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Need some climbing, wine, and transport reqs for France!

Hello!

My husband and I are visiting France for the first time this August! We are going to a wedding just outside of Lyon on our second day in France, and then we will have three weeks to explore the country. We're pretty adventurous and active, and are hoping to see a lot but not spread too thin! We're not really city or museum people, but will probably give ourselves 3 days in Paris before we fly out because... well we have to see Paris at least a little bit.. it's just not our main goal.

I'm looking for recommendations specifically on:

  1. WINE. We love it. I know Italian wine much better than French, though. I have a general knowledge of the regions and grapes, but can you suggest specific wineries that would be good for us to visit, and why?

  2. CLIMBING. We're looking to sport climb. We won't be bringing trad gear and likely won't do any multi-pitch. Does anyone have any suggestions for great crags or perhaps worthwhile guidebooks?

  3. I also am curious about renting a car vs. taking trains. As I'm starting my research, I'm kind of taken aback by how much the trains seem to cost! Like $100 EACH to get from Paris to Lyon (one-way) is what I'm seeing. Can anyone confirm this? Would it make more sense for us to rent a car, especially given that we're hoping to see more of the countryside (vineyards, climbing crags, hikes, etc)? Does anyone have any recommendations on rental cars, if so? Renting from a local company would be ideal of course, rather than from Hertz or something. OR does anyone definitely recommend the trains, for what we're hoping to accomplish?

--> Does anyone know if we can drive over a border if we rent a car in France? We're thinking about going to Switzerland for one of the weeks, especially because it's so close to Lyon (our home base for the trip). Thanks!

Brynn

Posted by
3990 posts

I have seen tickets for as little as 25€ (one way/per person) between Paris and Lyon. It's all about buying tickets at least 90 days before traveling. Those tickets are non-refundable and nonexchangeable. I don't know where you are seeing $100 per person tickets for a one-way trip but it could be that you are looking at fully exchangeable first class tickets. If you are not looking at trainline.eu or sncf.com, you should look there for prices and buy train tickets as far in advance as possible because the lower price tickets sell out.

I have driven in Lyon and it is not horrible though I have to confess that my driving was limited to driving from the highway to a parking lot and then walking or using mass transit within the city. If you want to go to small towns or villages, I think a rental car makes the most sense. I'd check with AutoEurope, which is a broker and will offer up a number of rental car companies. My favorite in France is EuropCar but YMMV (no pun intended).

As to wine regions, I truly enjoy the Burgundy region but that is because I love the wines produced in France from the Pinot Noir and Chardonnay grapes. Lyon is within striking distance of a number of good wine regions so I would figure out what sorts of wines I wanted to focus on and then visit the region with that specialty. In the range of regions on that "side" of France, I would say that Burgundy is the most formal in terms of arranging visits and that Beaujolais if the least formal so depending on if you want to make appointments to see wineries that would lead to Burgundy and if you want to sort just drive around and stop in at open places, Beaujolais might be more interesting.

I got nothing when it comes to climbing because if you see me climbing, there is no fun involved and there is something behind me that I am trying to avoid, but I hope that others can make suggestions.

Posted by
3281 posts

I don’t know where you’re checking rail prices but I suggest you go to the SNFF.com website. I just check mid June prices (August not available yet) and there prices as low as €32 and as high as €97. Prices vary due to demand.

Regarding car rental, AutoEurope.com is highly recommended on this website. Prices and selection, as well as their customer service, are excellent. Youll need to get an International Driver Permit ($20 at AAA) and beware of the speed cameras. Also if you visit wineries, be aware that the blood alcohol limit is .05 and is strictly enforced. You’ll be able to drive to Switzerland but you’ll have to buy a vignette for about $42 at the border. Though I enjoy French wines, I’m not an expert on wineries and certainly not on climbing. Check tips about trains, cars, telephones and money in the Travel Tips section of this site.

Posted by
1194 posts

Have you considered doing a Via Ferrata? It would take a lot less gear - helmet, boots, harness, and via ferrata lanyard.
The US has very few Via Ferrara routes so it might be a fun change to try something with its origins in Europe.

Posted by
2466 posts

I will echo the sage advice to look on the SNCF website for the best deals. If you are flexible, you can go to the calendar and save some money. Otherwise, it's 90 days out.
I would go to Lyon or Dijon to learn about wineries.

