Some basic French

Same for boat(s)! :)

and cakes !!!

(had to add the !!! to get to the min chars to post)

And let's learn to pronounce French cities and towns correctly. My favorite mis-pronounce: Reims - not "Reams" but a soft "Rance". Back in the day, Americans would be at the Paris train stations trying to buy tickets to "Reams" and a befuddled ticket clerk would be there trying to figure out exactly where the hell this person was going to. Not so bad today because it seems the clerks are all used to this issue. Metz - "Mess". Mulhouse - not "Mul-house"; don't pronounce the "h" (common in French) so it is "Mu-lose". Caen & Cannes are pronounced as separate variations on the word "can" (slightly different pronunciations but important). And, of course, most people know "Paris" is pronounced "Pa-ree". Lots more out there!

When in doubt - write it out!

When we checked into our Caen hotel the desk clerk told us about the people who thought they'd reserved a room in Cannes and were surprised not to find a film festival or the Mediterranean. I'd been mispronouncing Caen for years, but at least I knew where I was going.

Say "Lyon" properly en français....not as in "lion"

And Troyes is said exactly like trois (3).

The word that confused me in France was "euro". We, of course, say "your-oh". In France it is pronounced "ay-ooh-ro". So when the sales clerk says "cinquante ay-your-oh s'il vous plait" prepare to hand over 50 euro.

Maybe one of you can help me. I like to try new cheeses, but I never know how to ask for "sharp" or "aged" cheese.

Bob, Rick Steves has a pocket French-language guidebook with lots of food terms. It might have the words you're looking for.

One thing I really like about the Metro is that you get a mini French-pronunciation lesson every time you ride it. I learned how to correctly pronounce "St.-Ouen": Santwahn, with the N barely pronounced in your nose.

Les Halles = Lay Ahl [amended]

And Rouen is Rwahn, with that muffled rolled French R.

Les Halles = Lay Eye ???? I always heard "lay Ahl"

There is also the word "Versailles" ... say...ver sigh.....not "ver-sell-lees"

I agree with Chani, it is definitely "Lay Ahl", I always tell my guests about it when they say "lays ahl" (les Halles is the food hall in Dijon, designed by Eiffel).

Chani, you're right. I was hearing it on a crowded train and definitely misheard.

Bob I think sharp is "fromage fort" , in your best Clouseau accent.

Bob - and always ask to taste, whether in a market, specialty shop or supermarket. After you try one, they'll understand "plus forte/plus vielle" (stronger, older) and "moin . . . (less - hey, could happen ☺). A very popular cheese is conte (con-tay) and can vary from mild to very sharp. Bon appetite.

Not sure where in FL you are Bob but if there is a Whole Foods nearby they have a great selection of imported cheese. They have "Under $4" buckets with a nice variety of hunks of cheeses all under $4. It a good way to try a variety without investing a lot of $$ in something that you really don't care for.

The Comté cheese is often compared to Gruyère or try Mimolette - the distinctively orange cheese. Laguiole is another of the sharper French cheeses.

Big cheese fan.

Thanks stan, Chani and Christi.
There's a Whole Foods not far from us so I'll go in there to look for their $4 cheese chunks. I'll also make sure to try each of the cheeses you've mentioned.
Thanks again for being so helpful. This should make the picnics on our upcoming trip even better.

Is there an online pronunciation guide somewhere? Something to help me see a word and know how to say it, or, alternatively, hear a word and relate it to the spelled word so I can understand.

I grew up with Spanish, every letter is pronounced and generally the same way. Took German in high school and college, again I can figure out how to pronounce things. Even Italian is fairly easy pronunciation.

Now I'm cramming on French and I'm having trouble bridging between knowing the spoken sound and relating that to the written word because it seems many letters aren't pronounced and/or pronounced differently. Words that have different spellings sound more similar than dissimilar (as Cannes and Caen above). To display my ignorance:

1. When do I say the s sound, when is it silent? Blois? Ambois? Paris?
2. I hear "set". Do I just have to know the context to know if "set" means "it" or "seven".
3. I hear "ba". How do I know whether it's "ba" as it's "over there" or "ba" (with the slightest hint of an n sound) as in "bath".

Brad, you get high marks for even trying! French is difficult to spell and hard to pronounce. I will take a stab at your questions.

