as you can.

Either way, there's no need for you to justify anything at all. You can travel any way you want for all I'm concerned if that's what makes you happy. But you asked for advice here, and that's what you are getting. :-)

The reason most Americans visiting Germany for the first time prefer
Bavaria is because it is more in line of what we think of when we
picture "old Germany"

Yes. That's the point. You want to see what you think of as Germany.

Now there are Germans who think of America as sort of an enlarged version of Disneyland. All garbage cans painted pink, everyone running around with a fake smile on their faces, commercialization in perfection. And I do know people who will steadfastly refuse to visit the United States for that reason. Others do visit, only in order to have their own picture of the country confirmed, and they'll come back and tell you how everyone smiled at them with a fake smile in their faces.

Of course, if that's how people want to go about traveling, it's their own choice, and if they enjoy it, sure, go right ahead. I'll certainly be the last one to try and stop them. Let them all crowd to Neuschwanstein or to Disneyland or wherever - so much more room at the really nice places!

But when people explicitly ask, why not tell them that there are other - maybe equally or much more interesting - options?

And what's wrong with telling them that we do not consider things like Neuschwanstein our first class attractions, and there are many towns as beautiful as Rothenburg but much less crowded?

And, let's be honest: Wouldn't you, deep down in your heart, resent having your country thought of as an enlarged version of Disneyland?

There is a fairly big difference between southern Germany and
Northern/Eastern Germany IMHO.

There sure is. But probably not in the sense that you mean, as "more faulkwork houses, quaint villages" (not quite sure what you mean by "faulkwork". I assume you mean half-timbered houses?). To be honest, I'd be curious how much of Northern/Eastern Germany you are familiar with to make such a broad statement. Have you seen Quedlinburg? Wernigerode? Goslar? Celle? Are you aware that in large parts of Bavaria, there are no true half-timbered houses at all?

There used to a night train connecting Prague and Amsterdam, unfortunately, no more. Depending on how you tailor your ride Prague to Amsterdam, it can be done with only one change of trains, instead of 2-4 changes which could also be the case.

Take the train direct Amsterdam to Berlin, change to an EC train to Prague, ie, you basically set aside this day for traveling and seeing the North German plain on the first ride.

@ ferrin...You won't see these half timbered houses (Fachwerkhäuser) in Bavaria if that's your intention. Towns north of the Main, ie north of Frankfurt are places to see such houses...Marburg, Soest/Westf. Minden, Hameln, ...all lovely places, to name a few.

I still say there is nothing wrong with your original itinerary.
That's why I don't post my itineraries on the Forum. A dozen people will tell me I'm doing it all wrong.

Tourists do tourist things. Everyone has seen Neuschwanstein in pictures, and they want to see it live. On the first trip to Germany, that's what many do. Now, if you go to Neuschwanstein on 4 trips in a row, I would say that you are too touristic.

Intro courses in University are the 101 courses. German Tourist 101 is Neuschwanstein, Rhine Cruise past Lorelei Rock, Munich Beer hall, Schloss Elz, Rothenberg, Berlin, and a concentration camp. Once you have done German Tourist 101, you can then move to German Tourist 201 (Erfurt, Dresden, Frankfurt, Nuremberg)

German Tourist 301 is maybe a town like Cottbus where we have friends. It is Leipzig for Bach, Stuttgart maybe, and other smaller off-the-normal track places.

Everyone who goes to France wants to go to Paris on the first trip. We've been to Paris 2-3x. So, this trip we went to Quimper and Bretagne, Chartres, and Dinan. These are less touristic. But we already did France Tourist 101. We are now onto France 301.

I would bet that our German friends, when they come to the US, want to see the Grand Canyon, New York City, Mt Rushmore, Niagara Falls, Washington DC, and Yosemite. These are the top US sights. First-time tourists do the conventional things.

As to the night train between Frankfurt and Berlin, I would not do that. My wife and I did that in May. The problem is that it has a 2:45 layover in Hannover, and there is nothing much open in the HauptBahnHof. In particular, there is only a bathroom in the McD. There is an all-night bakery with very nice pastry and coffee. Only CONTINUOUS night trains are good - those with layovers are not good for your ability to function the next day.

As to the night train between Frankfurt and Berlin, I would not do that. My wife and I did that in May. The problem is that it has a 2:45 layover in Hannover, and there is nothing much open in the HauptBahnHof. In particular, there is only a bathroom in the McD. There is an all-night bakery with very nice pastry and coffee. Only CONTINUOUS night trains are good - those with layovers are not good for your ability to function the next day.

" While at Frankfurt, you could do the Rhine cruise..."

