Help with daily itinerary specifics please?

Well-planned. I just have a bit of commentary. 8:30 usually means wheels down at 8:30. Allow 2 hours to disembark and get through immigration, etc. Have you checked what departure times are for your train to St. :Pierre de Corps? You may not make it to your hotel for check-in by 2:00 p.m. If you arrive later, you may not make it to Chenonceau that day. If not, you can fit it in on another day, in lieu of a wine tasting or another chateau, perhaps. But definitely visit Chenonceau. Of all the chateaux, it is the one not to miss.

Happy to see you are visiting a mushroom cave. We wanted to do that went last in the Loire area but didn't find the time. I'm envious!

Where did you find the info about drive time from the Loire Valley to Burgundy? Most sites (Google, viamichelin.com, etc.) list only the time for the drive and don't allow for gas/comfort/food stops, nor for any traffic problems. We almost always drive in France and add 1-2 hours to the suggested drive times (1 hour for a half-day drive, 2 hours for an all-day drive). Factor in an extra hour on that day. If you don't need it. great! If you do, you won't have a disappointment. You have all day that day, so I don't foresee any problems.

Good planning!

Just curious, are your staying in Bergheim the whole time in the Alsace region? Never been there. What made you decide on it? Inquiring minds want to know. Sounds like a great trip! Enjoy!

Hi Judy,

Thanks for your reply and comments:) To answer your questions--

-- Have you checked what departure times are for your train to St. :Pierre de Corps? Yes, I have. I'm afraid to pre-purchase tics because of the unknown time of arrival.

--We're both excited to see a mushroom cave--nerds, aren't we??

--drive time from the Loire Valley to Burgundy? I used both ViaMichelin and Google and added about 45 minutes to the time.

--staying in Bergheim the whole time in the Alsace region? Yes, we're in an Airbnb the entire 4 nights. We chose it because it seemed to have lots of things we like--less busy, well located, natural area, interesting things to see/do right in town and it's the king of Gewurztraminer wines and we like those a lot :)

Please feel free to add additional suggestions :)

About your Paris time:

Monday 27th: I enjoy the Montparnasse Cemetery. I also enjoy the Liberation Museum so if you can work it in later or put it on a future "to-do" list that is good. IF you have an interest in WWII the Army Museum is also good and open on Mondays. They have a Legion of Honor Museum within the Army Museum that honors the resistance fighters. The Army Museum is open every day.

Tuesday 28th: Which walk of GRA's are you using? He does not post on this forum that I know of, just Trip Advisor but knowing where you are going to walk might help with opinions on this day.

Wednesday 29th: This looks fine. Since it's a Wednesday, there should be a Paris Walks tour of Montmartre today. You might have to move Sainte-Chapelle to the afternoon as the walk is at 1030 if you decide this sounds like fun.

https://www.paris-walks.com/summer-walks_m.html

You'll have a great time in France!

Joby,
You are well-prepared and should have a fantastic time. Amusez-vous bien!

Hi Pam,

Thanks for your advice! I always appreciate your suggestions :) We're so excited for our trip.

This is the link to the walk I mentioned: GoingRoundAgain--- https://maps.app.goo.gl/q4dkwqtCWrRnyPKJ7

I've read of the Walks tours, but haven't investigated. I will do so :)

Well, I just saw your other post on the TA Paris forum and commented there because of the map link. (hahaha!!)

I honestly think Champs-Élysées is a fairly boring walk but many feel it's fun to do.

For myself, IF as suggested on your TA thread that you go to Marmottan first and take the Metro Line 9 from La Muette station back to Trocadero, I'd walk along the Seine (either side) from Trocadero to the Grand and Petit Palais and on to the Place de la Concorde. I didn't want to say that on the TA thread because GRA has gone to a lot of work to map out his walk suggestions and I don't want to hurt his feelings.

You can either walk on the river level or you can walk on the street level which is along some shaded paths.

Your choice, though!

Yes, a well-planned itinerary. Keep in mind that you may want to adjust it mid-trip, which is ok - it's your vacation, right?

Vedettes du Pont Neuf. If you can plan your trip so the boat passes by the Eiffel Tower after the sun sets, you'll get to see the Tower all lit up (and perhaps when the lights are blinking).

Re the train on your arrival day. Purchase a changeable ticket for the time that you think is most realistic. If you arrive at the station earlier or later than then, you can change the ticket. We did that once, and arrived early at the train station, so took the earlier train.

