June 2020 Trip to Germany

Month of the trip-very important? Do you like Frankfurt, or have you not considered and open-jaw plane flight. I would have thought it was just as easy to get directly to Berlin. I often use two-segment flights from Lufthansa/United but I note that you have not allowed us to see your home city in your public profile for this newsboard. What is your daughter studying? What are her big interests?

The car will be a hindrance inside Munich. Munich is one of my less favorite cities in Germany, and I've spent over two months in the country. I have not seen King Ludwig's castle, but few posters here have thought it was worth the time and detour! What about the Wartburg (see next paragraph.)

I suppose you want to get your daughter out of Weimar, but she will have many weekends to do that, maybe with cheap student rail deals. She won't have a car, so maybe you want to pick it up in Weimar? We deliberately stayed at the sterile business hotel Dorint Am Goethepark Weimar because it has an underground garage associated with it. Weimar is a splendid, historic little city, with lots to do, and excellent daytrips, like Buchenwald, Erfurt, Gotha, Eisenach, Leipzig, and so on. I'd also mention Dessau-Worlitz Gartenreich (UNESCO WHS) and Quedlinburg, which is a bit far from Weimar but a remarkable place.

You don't make clear what your Frankfurt plans are. The only reason for staying three days on your busy schedule is the flight home, which is a poor reason for three days there-although there is enough to see. We stayed outside Frankfurt (just within walking distance of an S-Bahn terminating stop) because we wanted to make daily car excursions away from the city, and only meet friends downtown (by S-Bahn) on one day. We also returned the car at an agency near another S-Bahn stop on the same line, but out of town, because our next stop was Berlin from the Frankfurt HBF. I'd been there before for ten days on business, and didn't think my wife would want too much time downtown.

I would change the arrival airport to Berlin and keep Frankfurt as your departure airport. Reason one is flight fatigue, etc.; you’ll be in a better shape for your Berlin itinerary. Reason two is Frankfurt airport is not as friendly as other airports in Europe.

Since we were buying tickets X 4, my husband went with the deal. We are actually on Singapore Airlines out of JFK. He researched and Singapore is one of the top 10 in the world. I wanted to fly in and fly out of different airports, but it was too cost-prohibitive.

Thanks for the advice on Munich. My daughter wanted to visit Salzberg with us, as she will probably get many chances to visit other places within Germany while she is there. Is Salzberg worth the visit? In Rick Steves' guide, he does say it is pretty commercial.

Salzburg is an easy 2 hour train ride from Munich where I believe you can use the Bayern ticket for up to 5 people traveling together (26€ + 8€ for each additional passenger).

I think Salzburg is a charming walkable little city and would encourage you to visit if your daughter hasn’t already seen it by the time you get there in June.

EDIT: if you do Salzburg as a day trip from Munich the fee for the Bayern ticket is good all day going and coming back. If on a weekday you can’t leave before 9 AM and there is a period of time during rush hour in the early evening when you can’t use it too. On weekends and holidays it is good any time of day.

I might concentrate the trip on the central and southern part of Germany for this trip and elimate Berlin as much as I love some days in Berlin. Since your daughter won’t join you until Munich just loop around the rest of the itinerary you’ve set up and add the 3 Berlin days in the Alps, Lake Constance or some other scenic area before you swing back up the Rhine towards Frankfurt and your flight home.

Salzburg is worth the trip. Neuschwanstein is worth the trip and going by car will allow you to visit other sites along the way, such as Wies Kirche.

"We normally like a little more downtime than that, and usually limit our staying to four places, but there is a lot we'd like to do in Germany."

You can do a lot in Germany without staying in so many places that are so strung out across the country. You should cut it down to 4 base towns.

In Berlin you will have only 2 days for sightseeing (after an overnight flight and transit from FRA to Berlin... uggh… your day and you will be mostly spent.) You need at least 4 nights there, or forget it.

Fuessen is not about castles, really - Neuschwanstein is a palace with fake towers, castellations, and other nuttiness that was built in the late 19th century - it's only a little older than that Disneyland castle it inspired - and an infant compared to Germany's genuine castles (built hundreds and hundreds of years earlier.) Since you're staying outside Frankfurt, spend your 3 nights where the castles come in dozens, the Middle Rhine Valley. This is where Marksburg, Rheinfels, and Burg Eltz (on the nearby Mosel) castles have stood (or succumbed) for a combined 2500+ years - each of these offers tours that fill you in on European life back then. (At N'stein, which was occupied by Ludwig for 6 months before his death, nothing much ever happened. The overcrowded tour takes less than 30 minutes.) You can STAY in a castle if you like - Auf Schoenburg is tops. Take a day cruise past all the Rhine Castles. Check out the wine gardens.

