Advice for 15 day Germany/ Austria trip in Dec

One place to start your research would be Rick's excellent guidebooks. You can find them on this website under "shop online". Perhaps you already know that.
Also, take a look at Rick's Tour to Munich, Salzburg & Vienna which might give you ideas - I think the last tour date is earlier in Dec than when you are planning to go. You may not be "tour" people anyway.
I have not been to Germany or Austria in the winter but I have heard of the enchanting Christmas markets there. This is a trip I would love to make.
Enjoy!
Judy B

Arrive Frankfurt
Rhine - 2 nights
Wurzburg - 3 nights
(days to Bamberg/Rothenburg ob der Tauber)
Munich - 2 nights
Bavarian Alps or Austrian Tirol - 3 nights
Salzburg - 2 nights
Vienna - 3 nights
Depart Vienna

You are visiting at the beginning of ski season and school vacation. I would recommend a visit to Regensburg, though it is a bigger city, but nice Christmas Markets and nicely lit. I would have to recommend some of the tourist spots like Mittenwald and Obertsdorf, but no guarantee of snow. Many places to visit in Bayern und Österreich but it is hard to pin down. A guide to tourist sites, then Rick Steve's guides will help. Maybe Lienz, Zillertal, Innsbruck west and east. Ski regions will be already booked...

It seems many (most?) posters on this forum tend to favor sights in Germany from Frankfurt south. I have enjoyed many weeks traveling in the more northern portions of Germany. Hamburg, Breman, Lubeck, Hamelin, among others, offer many delightful days of touring. The geography, architecture and even the people are significantly different than Bavaria and southeastern Germany.

"...the people are significantly different...." true, definitely when it comes to speaking German and detecting their accent and dialect in Bavaria and southeastern Germany. Hameln is nice. I saw it the first time in 2007. I should have seen it in the 1970s.

Did you see Minden, Jack, not too far from Hameln? Minden is a relaxing town, has also several things to see, the Prussian history museum, Mittellandkanal, the Altstadt, the war monuments, the Weser River, Porta Westfalica (best is to take a taxi from Minden's bus depot)

The towns of Hameln and Minden look like a perfect fit for my 2017 trip. We can drive to those two places after spending a day and night in Quedlinburg and after a stop in Goslar.

Sorry for the hijack:

Tim, when you go to Goslar, don't miss the Rammelsberg silver mine. And between Quedlinburg and Goslar is Wernigerode, also a medieval city with a pretty castle. From there, you can go up the Brocken by steam train (6 steam trains up and down each day). When the weather is nice, one can see more than 200kms in each direction from up there. And it's a nice hiking area. For those interested in steam trains, the home depot of the engines is also in Wernigerode. (You could also ride the steam train from Quedlinburg through the Harz mountain range to get to Wernigerode instead of taking the way around it but it takes half a day, so… maybe that's something for real steam enthusiasts). Anyway, it may be a good idea to make more than a short stop in the area. If you want more details, please open another thread on it.

@ Tim...Since you'll be motorised in Minden, I heartily suggest a couple of hours getting to Porta Westfalica. Even if you're not into the Prussian history aspect (the Kaiser Wilhelm Denkmal), the view from the top (that's why the car is necessary, if you don't want to hike the trail) is fantastic . In both Hameln and Minden you'll see yourselves as the only North Americans.

I'll add a few nice areas to the lists with Alp views in mind and you can't get away from all the tourists:

Tegernsee, Bad Tölz, Reit im Winkl Germany and Achensee Austria.

Zugspitz Arena: Erwald, Lemoos,and Berwang Austria and Mittenwald and Garmisch-Partenkirchen Germany.

Flirsch am Arlberg - St. Anton am Arlberg and Ischgl, Austria area.

The lake region around Saltzburg and Hinterstoder area Austria.

The area around Sexton and the Hochpustertal in the Italian Dolomiten (Südtirol).

All are ski areas and will be packed the last two weeks in December. Many of the towns have only small old city centers. Around Christmas all a great time if you can find somewhere free. Ski villiges usually have a lot going on in the evenings (partying), All will be nicely lit for the holidays. None of these areas are where you want to first ski other than the kiddie hills. The areas in Austria and Südtirol are more likely to have snow.

We like small, non-touristy towns preferably with a great view of the alps (by non touristy I do not mean in-accessible or haunted, just that it isn't on every tourists 2 day itinerary)

"Great view of the alps" really limits you to southern Germany and Austria. In Bavaria some places I would recommend based on your criteria are:

• Oberstaufen area
• Tegernsee/Schliersee area
• Oberstdorf area (but will be crowded with skiers)

DJ

Fred and jjj, thanks for tbe info. In a month or so I'll be posting my initial :60-day tnerary. I so look forward to all the well-thought-out advice on these forums. Reading these boards is a major component of how I plan my trips.