It’s a good plan. My only thought is regarding Amboise. Aside from arrival day and Chenonceaux, your sightseeing is oriented west of Tours (much so in Saumur.) While it’s a pretty easy drive on the Autoroute going east/west past Tours, if you stayed somewhere west of Tours it’s a little more convenient. RS guidebook suggests a few towns, including Azay-le-Rideau which seemed like a nice town to stay in when we passed through. You’d have to rearrange your visit to Chenonceaux, but the overall reduced driving is worth considering.

Pam, Thanks for the additional thoughts :)

Lexma, We're thinking about doing the Montparnasse Tower and the Pont Neuf river cruise. One we would like to take during the day and do the other at night. I'm kind of leaning toward the Montparnasse during the day on the first day and the river cruise at night. I could easily be swayed to reverse it though with other's suggestions :) I'll check out the changeable ticket.

awrzesinski , I appreciate your thoughts :) Our lodging is set though. It was hard to find just the right lodging location wise, price wise, and what we wanted in a lodging. We felt like our Loire lodging was the best fit for us.

Does anyone have more specific suggestions for the Burgundy part of our trip? Maybe certain towns/places to visit that might be in the parameters that we have? Specific places or things you have enjoyed? Wineries or tasting spots that were especially good?

I really appreciate all of the input from everyone!

Joby,
When we drove from Chambord (our last stay in the Loire) to Beaune, we stopped at Fontenay Abbey on the way. It was a great choice. The Abbey and grounds are beautiful and peaceful. We spent about 1 1/2-2 hours there. We chose it over Cluny because it was more convenient, but also because it looked to be less touristy. I am so happy we went. You could time it to have a picnic while there. You would have to bring your eats with you, as all that was there when we went was a coffee machine. The day was somewhat cloudy with the sun peeking out sometimes. It made for some great photos. Check it out online. It's truly impressive and lovely.
Just a thought.

According to the blogs the Montparnasse Tower is closing March 31 2026 for a multi-year reno.

https://www.sortiraparis.com/en/news/in-paris/articles/151159-renovation-of-montparnasse-tower-all-you-need-to-know-about-the-2026-2028-project

Joby, an alternative for a great view of Paris is the Panorama level at the Pantheon if your up for the climb. And a visit to the crypt is fascinating. Your best first time view of the Eiffel Tower, day or night is from the Place du Trocadero.

Judy, Thanks for the idea. We ALWAYS picnic/eat from a cooler at least once/day on trips.

Oooohhh, Pam, I think you just saved me a panic attack with that info on the Montparnasse Tower closing! Thanks so much for passing that along :)

jeanm, I appreciate the mention of the Pantheon view. I looked and it is nice. Now we just need to decide on what view and what time of day :) I was also thinking of the free views from Galleries Lafayette and Printemps maybe?

I'm rethinking our first day in Paris now--I also saw the Passy cemetery looks like a good spot to photograph and is not as big or busy as the other famous cemeteries. I'm trying to utilize time and logistics best for us. Maybe I should wipe our 1st day clean and rethink it entirely?

Thank you all :)

Joby. Are you getting the Passion Monuments Subscription? If so, both the Pantheon and Panorama and Sainte-Chapelle are included, as well as the Towers of Notre Dame.

Btw, I'm with Pam regarding the Champs-Elysee. Most of the avenue seems to be filled with car dealers, fast food restaurants and little charm. There are some great viewpoints, such at the Place de la Concorde looking west to the Arc de Triomphe.

Clue me in on the Eglise Notre Dame du Travail, please. I'm not familiar with it.

I prefer the Seine cruise at night with Paris lit up and the Eiffel Tower sparkling.

I took the Paris Walks Montmartre tour in 2023 and thought Peter did an excellent job of bringing the old Montmartre to life.

Your going to have a great trip!

Hi jeanm, I'm not sure we'd get money value out of the Passion Monuments Subscription? As to the Eglise Notre Dame du Travail, it's a very unusual church. I love to visit churches and wondered if it might be an interesting addition. https://notredamedutravail.net/

I "think" we're leaning towards the evening Seine cruise plus it would free up time in the day for something else.

We're so looking forward to this trip. I'm trying my hardest to plan a fantastic trip :)

Joby,
Your reference to the church Notre Dame du Travail made me curious, so I looked it up. The history is fascinating. Next time we are I n Paris (if it happens) I will definitely visit there. Fr. Soulange-Bodin sounds as if he could have been an inspiration for Dorothy Day here in the US. Thanks for the mention of the church! Paris always has something new to offer her guests!
Bon voyage!