1. For Blois and Paris, you don't pronounce the 's' because it is the final letter. Amboise ends in 'e' so you pronounce the 's' using a 'z' sound.

2. On to 'set.' The number seven is 'sept' with the 'p' being silent. I have no idea why it is silent! You could also hear 'set' in the following circumstance: c'est une fille (it's a girl). 'Set' is written as c'est -- the c is pronounced like an 's because it is followed by an e, the s is silent. The t would usually be silent too but it is followed by the u in the next word. Are you sorry that you asked for help yet????

3. I think you are talking about 'over there' as in 'lah bah' as in "I put the key over there --on that table." In this case there is no hint of an n sound. This "bah" is not the same sound you would have in the French word for bath, bain. For bain, the word ends in n, so you barely pronounce the n, really you form your mouth as if you will say n, but you stop before you vocalize.

I bet you are more confused than ever!

I'm sure there is an on line resource. I learned French before the Internet was invented, so I can't help you. I'm sure someone else can!

Fun conversation about language.... In preparation for our trip I've been listening to audio french instruction. One tip that the instructor, Paul Noble, gave about pronouncing the last letter of a word ending in a consonant; : "Only pronounce the last letter of a word ending in a consonant if it's in this phrase: FoR LuCK. If the last letter does NOT end in F,R,L,C,K - then it is silent (unless, the next letter is a vowel) I just re-read what I wrote, hope it makes sense. It's amazing how many French words are similar to English words!

Brad in Gainsville, send me a PM and I can help you out with a website that not only pronounces French words and phrases but does so with 6 different French speakers. My favorite is Bruno, next favorite is Alice.

Brad,

My high school teacher taught that you need to Be CaReFuL about the final letter. BCRFL are pronounced, the others aren't (K is quite rare in French).

Pronunciation follows the rules, unlike English. Learning how to say things is pretty easy. Understanding spoken French is much harder. Not only are many letters silent, but when a silent consonant is following by a word beginning with a vowel, the 2 words are run together and the consonant is pronounced. In effect, you don't hear words, you hear phrases. And many words can only be understood in context.

I think it's very difficult to try to learn French by reading it. It will help to be able to read menus and (if you're driving) road signs, but for even basic conversation, you need something like Pimler's or Rosetta Stone, where you listen to and memorize phrases and sentences.

Last year I was in Paris for a couple of weeks. Maybe because my French was a little slow, maybe just my accent, but they replied invariably replied in English after a sentence or two. I'm sure it was meant to be helpful/accommodating. Later on, I spent about 10 days in eastern "village France." Most people knew little if any English and knowing some French was very helpful.

And don't even get me going on how your mouth should be shaped when speaking. My French teacher in Paris drew pictures in my notebook that looked like fish mouths & had me go home at night & practice making "fish mouths" in front of a mirror to get my mouth to conform to the shape of the mouth in pronouncing certain words. Also, he had us reading French comic books to learn simple sentence structure & verb conjugation.

Bob - if you mean "sharp" as in aged Cheddar, about the only cheese that resembles it will be Mimolette. it's often pre0cut into cubes and sold in supermarkets and some cheese shops.
If you mean "strong" as in stinky cheese, there are different terms depending on what you want.
If you want a hard or semi-hard goat cheese, say "fort"
If you want a camembert or other soft cheese, say "coulant"
You can always ask to take a sniff before you buy.

Funny, I did an exchange with the German Air Force and I judged success on whether people responded to me in German or English. After a couple of weeks there, most people were responding in German.

I crammed, like I am now, for a trip to Italy. My Italian wasn't great, I kept confusing the Spanish word for the Italian. I received a lot of compliments on my Italian, but I think that's because few tourists make the effort.

I crammed on French a few years ago before visiting Quebec. I didn't do very well but, again, the locals were more than kind. One guy said they appreciate when English speakers make an effort because it shows "respect" for their culture.

I have a mile to go on my French pronunciation. Last year I met a French lady named Marie at my community swimming pool. I must have spent most of an afternoon trying to pronounce the r, in her name, correctly but never got anywhere close to perfect.

Language skills develop early - the older you are the more difficult learning new languages becomes - we grown-ups have to work way harder than the kids. If you are traveling with children - have them learn!