I believe Paul is not suggesting you can board a Rhine cruise boat in Frankfurt - but instead suggesting that you transport yourself from Frankfurt to Rüdesheim, which is about 70 minutes by train from Frankfurt's main station, and catch a Rhine cruise boat there through the scenic part to the north (cruise takes about 1.7 hours to St. Goarshausen; return to Frankfurt by train.) The monument he refers to is the Niederwald monument. This map indicates the location of the cable car lift (Kabinenbahn), the town, and the monument. As you can see, there are hiking/walking trails up there, most of which provide good views.

I would bet that our German friends, when they come to the US, want to
see the Grand Canyon, New York City, Mt Rushmore, Niagara Falls,
Washington DC, and Yosemite. These are the top US sights.

Exactly. That's what I was trying to say above. We will probably agree about most of the top US sights.

We will not agree however about Neuschwanstein being one of the top Germany sights. :-)

That said, let me repeat for the umpteenth time that anyone may visit Neuschwanstein as much as they like for all I care. That's why I don't quite understand comments like this one:

A dozen people will tell me I'm doing it all wrong.

Now who said anything like that? Anyone can go on any itinerary they like, and if they're happy with it and enjoy their trip, good for them.

But if someone explicitly asks for advice, what's wrong with making alternative suggestions?

If they want to down play Neuschwanstein, they've got to quit plastering its image on their websites. Yeah, you Deutsche Bahn, and German Tourist Board.

https://www.bahn.com/en/view/offers/regional/regional-day-tickets.shtml?dbkanal_007=L04_S02_D002_KIN0060_REGIO-INDEX-LAENDERTICKETS-OBEN_LZ01

http://www.germany.travel/en/towns-cities-culture/top-100/germany-travel-attractions.html

I'd like to point out that the RS "21 day best of Europe" tour makes 3 stops in or around Germany. 1. Bacharach on the Rhein, 2. Rothenberg and 3. Ruette Austria - near Fussen and Neuschwanstein.

Now - I know that those that live in Germany will say he is ignoring some of the best of Germany, but those are the stops he chose and he chose them for a reason! I think to tell a new traveler that she should avoid these places because there are much better less touristed places does a disservice to that traveler.

"...those are the stops he chose and he chose them for a reason!"

And what is that reason? AFAIK he hasn't said why they're the best places to go. They just are - because.

Rick has made some real contributions to the travel industry and has some good suggestions for Germany, but I believe he himself has said his choices are very subjective. And each traveler is a little different. One size must fit all for his tours - but independent travelers should NOT feel obliged to follow the guru's tour routes and recommendations, IMHO.

Doing as Rick does can actually mean spending much of your Europe time with your fellow RS-guidebook-toting Americans. In his travel philosophy, Rick says that "...spending more money only builds a thicker wall between you and what you came to see." A good point - but then if all of us readers are "spending less" in Rick's favorite towns, inns and cafes, we run into that same wall. Rick has become a shepherd with way too many sheep. If you want to share the hotel breakfast room with your fellow Americans, be sure to follow all his recommendations.

So kudos to all of those informed and well-traveled contributors here who suggest alternatives to the over-touristed suggestions in Rick's books and tours. It's a generous service - not a disservice at all.

Of course, one can choose to go Neuschwanstein (I would not) and Rothenburg on his/her vacation in Germany, as Americans are most likely to do, but keep in mind you'll be there along with a ton of other international tourists. The two places are not just tourist goals of North Americans.

Talk to Germans presumably those you meet on trains, at breakfast, taverns, etc where Americans go in Germany, in English or German (even more revealing), they'll tell you exactly where since it's common knowledge.

I leave it up to the first time visitor to Germany to make the final choices, but if s/he asked me for recommendations for a 2-3 week trip in Germany, I would absolutely omit mentioning Neuschwanstein, Rothenburg and Füssen.

If they want to see cultural and history sites, tons of places can recommended aside from the obvious Berlin , Frankfurt, Munich, towns and cities...Ulm, Magdeburg, Heidelberg, Weimar, Marburg, Meissen, Celle, Potsdam, Leipzig, Dresden, Trier, Kleve, Hamburg, Schwerin, Bonn, Halle, etc, etc.

Everybody's style is different, but with just 12 nights I wouldn't go more than three or four places. As has been pointed out, your cities are aways apart. I'd do this because it efficiently connects Prague to Amsterdam:

4 nights Prague
1 night Dresden
3 nights Berlin (for WWII museums)
4 nights Amsterdam (day trip once or twice to see smaller places).

You could skip Dresden and add a night to any of the other three.