I would visit the Middle Rhine first, heading there immediately after getting your bags from the carousel, in order to avoid the lengthy transfer to Berlin. It's only about an hour to the Rhine by local train.

If you can give more nights to Berlin, put it at the end - with a final train journey to FRA.

You can make more time for Berlin by dropping Fuessen… SALZBURG is a terrific place and a terrific place to stay longer while you visit the nearby Alps... but I suspect you really would need to drop something else as well.

https://www.berchtesgadener-land.com/cdn/uploads/jenner-gipfelblick-thcontentgalleryresponsive.jpg
https://www.eisriesenwelt.at/en/
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/14/Hallstatt_001.jpg/1200px-Hallstatt_001.jpg
https://www.salzburg-burgen.at/en/hohenwerfen-castle/
http://listverse.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Hitlers-Eagles-Nest-e1373168738140.jpg

Besides Berlin and the Salzburg area, I think you are shortchanging Nuremberg too.

I'd probably drop Berlin and Fuessen and do the following...

3 nights Rhine
3-4 nights Nuremberg (great day trips from here are possible too - Bamberg, Iphofen, Wuerzburg
4 nights Salzburg
3-4 nights Munich (possible day trip to Regensburg, Landshut, Landsberg.)
1 Final night in Frankfurt, FRA, or Wuerzburg (which is only about 1.5 hours by direct train from FRA airport)

If you are flying in from Virginia, do you really want to wait around for a train and then sit in the train for another 4 hours, or wait around for a flight? Just stay overnight in Frankfurt and take the early train the next morning. That way you get the cheap train tickets and don't have to stress about making your train or flight.

I would spend more time in Berlin, not less, and drop the Fussen/Neuschwanstein stops.

Events happening in June in the Frankfurt/ Rhein-Main area, in case you would like to stay overnight in one of these towns.
5-7.06 Medieval Fest, Gelnhausen
5-8.06 Oberursel Brunnenfest
6-7.06 Rose Days, Eltville
12-13.06 Wilhelm Street Fest, Wiesbaden
12-16.06 Strawberry Days, Eltville
14.06 Strawberry Fest & Sunday Shopping, Kronberg
17.06 J.P. Morgan Challange, Frankfurt
19-21.06 Jazz Fest, Idstein
19-22.06 Johannes Fest, Mainz
24.06-3.07 Alte Oper Plaza Fest, Frankfurt
27.06 Parade of Cultures, Frankfurt
28.06 European Ironman Championship, Frankfurt

the fee for the Bayern ticket is good all day going and coming back. If on a weekday you can’t leave before 9 AM and there is a period of time during rush hour in the early evening when you can’t use it too.

Please note: there is no restriction for the BT in the evening.

Sla019 thanks for the correction. I got that late afternoon time confused with another area’s ticket we used in the past. We will use the BT a lot this coming summer as there will be 4 of us traveling together in Bavaria for 3 weeks. Good to be reminded that the only restriction is not before 9:00 on weekdays.

Thank you all for the advice. I have amended our trip as following.

Arrive Frankfurt from NYC
Train to Weimar (where our daughter is studying- will make this home base to visit following:
5 nights- Weimar- train to visit: Leipzig, Erfurt, Bamberg
3 nights- Munich w/ day trip to Salzburg (take train)
3 nights- Pick up rental car in Munich (will not be driving in Munich) and drive to Fussen- visits to Weiskirche, Neuschwanstein, Hohenschwangau, Linderhof, Mary's Bridge, Tegelberg Cable Car, Treetop Walkway
2 nights Nuremberg- Drive Romantic Road to get there- Nazi Documentation Center
3 nights Frankfurt- Stop in Wurzburg on the drive to Frankfurt, stay in Weisbaden outside of Frankfurt

I am considering making Frankfurt just an overnight and adding two more nights to Nuremberg. Based on what is above, that may be the best way to spend our time.