Judy, Maybe we can compare notes some day :)

jeanm, I stand corrected by your suggestion of the Passion Monument pass. I said that I thought we wouldn't get the money value out of it. I confused it with the Paris Pass. It looks like the Passion Monument pass would save us at least half off of our admissions and maybe more. I saw that the Towers of Notre Dame ticket was included on the Monuments pass. That might be a great view out over Paris for us. We would certainly work off lots of extra calories :)

I think we will get the Duo pass, it's 70 Euros for the two of us, so 35/person it sounds like.

Thanks for the heads up!

Joby, that's great.

And don't forget that the Passion pass includes some monuments outside of Paris like the beautiful Chateau d'Azay le Rideau .

A highlight of our nine days in Paris was the bell tower climb of Notre Dame. Loved it a lot.

Also loved our food tours, including in Le Marais.

And Context Travel audio guides were great.

Nicely planned trip. I’ve done a lot of what you’ve planned and here’s some insights.

1. I’ve done the cdg to sp des corps train twice. The first time (2015) we encountered some exceptional delays and had to get on a later train. The second time (2017) it worked perfectly. Even with the issues on the first trip it only cost us $150 and 4 hours. Not a big deal overall. I would book train tickets based on your best estimate of timing when they become available.

2. We went to the mushroom cave in 2017. We loved it. Bring a jacket as it is cold. They are super friendly. The tour was surprisingly about 10 people so she did it in French and talked to us while we walked to catch us up. If it was just us she would have done the tour in English. Lots of tasty stuff to buy at the shop afterwards. Note that we were expecting it to be in French so her accommodation for us was a nice surprise. She was also super nice to our kids.

3. For Burgundy, you are staying much further west than we have so I’m hesitant to make too many recommendations, especially with respect to wine drinking. When we were last there (2022) we enjoyed a day trip to Arbois in the Jura. Different wine, Comte cheese everywhere, an excellent Louis Pasteur museum and an outstanding waterfall (easy) hike. We stayed in Nantoux so we had the wine and dinner experience here https://www.domaine-charles.com/. The pros are getting 5 glasses of wine, 3 of which were better than any wines I’ve ever had. Also fun to sit at a communal table with in our case 3 other groups of diners. The food was fine but the experience to us was better than a wine tasting.

4. When we drove from Burgundy to Alsace (2022) we stopped in Staufen Germany which had a fun Saturday market going on. Nice chance to eat some sausages and German pastries. It ended being my favorite food day during that week. You will see that every restaurant in Alsace will have Charcoute on the menu. You can actually buy it in a bag in Alsatian supermarkets, drop it in a pot, and enjoy with a nice bottle of wine at your rental house for a fraction of the price out. The museums in Colmar are outstanding.

5. We dropped off our car in strausbourg and took the tgv to Paris. It worked perfectly.

Have fun!

Matt

Jolie NC , I think we're going to add the Towers of ND now :) I climbed Brunelleschi 's dome in Florence and St. Peter's Dome in Rome in September 2024 on my solo trip. I think we can do it! Thanks to Pam, we will not count on the Montparnasse Tower view! now

Matt, Thanks for the confirmations!

What about our Burgundy portion--specific suggestions??? Wineries/wine tastings?

We've only been to the Burgundy area once, years ago. One full day exploring Beaune sounds about right.

My spouse is a huge oenophile, and he enjoyed some visits to wineries, but his comment has been that he doesn't need to repeatedly be shown how wine is made. His most enjoyable experiences (in the Italian Piedmont or the French Cote du Rhone) seem to have been those serendipitous occasions where the person at the winery and he have in-depth discussions about wine or the wine industry in general. (I drink wine, but am not so into it, so sometimes I go to the wineries, or sometimes I hang out at a nearby cafe with a coffee or other drink, which is lovely for me.) You may decide to change or cut back on some of your winery visits, but you can decide then and there. Another venue that spouse has enjoyed is town co-ops (called different things in different places), which have wines from a variety of local producers; the employers there tend to be very interested in wines, as well.

I don't know (or remember) what would be required to visit wineries in Burgundy, but in the Rhone, for example, we had to make arrangements in advance to visit for any place of note; there may be small producers that have signs out front if they are open for purchases.

