December travel questions

Oh - I should add that I was excited about a river cruise as transportation from Mainz to Cologne but it appears they only run in the summer. Something unique like that would be wonderful. We are traveling light - one backpack each.

I assume you've already looked at "average" winter weather for each of your destinations?
This far in advance you'll only get average weather, and then about 10 days before your departure you'll start to get more accurate actual forecasts instead of averages. And then starting about 5 days before departure, you'll begin to get pretty accurate actual forecasts.

Remember that many or your German destinations are significantly farther north, in latitude, than even the northern tier of US states, being more even, latitude-wise, with parts of Canada.

I say the above because in picking your activities, indoor and outdoor, driving or not, you'll want to have as accurate an idea as possible of the likely December weather. Especially for Germany, because much of Germany is not near large bodies of water and the somewhat moderating influence of those bodies of water on the weather inland. For example, Amsterdam and Bruges weather, though not great for extended outdoor time in December, will nevertheless be more doable than December weather in inland Germany.

Once you have an idea of a range of probable weather at your various destinations, you'll be in a better position to avoid serious mistakes in planning activities and means of transportation for the various destinations.

I live in Portland OR. We are used to wet and cold. :) One of the reasons I want to stick with trains is a desire to not get stuck in the snow driving... :) Good point about inland temp, though. Looks like Rothenburg is 30s and 40s.

HRS - either the app or the website - lets you book quite late, and they are pretty reliable. If you want to read the reviews it will help if you read German because nearly everybody who uses it is a German businessman or the occasional businesswoman.

To the OP,
Being used to the winter weather in Portland OR (I wouldn't even say Portland has a winter, compared to Germany) will not help prepare you. The weather in Germany, especially inland from the North Sea, is highly likely to be significantly colder and snowier than the weather in Portland.
You'll need different clothes than you would wear in Portland in December.
( I'm familiar with the weather in Portland.)

The mountains in Germany are a ways south of Munich, those are the northern Alps and are strung along the German-Switzerland border.

Thanks, Curious!

You're welcome!
We're glad to help.
Better to know before you go :-)

When you visit the German Alps, think of how you would dress, and travel, if you were at Mount Hood's timberline at 6,000 feet above sea level, but without the Timberline Lodge and its bar. Although the Germans have been known to establish accommodations and eating/drinking establishments in their mountains, and higher than 6000 feet altitude. :-)

:0 Okay that's not happening... if for no other reason than I don't want to lug heavy gear for the rest of the trip.

I'm not assuming you would be skiing like you would at Mt Hood. I'm just giving you an example of the weather in the German Alps.

Rather than Rothenburg, try Büdingen. Only an hour from Frankfurt and their Christmas market is that weekend. Stop in at Ronneburg Castle that is near-by. Their medieval market is on 8-9 Dec.
https://www.buedingen.info/erleben/jaehrliche-highlights/weihnachtszauber.html
http://www.burg-ronneburg.de/

If you like Roman stuff, then you could also stop in at the Saalburg, the only reconstructed fort in Germany.
http://www.saalburgmuseum.de/english/museum_en.html

The Taunus mountains outside of Frankfurt are quite beautiful this time of year. Especially from the Feldberg. This is near the Saalburg Roman fort.

No cruises right now on the Rhine, the water is too low.

Thank you, those are excellent ideas!

You are going during the Xmas markets. I would book hotels as soon as possible to get the best deals available. I don't know about rollicking beer halls, seemed like the locals were all out drinking and eating at the Xmas markets both at lunch time and as soon as work was over. By 7 pm it was pretty hard to enjoy the stalls due to the crowds of locals drinking, eating, and having a great time with their mates (standing everywhere).

I wouldn't count on spectacular scenery. It's maybe more likely to be cloudy, maybe foggy, than sunny and days are short.

New tentative plan:
7th: arrive in Frankfurt, see Saalburg Roman fort, sleep Frankfurt.
8th: Budingen and Ronneburg Castle OR Rothenburg
(B & R look similar to Rothenburg but closer to Frankfurt - can anybody compare the two experiences?)
9th Maybe doing a local Rhine cruise if still based in Frankfurt...
10th train to Zurich (day trip to Lucerne), coming back north (fly?) to Bruges on the 13th. then the rest of the trip in Amsterdam (4 days).
Is this insane?
Would a car or train be better for the first few days? There are two of us. Thanks for your help!

Just one comment, concerning your plan for the “local Rhein cruise” on the 9th. Frankfurt is on the Main River, not the Rhein.

I was looking at this: https://www.viator.com/tours/Frankfurt/Rhine-Valley-Trip-from-Frankfurt-including-Rhine-River-Cruise/d489-5326RHINE "Local" meaning the tour ends where it starts. :)

The reviews are pretty mixed... Open to better suggestions!