Posted by
1230 posts

Climbing should be easy to find, but you would need a car. I just googled 'climbing eastern France' and got a lot. You could also look at Mountain Project. Between Paris and Lyon is Fontainebleu, which, while not sport climbing (its bouldering), is a very fun way to spend a ½ day. They have the climbs set up in succession, so you follow a path, if that makes sense. Bring some wine and bread and cheese :). I would also suggest calling guides in the area or outdoor stores that have climbing gear for climbing gear - I can't imagine you want to pack a rope and rack! Your luggage would be a pain to lug around. I have had luck calling Greece for the same purpose - its been easy to find gear to rent (although then you're using someone else's, and rental gear, which makes my husband leery). But we are just bringing shoes, harness and chalk.

http://www.climb-europe.com/RockClimbingFrance.htm

http://www.climb-europe.com/RockClimbingFrance/map-south-eastern-areas.html

https://www.mountainproject.com/area/106192575/france

The second link describes and area around Vaison la Romaine and Carpenters, which are in Provence. Being in Lyon, you would be close to Provence and thats worth a few days of your 3 weeks. Then south of there, and in the third link, there is a list on the left of areas and one of them is the Calanques. We didn't climb when at the Calanques but we saw climbers. Its on the Mediterranean. You hike in - which we did from the town called Cassis, east of Marseille. Looks like this:
https://www.google.com/search?q=cassis+calanques&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj-98Gt-vXZAhXj1IMKHWLoB0cQ_AUICygC&biw=1219&bih=715

Even if you don't climb there, it makes for a really fun hike and swim, and there's cliff jumping (trail map can be obtained from the TI at the beach of Cassis).

Then you could head further east and back north through the Alps....
There's some ideas. Have fun!
Jessica

Posted by
2916 posts

There are a lot of wine choices if you're starting in the Lyon area. To the northwest is Beaujolais and Burgundy, to the immediate south is the Northern Rhone (Cote Rotie, Condrieu, St. Joseph, St. Peray, etc.), and to the east is the Jura, Savoie, and Bugey; and further south is the southern Rhone. I've been to all of them, and I don't know which I consider the most worthy of visiting. They're all so different insofar as grape varieties used and styles. Beaujolais is beautiful, but the wines are all one grape variety -- Gamay. The wines of the northern Rhone are interesting because you'll find single varietal wines from grapes that elsewhere in France are usually part of blends. For example, Condrieu is only Viognier; St. Joseph, Hermitage, Crozes-Hermitage reds are basically all Syrah (they can add 5% Viognier to Cote Rotie).
To visit wineries in any of these areas you'll need a car, unless you can find a tour from a city. I'm attaching the link to my travel blog, which has some info about all of these areas, including wineries we visited, but you'll have to search through plenty of non-wine stuff.
http://mainelywinenews.blogspot.com/

Posted by
3398 posts

For climbing head down to Chamonix! There are a number of routes around Mont Blanc that are popular and breathtaking! If you head down into the Italian Alps in the Dolomites the climbing there is also excellent. Stay in a cozy refugio and climb right out the back door at some of them! The Langkoffelgruppe and the Drei Zinnen are great places to climb and each has a refugio where you can stay.

Posted by
713 posts

Regarding climbing, I'd second the recommendation to head into the Chamonix area -- as you head into Switzerland there are a number of sites as well. There are plenty of places to rent equipment. I'd also second the Via Ferrata recommendation. There are also some locations outside of Chambery, Annecy (up into the Alps) and Grenoble, if less popular sites appeal. (I used to live in Lausanne).

My favorites heading from Lyon are the area around Macon for whites, in/around Beaune/Nuits St. George and further south for Chanteauneuf du Pape and Gigondas. Just a general note -- many places require reservations, although some are open with general hours. Some towns will have tasting rooms that serve as cooperatives.

For these excursions into the countryside, a car is best. Don't forget that the main A highways also have tolls -- and we're not not talking pocket change, either.

Posted by
11294 posts

I didn't read all the above responses thoroughly, so I don't know if anyone mentioned this: If you take a car rented from France into Switzerland and then back to France, there shouldn't be any problem from the rental company (do check with them first). But you'll need a Swiss vignette to drive on Swiss highways, or you'll get a stiff fine. The vignette is instead of tolls, and costs 40 CHF for the year (shorter periods not available). If your rental car already has it, fine; if not, it makes for an expensive day trip.

The website to buy French rail tickets directly from SNCF is now https://en.oui.sncf/en/. As you have been told, tickets can indeed be very expensive at the last minute, but can be cheap if bought in advance and non-refundable. If you buy far enough in advance, you can often get first class for just a few more euros than second class.

Posted by
1829 posts

Just thought I would add since you mentioned it in your original post and no one discussed it.

Blockquote

Renting from a local company would be ideal of course, rather than from Hertz or something

Blockquote

This actually could not be further from the truth.
In Europe the "local small companies" usually have terrible reputations.
Stick with one of the big agencies.
Hertz. Avis, Europcar and Sixt are all good
Most use a consolidator like AutoEurope.com for making the booking as it is often cheaper especially if buying the insurance.
Auto Europe.com is actually a company out of Maine.

When renting a car online there is usually a question about going to other countries make sure to add Switzerland to it if you plan on doing so. Crossing the border is like going to another US state but you want to make sure there is no language in your rental contract restricting travel across borders ; usually insurance related and honestly usually the occasional limits are on the premium cars.
For a france car rental going into Switzerland it should be no problem.
Provided you are returning the car in France. It can cost a fortune to rent in France and return in Switzerland so don't do that.
As mentioned you will need a highway vignette for driving in Switzerland.