Europe Trip from Germany back to Germany

Are you looking for us to tell you where to go? What are your interests? Museums, country, art, history, small town, large cities, highways... For tour packages you should look at the ones that RS offers to see if they fit your taste.

Twelve days really isn't long enough for a self-directed trip through four countries, especially when a major/time-consuming destination like Paris is to be included. Every time you switch cities and hotels you lose at least half a day, and if you're going through mountains it can take much longer. You could end up with a trip that is mostly observed through the windows of trains. The scenery will be beautiful, but I doubt if that is what you have in mind.

If you're looking for input from the board, you need to tell us where you're starting from in Germany, your arrival date in Europe and your departure date. Are you arriving in and departing from the same city?

I will be arrving in Stuttgart -Germany on May 26 th 2017 and back from the same place on Jun 9 2017 .
I would like to cover Black Forest , Frankfurt , Few places in Austria and about 4-5 days in Swiss . If time remains i would like to go Paris just to visit the Tower . Let me know if this can be done . or else let me know your idea waht i can look in the days i am in Europe. Thanks in Advance.

Well you can do anything you want, just don't ask us to think its a good idea. Start by skipping Austria. Stuttgart is close to the Black Forest, not far from Switzerland, and god rail service to/from Paris. Be content with that. Even Switzerland is a maybe.

It would be easier for you to contact your nearest travel agency office for a face to face interview to uncover where you are interested in going in the countries you mentioned.

You need to cut Austria.

I am not familiar with the Black Forrest. You can look up train schedules from www.bahn.de, then click on Deutschland along the top to get the English Version. With your limited time I would head to Wengen or Murren in Switzerland for the Alps. It is about a 6 hour train ride from Stuttgart.

Murren has several great walks for kids, one is the Kid's Adventure Trail, primarily down hill to Murren. You walk through fields, pastures we saw goats and horses. It has activities along it that may interest kids like a small zip line. It passes over a very cold mountain stream. You can take the funicular up from Murren to Alpenhubl, where there is a great kids play ground with tunnels and zip lines and slides. Our 7 year old loved it! After an hour, she cried when we left! Another trail is the North Face Trail, longer and more hills, but it has the BEST scenery! That is why you go to the alps.

You can break up the walks with a trip to Schitlbahn or a train to the Jungfrau

If you rented a car and drove through the Black Forrest and turned you car in at Bregenz it is roughly a 6 hour train ride but with many more connections.

May 26 Stuttgart, Arrival/Recovery Day
May 27-May 30 Black Forrest
May 31 Train to Murren.

June 1-4 Murren.
June 5 Train to Paris, a seven hour train ride with four or five train changes.

June 6 Eiffel Tower, Reservations Required or you stand in a very long line.
June 7 Paris, something else that suits your fancy. Walk to Notre Dame, St Chappell, Sacre Coeur, Arc de Triomphe, Champs Elysees. Enjoy croissants in the morning an grab a gelato to see the Notre Dame after you have climbed to the top and seen the huge bell while admiring the flying buttresses.
June 8 Paris then noon train to Stuttgart, 3 hour train ride with no connections to 5 horus with four connections.

July 9 Fly Departure day.

I added Paris because you said you wanted it, I would skip Paris because it is taking up two days just to get there and back. I removed a day from Switzerland and added it to Paris so Paris would not be so rushed. Even with two days it is rushed. You only have time for a highlight tour and that is it.

I would skip Paris and add time to the Black Forrest and extend it to Fussen and see Neuschwanstein and some of the older cities then add another day in the Alps then a train to Stuttgart on July 8th.

Your choice, but I know having bucket list items. I hope this helps.

"I would like to cover Black Forest , Frankfurt , Few places in Austria and about 4-5 days in Swiss ."

That sounds doable to me if you plan carefully. I don't see what all the objections are about.