Hi,

If you're looking for bodies of water in Germany, if not the North Sea area, how about the Baltic and those towns in that area. In May I did a day trip to Cuxhaven to get close to the North Sea. If you're interested in harbour cruises, river cruises, etc, the big one in Hamburg and Kieler Förde, did that for the second time also in May. There is the Elbe river cruise.

It's not about being on water specifically - I'm just trying to see as much of the varied countryside as I can. :)

I would not waste my money on that Viator "cruise" Read the many horrible reviews for this on Trip Advisor. It is run by ETS.
Going to the Rhine is easy on your own. Visit the towns you like, have delicious foods and wines where and when you like, and at a fraction of the cost. There may be just one ship per day, (if at all as the water level is really, really low) No ships on the Rhine at all right now.

Yeah, the Viator thing looks pretty bad, but how exactly do I do it on my own? This is what I'm asking for. Rent a car?

laughinglagomorph: In December there will be no regularly-scheduled Rhine cruises - just one cruise per day from Rüdesheim north at 10 am to Boppard (the best segment) but ONLY if there are enough passengers pre-registered on that day. It's hard to count on passengers who want to cruise because the scenery in winter can be bleak and the weather WILL be nasty when you are just sitting there on deck. I would just drop the cruise idea altogether.

"...but how exactly do I do it on my own?"

You can still visit the towns and Marksburg Castle (in Braubach) in winter if you like. Walking around Bacharach, Oberwesel, and other towns and taking in the attractive old-world buildings and castles/castle ruins is still enjoyable if you are properly bundled up. But you don't have to walk to get there. Just take the train. Every little riverfront town - on both sides of the river on the way to Koblenz - has a train station, and trains run all day long from pre-dawn to nearly midnight. Find Bingen in the south and Koblenz Hbf in the north on this train line map. That's the scenic part most people go to see.

http://www.vrminfo.de/fileadmin/data/pdf/2017/RLP-Ticket_streckennetz.pdf

You can take the train from Bingen to Koblenz and return south on the east bank via Rüdesheim and stop off in places that interest you.

Rhine towns in this area
Rhine Castles in this area

If the train interests you (why wouldn't it?) and you want specifics on journeys, day passes and ticketing, you can either re-post or pm me.

"We aren't drinkers but want to experience a rolicking beer hall somewhere along our travels."

You are unlikely to find the stereotype you are looking for with oompah bands, etc. But there are nice places everywhere to drink beer.

Excellent, thank you!

"Big modern cities are not a draw."

Well, in winter you are kinda stuck in slightly larger places because the smaller ones on the Rhine tend to be very quiet. Rüdesheim will be the exception to this rule - you might stay there instead of a place like Frankfurt as it will be buzzing because of its Christmas Market. MAINZ is a university town and a very lively place at any time of year but of course much larger than Rüdesheim. I love the place at Christmas - big fun market with lots of fun food and exotic adult Christmas beverages! And the small old town zone makes you feel like you're in a small town.

Mainz Market Square

Mainz old town

Mainz "Kirschgarten" in the old town

Mainz Christmas Market

It is an easy day trip by train north into the Middle Rhine Valley towns.

You are a gem! Thank you!

Frankfurt is also a University city with 2 large ones. Goethe University has about 40,000 students. Mainz is also a large city with a population of more than 250,000.

As much as I like Mainz, Frankfurt is the better hub considering all the other places the OP wants to visit. There are beautiful, quiet residential neighborhoods to stay in, like in the Westend.
Hotel Goelz, Beethoven Hotel, Hotel Liebieg, or Dirazi Guesthouse, are a few examples.
https://www.hotel-goelz.de/?page_id=72&lang=en
https://www.hotelbeethoven.de/en/home/
https://dirazi.de/en/index.html
http://hotel-liebig.hotelefrankfurt.net/en/

Okay, here's the new plan:
Fri 7th arrive in Frankfurt at 8am. Pick up rental car at airport. See the Saalburg Roman fort and then check in at our pension in Budingen.
Sat 8th more Budingen and Castle Ronneburg.
Sun 9th Rothenburg, sleep there.
Mon 10th -Tues 11th Either ditch the car in Mainz (my preference) and train up the Rhine, or drive the Rhine. We are doing a car for that first bit because Saalburg is awkward to train to /from Budingen. A Rick Steves advisor felt we should keep the car and use the St. Goar car ferry to swap banks and see the Marksburg Castle. I am not particularly locked in on that castle, personally. Big remaining question is the itinerary / stops / accomodations for these two days, plus when exactly to switch to train travel.
Wed the 12th: Cologne. Roman museum, dome, xmas market?.
Thurs 13th - train from Koln to Amsterdam. Enjoy 4 days before we fly home. :)