I do as Sarah does! I pronounce along with the lady on the Metro! I try to get the right lilt to!

I am fairly hopeless at languages. Last Fall when patronizing the Shrine of the Blessed Mermaid in Paris the barista asked my name, I said Pam in my flat accent, he wrote BAM on the cup and turned it to me with a questioning look on his face. I took the cup and marker and wrote PAM and he looked at it and said "Ahhh, Pom". In English he said "You can be PAM (in a very good American accent) at home. When you are in Paris you are a different person so we will call you Pom." He totally delighted this gray-haired, frumpy senior traveler!

And while I understand the Les Halles pronunciation, but I don't get it. I thought the S was elided in to the vowel sound, but that doesn't work when a word starts with the silent H?

I sure didn't know that you don't pronounce the "s" in "les Halles." Since the "H" is silent, how come no "s" sound? Not arguing the point, just curious.

My French teacher taught us to pronounce the notorious "u," as in "tu," by saying "eeee" while shaping the mouth like "O" -- the fish technique described above. I was lucky to take this in high school when some of my brain cells were still working well. I only regret spending three years before that on Latin -- I have yet to use that language, even in Latin America or the Latin Quarter! ;-)

I've always pronounced "Les Halles" as "lay - ahl". Nobody's corrected me, yet.

"I've always pronounced "Les Halles" as "lay - ahl". Nobody's corrected me, yet." Because you are correct! (and I'm French) :)

I sure didn't know that you don't pronounce the "s" in "les Halles." Since the "H" is silent, how come no "s" sound? Not arguing the point, just curious.

My memory if very fuzzy on this, but for what it's worth, there are 2 kinds of letter 'h.' The letter 'h' in "Halles" is the one where you don't say the 's" sound. When I heard this explanation (in France, many, many years ago), I couldn't for the life of me, hear the difference in the 2 kinds of letter 'h.' My teacher insisted it was there.

Maybe this is nonsense, or maybe someone knows better than I do!

There is an "aspirated H" in French, though it isn't aspirated these days. Still, the rule lingers. Here's an explanation and the common words.

Thanks eef and Chani for the information on the H sound.

Yes, thank you, eef and Chani. Now I remember that the last line of Camus' L'Etranger is "cris de haine." And a few others like that, thanks to the link Chani provided. So from now on it's "lay all" when I'm going to the (former) big Parisian market.

But do you actually pronounce the "h," like "lay hall"? Isn't that what "aspirated" means?

It's all so complicated, why doesn't everyone just speak English? Maybe if we just keep repeating ourselves in a louder voice, everyone will someday! ;-)

Chani, thank you for the link. I had no idea there were so many words like "Halles."

Chani, thank you for the link. I had no idea there were so many words like "Halles." Aspirated h... Had forgotten what it was called.

Dick, the h is silent, for both types of "h"

RE: pronunciation websites

I've found Forvo helpful: http://forvo.com/languages/

Hi David,

If you or anyone here plans to travel to the Loire (Lwar) Valley & visit Amboise (Ambwaz),
make sure you try to pronounce Blois correctly as "Blwa", not "blah", as indicated in RS French book (2015)

Just imagine this scenario...
I walk up to the ticket counter at the train station in Amboise, and I ask for
deux billets pour "Blah" s'il vous plait.
The young woman gives me a blank stare, so I repeat my request followed by,
parlez-vous anglais?

She replies, "very little", so I repeat my request once again, to which she replies,
"You want to go to Blwa, NOT Blah"

Yes, we want to go to Blwa (Blois), 2 tickets please, Merci! ;-)

I thought the s in Les Halles isn't pronounced because it's the last letter in the word. The s in the word "les" isn't pronounced either. Does the first letter in a French word dictate whether the last letter will be pronounced?

I learned the CaReFuL mnemonic device too - very helpful and I remember it 12 years after I studied French!

The first letter of the following word determines whether the last letter is pronounced, if it's a vowel, the last consonant is pronounced. If it's a consonant, the last consonant is silent (except for the 'be careful' rule).

For instance c'est-à-dire (that is to say) the T is pronounced because it is followed by a vowel. C'est bon (it's good), the ST is silent because it is followed by a vowel.

When the first letter of the following word is H, it varies (see the explanations above).