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Strategy for buying train trip with connections vs. separate tickets

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I am planning a trip for May by train, and I could use some advice from experts on how to book the itinerary.

The plan is:
Day 1: Leave London and travel by Eurostar to Paris, and then get an onward train to Lyon that same day.
Day 4: After a few days in Lyon, we will train to Avignon and spend about a week there.
Day 10: Train from Avignon to Paris, and then to London on Eurostar.

Now, my understanding is that if you have a journey with a connection, even involving separate train companies, and a delay by one train company causes you to miss your connection, then the second train company is required to allow you to go on a later train. However, if you purchase travel between the same cities as two separate legs, they are not. So, if I buy one ticket from London > Lyon and Eurostar runs late, then the French railway is obliged to honor my ticket to Lyon. But, if I buy London > Paris and a separate Paris > Lyon ticket, and Eurostar delays cause me to miss the connection, then I forfeit my second ticket. In this case, I would have to buy a new last-minute ticket for any legs I miss.

Also, it appears that round-trip tickets on Eurostar are cheaper than one-way tickets, so I would like to buy those legs as round-trip. However, because I want to visit two different cities, I can't just buy the whole thing as a round-trip.

So, given all this, I am looking for the strategy that minimizes total price. I came up with these general options.
1. Purchase a 1-way ticket London > Lyon (leg #1 Eurostar to Paris, leg #2 on TGV), then Lyon > Avignon, and finally Avignon > London (leg #1 TGV to Paris, leg #2 Paris > London). This is the most expensive option but means that each day's travel is a single journey.

  1. Purchase a round-trip London <> Paris, and then one-way tickets for Paris > Lyon, Lyon > Avignon, and Avignon > Paris. This is the cheapest, but it means that our two long travel days are both split into separate legs.

For the dates and times I'm considering, there is about $200 price difference between them (all one-way tickets vs. RT to Paris and then separate legs beyond).

Should I just spend the extra money and view the $200 as an insurance policy against delays? Or do I perhaps not understand the policy correctly?

Posted by
1684 posts

Most railways in Europe practice "single leg pricing", where a "return" ticket is just two singles bought in one transaction. However Eurostar does have "return" prices that are cheaper than two singles. And yes, you can take advantage of that the way you plan.

Contrary to your assumption a train connection is also protected when the segments are on different bookings. If you were to buy a "through" ticket from London to Lyon from SNCF you would get two tickets as well, with SNCF just operating as an agent for Eurostar. Same if you were to book this on eg. trainline.

There are two agreements in place that protect your connection. The first is the Railteam alliance, and the other is the "Agreement on Journey Continuation". The man in seat61 has as usual all the details:

https://www.seat61.com/european-train-travel.htm#if-things-go-wrong.

You need to plan reasonable connections. You find these out by starting a through booking on eg. SNCF and seeing what turns up.
Note that SNCF's low cost "OUIGO" train unfortunately is not part of either agreements, so there your connections are not protected. Proving again that SNCF's management is the enemy of the train traveller.

When travelling between London and places to the Southeast of Paris it is more practical to change trains in Lille, rather than change stations in Paris.

https://www.seat61.com/France.htm#London_to_Lyon_&_Grenoble_via_Lille
https://www.seat61.com/France.htm#london-to-avignon-aix-marseille-via-lille

Posted by
4049 posts

Here is an alternate strategy: Fly into London; fly home from Paris, or even Marseille. A multi-destination ticket will save you the time and maybe some money over returning to your arrival airport. The itinerary must be purchased through a multi-destination search function, easily available from big airlines.

Posted by
7 posts

@WengenK, I can't tell you how much time I have spent trying to understand those pages from Seat61. He is an amazing resource, but all the subtleties between CIV vs. HOTNAT vs. AJC is kind of confusing. After going back to that page again, here is some information that may help other travelers.

The HOTNAT ("Hop On The Next Available Train") agreement covers members of the RailTeam alliance, including Eurostar and SNCF and only between connections between high-speed trains. So, it wouldn't apply to one of the routes that I found, which used TrenItalia. Also, note that it's on a space-available basis.

The "AJC" or "Agreement on Journey Continuation" seems like the most generally helpful, as it includes more carriers and both high-speed trains and regional trains. This is a "commercial agreement not a right", so it's up to the train company as to whether they honor it. However, for them to honor it:

  • Both trains have to be run by signatories to the agreement
  • The journey has to be international
  • You must have a reasonable period of time between trains to make the connection
  • You may need to request proof of the delay
  • "Onward travel has to be on the same operator on the same route", which I assume means "The same operator as you originally booked, on the same route you originally booked".

Overall, it seems like just buying the best combination of price and schedule seems like the best way to go, while sticking with Eurostar and SNCF as they are both signed onto all these agreements and putting in adequate buffer time.

Also, thank you for offering the idea to go through Lille, I had looked into it but it is significantly more expensive than the Paris route.

@Southam, great suggestion, that was something I looked into originally but for multiple reasons, it just wasn't a good option for us.

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