5/26: Arrive Stuttgart. Train to Frankfurt for p.m.
5/27: Frankfurt
5/28: Morning train to Salzburg (5-hour train trip) arriving 1-2 pm for 2 nights.
5/29, 30: One day in Salzburg; 2nd day, outing to... Hohenwerfen Castle? Berchtesgaden and Königssee? Ice caves? Many choices.
From Salzburg it's a pretty long trip to the Black Forest - so break it up. Depart Salzburg by train 4 pm, arrive Ulm 7 pm. One night in Ulm.
5/31: Depart Ulm 9:04, arrive Hausach (Black Forest) 12:36 for a 2-night stay. See Vogtsbauernhof open-air museum, nearby Black Forest villages by train (scenic Black Forest Railway line.)
6/2: Depart Hausach 9:37, arrive 14:25 in Lauterbrunnen, Bernese Oberland, for a 4-night stay.
6/6: Depart Lauterbrunnen for Paris (6 hours) for a 2-night stay
6/8: Depart Paris for Stuttgart whenever you want to go - 3 hours if you pick the right train.

You have some wiggle-room to tweak this however you like. I don't think I missed any of your destinations. Check all travel times yourself at the DB website:
http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en

You need to cut Austria.

I am not familiar with the Black Forrest. You can look up train schedules from www.bahn.de, then click on Deutschland along the top to get the English Version. With your limited time I would head to Wengen or Murren in Switzerland for the Alps. It is about a 6 hour train ride from Stuttgart.

Murren has several great walks for kids, one is the Kid's Adventure Trail, primarily down hill to Murren. You walk through fields, pastures we saw goats and horses. It has activities along it that may interest kids like a small zip line. It passes over a very cold mountain stream. You can take the funicular up from Murren to Alpenhubl, where there is a great kids play ground with tunnels and zip lines and slides. Our 7 year old loved it! After an hour, she cried when we left! Another trail is the North Face Trail, longer and more hills, but it has the BEST scenery! That is why you go to the alps.

You can break up the walks with a trip to Schitlbahn or a train to the Jungfrau

If you rented a car and drove through the Black Forrest and turned you car in at Bregenz it is roughly a 6 hour train ride but with many more connections.

May 26 Stuttgart, Arrival/Recovery Day
May 27-May 30 Black Forrest
May 31 Train to Murren.

June 1-4 Murren.
June 5 Train to Paris, a seven hour train ride with four or five train changes.

June 6 Eiffel Tower, Reservations Required or you stand in a very long line.
June 7 Paris, something else that suits your fancy. Walk to Notre Dame, St Chappell, Sacre Coeur, Arc de Triomphe, Champs Elysees. Enjoy croissants in the morning an grab a gelato to see the Notre Dame after you have climbed to the top and seen the huge bell while admiring the flying buttresses.
June 8 Paris then noon train to Stuttgart, 3 hour train ride with no connections to 5 horus with four connections.

July 9 Fly Departure day.

I added Paris because you said you wanted it, I would skip Paris because it is taking up two days just to get there and back. I removed a day from Switzerland and added it to Paris so Paris would not be so rushed. Even with two days it is rushed. You only have time for a highlight tour and that is it.

I would skip Paris and add time to the Black Forrest and extend it to Fussen and see Neuschwanstein and some of the older cities then add another day in the Alps then a train to Stuttgart on July 8th.

I hope this helps.

I like Russ' schedule, but I would skip Frankfurt. Why do you want to go there? It seems an odd choice. I would rather spend an extra day in Paris or Salzburg.

Without Frankfurt you won't be seeing very much of Germany. But I tend to agree with stephen. Because you're flying into Stuttgart, you might just substitute Frankfurt with Stuttgart, which does have several worthwhile things to see and do. Nearby Esslingen is worth a visit too. Also, from Stuttgart to Salzburg takes only 4 hours by direct train; a Stuttgart - Frankfurt - Salzburg routing requires around 7 hours of train travel. So you're spending an additional 3 hours on the trains to see Frankfurt. But maybe you have solid reasons for that choice.