I do know people who will steadfastly refuse to visit the United States for that reason. Others do visit, only in order to have their own picture of the country confirmed, and they'll come back and tell you how everyone smiled at them with a fake smile in their faces.

WTH?

I have to say I haven’t seen so many “holier than thou” and condescending attitude posts in a single thread. I feel sorry for the OP. I hope that if some of you posting ever want to visit NYC, you’ll skip it and visit and stay in Secaucus, NJ instead. NYC is so geared to tourists and is so typical of a must see place an uninformed traveler would have on his list. Plus you’ll be with hoards of other tourists. Secaucus is where real people live.

I’m amazed by how hot of a topic this has become! I don’t want anyone to get their feelings hurt, hopefully we can all be respectful. Everyone has different touring styles and desires. I did ask for opinions because I wanted to consider something different than what every American does in Germany. And I know that a trip starting in Prague and ending in Amsterdam is challenging. I’m looking at maps, reading your suggestions and I have some ideas. So thank you all, sincerely. I don’t see that any more posts on this thread will help so I’ll only post with specific questions and when I’ve got a more complete itinerary. Thanks!

Hi,

I am going to submit to you that with some itinerary changes going from Prague to Amsterdam is not challenging if you know what you're doing. I get the feeling that your kids are good troopers and it won't be any problem for them. If you are desperate to see these places, (I totally understand that, I would do the same, regardless, night trains and all), regardless of the distance, then it can be done provided you skip a couple of places.

Re: doing something different from "what every American does in Germany:" If that's the aim, then you go to places off their radar in Germany, ie north and eastern Germany, don't use the RS book on Germany, at least, don't rely on it exclusively for planning the trip. I don't even bother.

After much thinking, reading and discussing with my family, I think we have landed on an itinerary we like. It could have gone North to Dresden and Berlin (my son's #1) but both myself, my partner and my daughter want to see the Rhine and Bavaria, so to the South it is. My son said he's ok with both and we talked about how we could probably spend a week in Berlin, so maybe save it for another trip.

I am now leaning towards using Russ' suggested itinerary (thank you Russ) because it still includes Bavaria which has always been on our list, but also has more than just the super touristy things. I wasn't feeling as if Munich was necessary either. This is a tad more streamlined with travel as well, and looking at map distances and train/bus/driving times, I think it is very doable for us.

Prague (3)
Nuremberg (3) (with a day trip to Beer Mecca and World Heritage Site Bamberg and/or Rothenburg)
Würzburg (0) - but stick your bag in a locker and spend a day there on the way to...
Rhine valley (3) - that's 2 days to cruise, tour 2-3 castles, hike the Rhine Castle Trail, sip wine. (St. Goar is good for train users.)
Cologne (0) - but stop there like you did in Würzburg on the way to...
Amsterdam (3)

I know it's really mostly Bavaria, but with 6 days, there is only so much you can see, right? We'll see the rest next time! ;)

My questions now are: 1) which concentration camp would fit in the best with this path? My daughter still wants to go to Dachau, but I think she will be ok with another one if it is easier to get to (Terezin, maybe? Are there any others near any of our stops that I am missing?) 2) Would it make sense to have a rental car starting in Nuremberg until we get to the Rhine Valley? It seems like the bus is the way to get to Nuremberg from Prague and a train is good from Cologne to Amsterdam. Not as sure about the rest. I think my guy would like to drive on an autobahn at least once. 3) Rothenburg vs. Bamberg as day trips from Nuremburg? We all thought Rothenburg looked really cute on the RS video but will it be crawling with people in May and would anyone recommend Bamberg over Rothenburg (remember we have the kids)...

Thanks in advance and suggestions for things to do in each place are always welcome. Or day trips. Etc. :) Cheers!

Hi,

If you do keep Munich (it seems you are still undecided on visiting Munich), then you can take that direct Munich to Prague train. I would. Definitely Bamberg over Rothenburg.

Keep in mind among other historical sites connected with Nazism in Munich, there is one in particular that Hitler created and fostered as a shrine, ie, where he ten years prior to coming to power, ie being appointed, tried to seize power. That was at the Feldherrnhalle, built as a dedication to Bavarian military commanders, next to the Odeonplatz, where the police and Reichswehr troops opened fire on him and his band. Obviously, upon meeting resistance, his attempt at a coup d'etat (Putsch) failed.

At the Feldherrnhalle you see the statues of only 2 commanders. If you have a good level of reading German, the multi-line inscription/message is revealing and interesting.

For your itinerary getting to Dachau would be the easiest. There was another one in Bavaria where the former former Chief of the General Staff, the head of the Army Military Intelligence (Abwehr) and others were held....Flossenbürg.