You're welcome, Tim. I'll be going back to Minden too in 2017 trip since I didn't get to the top of Porta Westfalica to the Kaiser Wilhelm Denkmal. I'll know to take a taxi. The S-Bahn and the bus (I took that) don't even come close. That stretch of Germany say, from Minden, Hameln, Wolfsburg, Braunschweig, Hannover, Wolfenbüttel, Hildesheim gets very few international tourists, mainly Germans. You'll see that on the trains too. The entire coach is German.

Remember, it will be very snowy, cold, and driving and parking will be challenging. However - what MJPPP said!! That sounds really like a trip I'd like to take. Yes to Christmas markets, with their candied almonds, gluehwein (in the grocery stores you can purchase little gluehwein tea bags for take-home).

and driving and parking will be challenging.

Actually, driving through the Bavarian Alps in winter is usually not particularly difficult. Unless you drive during an actual storm, the crews usually have the roads clear very soon afterwards. Unlike Switzerland and Austria, there are no high-pass roads through the Bavarian Alps that close seasonally or temporarily, subject to bad weather.

2 Days Cologne or somewhere on Rhine (really enjoyed)
2 Days Rothenburg ob der Tauber (our favorite)
1 Day Baden Baden (The spa day was awesome and well worth the day there I believe we had spent two)
3 Days Munich (I honestly was not a fan my husband liked it I found little enjoyable and would not want to go back. I would say you could easily take a day from here)
2 Days Innsbruck (we ski so we loved this, skiing aside the view is great and the town is cute)
2 Days Salzburg (museum and elevator lift that you pay to take up and do a walk from above it was great an old couple told us about it and it was our favorite thing that we did the entire trip) If you can be here on a sunday it is great with most the city going to mass......its an experience. Cemetery was great if your into that stuff.

3 Days Vienna (we adored vienna) wish we had bought tickets in advance for dancing horses however we did do a tour and saw a show. Surprisingly we had added Vienna to our trip because it was cheap to fly into and it ended up being our favorite place. We had done Vienna, Salzburg, and Innsbruck not being so impressed with Salzburg....then again I found the city to be extremely touristy and too many tourist shops.....

Thanks guys so much advice and so much to plan! We had dropped the plans but now on hindsight I think we need to make it happen..

Just to add: we are not looking at doing any skiing! Looking forward to the many Christmas markets though!

Since you're back, here are my thoughts. Consider Salzburg - lovely town, lovely markets, couple hours train ride from Munich, which has large markets in different parts of the city. In most places, the markets are in the center in pretty much all the town squares. I went in early December and it was quite crowded with European tourists enjoying the markets. One of the most unusual is the Medieval market in Esslingen, just outside Stuttgart. If you go there, I encourage you to consider 2-3 days across the border in Alsace, especially Strasbourg and Colmar with its nearby villages. The decorations are extraordinarily beautiful and the ambiance as well as the foods and hand-crafted wares are much different from Germany/Austria. My least favorite was Frankfurt, but it has worthy sights and is a good base for day tripping to surrounding markets, especially Mainz and Wiesbaden. A good friend went a year after me and he was very impressed with Nurnberg and Berlin markets.

I enjoy small towns too but in December it will not be like it was in June in small towns the size of Wengen. Daylight hours will be short, sights and shops will often be closed.

You would in fact be wise to stay in somewhat larger places and perhaps day trip to smaller towns. For example, Bacharach, suggested by jmillerjgm, is a truly adorable town in a scenic location on the Rhine River and worth seeing at any time of year. But like the other Rhine towns it will be mostly shuttered in winter. Still, you don't have to stay in some megacity... instead, pick a smaller city like Mainz as a base town where you can get around easily on foot. Mainz is big enough to have museums and other sights that are open as well as some evening activities, and it has a terrific Christmas market; it is also well located for easy day trips by train to Bacharach and other small towns nearby (Rüdesheim and its Christmas market, for example) or to Frankfurt or to the small city of Speyer (the Speyer Christmas market continues AFTER Christmas. Speyer has some good museums too.)

or to the small city of Speyer (the Speyer Christmas market continues AFTER Christmas. Speyer has some good museums too.)

Speyer gets my vote as the gem of the Upper Rhine in Germany. Nearby Worms gets more attention, probably because of the familiar name from history class. But whereas Worms got pummeled in WWII and was mostly rebuilt in bland modern architecture, Speyer was barely touched. Both have excellent old Romanesque cathedrals, and although Worms' is older, Speyer's is far grander.