Thanks for replies

I am taking Austria Out of my plan.

I like to cover the following :
1. Germany - Black Forest and Frankfurt
2. Switzerland - Apls and
3. Paris - Eiffel Tower and walk down the streets

Switzerland I like to do it on Train ( Suggest me a good Train Package)
Germany - By Car ( Please Advice )
Paris - Train from Stuttgart and back in 2 days .

bsrblues, The Black Forest needs a car, Switzerland a car is not needed and in Paris it is a useless lump of metal.

• I suggest, Starting at Stuttgart, pick up a car (possibly after one overnight to recover). Drive the Black Forest for a few days. Dump the car on the German side of the border (to avoid international drop off charges). Either Freiburg-im-Breisgau, which is a nice city, or Lörrach, which is a suburb of Basel.
• Train to wherever in Switzerland - somewhere in the Berner Oberland. "Switzerland I like to do it on Train ( Suggest me a good Train Package)" - you don't need a package. Just decide which place you want to go to and get a train there, from Freiburg, Basel or wherever. You could possible split your time Between the Berner Oberland and Luzern, but you probably don't have enough nights. Wherever you want to go, there will be a train every hour, with perhaps a connecting bus waiting at the station for the smaller places. See Swiiss rail map here: https://www.swisspasses.com/railpass/overviewmap_en.pdf
• Then take a train from there to Paris, for your last few days. Paris itself is wrth 3+ nights.
• Train back from Paris to Stuttgart (pity you can't fly back direct from Paris).

"Germany - By Car ( Please Advice )"

Not sure what your question is here... You do not want to have a car in Frankfurt. You can do the Black Forest by car if you wish, but it is NOT a necessity and it will be very probably be an extra expense for you since guests that stay in most Black Forest towns have access to the trains there - and the trains to Basel Switzerland as well - for FREE.

The dotted lines that criss-cross this map of the Black Forest are all train lines. Service is frequent and the scenery is excellent; two of the lines, the Black Forest Railway and the Hell's Valley Railway, are featured by rail pass vendors for this reason:

http://www.germanrailpasses.com/germany-train/trains-germany/black-forest-route
Black Forest Railway info: https://www.black-forest-travel.com/places-of-interest/black-forest-railway.html

Roughly 130 towns offer a pass called the KONUS card free to guests You can read about it here. Freiburg, Triberg, Schiltach, Freudenstadt, Calw, Gutach, Titisee, Donaueschingen, Gengenbach, Villingen, Baden-Baden, Karlsruhe, Staufen, and dozens of other towns and cities in this region that you may have read or heard about are covered by this pass.

I think your best order is to start in the Black Forest then go directly to Switzerland, then take a TGV train from there to Paris. Then a train to Frankfurt, then back to Stuttgart. There is fast, frequent train service between Paris and Switzerland and Frankfurt.

For Switzerland, no one will criticize me for recommending Lauterbrunnen, Muerren, or Wengen in the Berner Oberland area. It is a common recommendation for good reasons. The ticket from Basel, where you would most likely enter Switzerland from the Black Forest, is 80 CHF per adult and 40 CHF per child. Given that you will probably want to ride some of the cable cars while you are there, that will add up. The ride from Muerren to Schilthorn and back is 80 CHF per adult, so all in all you will spend at least 240 CHF per person. So if each adult gets a Half Fare Card for 120 CHF, all tickets thereafter will be half price. You can also get a free Family Card, and your 5 yo travels with you for free. Buy these at your first entry station in Switzerland.

To get to Paris, take trains back to Basel and get the TGV to Paris in 3 hours. Buy that ticket 3 months in advance at http://www.sncf.com/en/passengers

Tickets from Paris to Frankfurt and Frankfurt to Stuttgart can also be bought 3 months in advance at http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en
Buying well in advance will get you the best prices.