I looked at the walk you have for Paris; I think I prefer walks that are focused within neighborhoods, and I don't find the entirety of the Champs Elysees that interesting. What I do love is watching the cars drive crazily around the Arc de Triomphe! I'm sure you can find neighborhood-specific walks, if you're interested in that kind of thing. I have done several walks with ParisWalks, which I like because they tend to be more niche - but they have more general walks, too.

Lexma, Thanks for the detailed post! It does look like I've penciled in a LOT of winery visits. I didn't really mean to say that we were visiting all wineries, in my mind I'm saying that we want to taste wines at either a winery or tasting room, but it doesn't read that way to readers :( Sorry! . I thought 1 actual winery visit in 1 place--either Loire, Burgundy or Alsace would be fun. The rest of the days we would like to taste different wines in more of a tasting room setting or Co-op as you've mentioned.

My husband is going to LOVE this--"What I do love is watching the cars drive crazily around the Arc de Triomphe! " Thinking maybe we should add in the climb to the top of the Arc in addition to our Notre Dame Towers climb? Although, I don't want either of us to have a heart attack while in France :)

As for walks, he's not huge into history or listening to people talk about it. He likes to just see things and hear the little bit of comment I may (or may not) know. I think an "on our own" walk might be a better fit for us.

I'd love additional comments if anyone has any. I can never seem to have too much info and/or choices ;-/

Hi, I've done a little tweaking on the Paris portion of our trip. What do you think of this portion now?

MON–ALSACE–PARIS

Drop car @ Colmar train station

Train from Colmar to Paris– Arrive 12 noon'ish?

Cemetery Montparnasse

Notre-Dame-du-Travail church

Walk back to lodging along Rue Daguerre (lodging near the Catacombes of Paris area)

Dinner (Maybe creperie of some kind?)

TUE–PARIS

St. Chapelle --9 am 1st entrance

Walk ½ day (https://maps.app.goo.gl/q4dkwqtCWrRnyPKJ7)

Musée Marmottan Monet

Dinner (budget)

Vedettes de Paris River cruise-sunset

WED–PARIS

Mass 8 am? & visit Notre Dame

Climb ND Towers

Fill the rest of the day with ??

Dinner (nicer dinner)

THUR–DEPART PARIS–CDG–HOME

8:00 am RER B train from Paris to CDG

Flight home 12:00pm (Noon)

Joby,
Paris looks great. You have lots of "loose" time to do or see something on the fly if you so choose.

Well done! (I am jealous. It's been almost 3 years since my last Paris visit and I don't know when I will get back.)

Judy, I'm trying so hard to plan a fabulous trip for us. I'm sure it will be my last time to France, so I want to do it right!!!

I'd still like to gather any additional suggestions for the rest of our itinerary (fingers crossed)!!!

Hi,

I've worked on the Burgundy portion a bit more. Putting together some previous ideas and asking the B&B owner for some suggestions, are there thoughts on this:

April 19-SUN

DRIVE FROM LOIRE VALLEY–BURGUNDY

Stop in Auxerre for 2-3 hours

Arrive at B&B in the late afternoon (Near Semur-en-Auxois)

20-MON–BURGUNDY

Semur en Auxois

Flavigny sur Ozerain

Abbey of Fontenay

Wine tasting at B&B

Dinner @ B&B

21-TUE–BURGUNDY

Vezelay

Noyers sur Serein

Castle of Bazoches

22-WED–BURGUNDY

Chateauneuf

Visit Beaune and in particular the City of Climates and Burgundy Wines

Wines at a winemaker in Auxey-Duresses

*** B&B proprietor offered to accompany us on this day :)

When in Beaune make sure you visit l'Hospital - fascinating! There are also a number of wine merchants / outlets there, that offer tastings. Also - check out market times for any of the places you are visiting - small producers are often selling their wines here.

stuchfam, We have every intention of visiting the l'hospital in Beaune :)

Hi all,

I feel like I'm getting closer to a final itinerary (fingers crossed)!

I still need a restaurant in Paris on Tuesday (between Musée Marmottan and Vedettes Pont Neuf River cruise

Thoughts on any of the creperies I've listed?

I'd also love to hear any restaurant suggestions for the Alsace and Loire portions of the trip.

I couldn't have done all of this specific planning without all of the help I've gotten--thanks so much!

Here's the updated itinerary:

WED–LOIRE VALLEY

Arrive CDG 8:30 am
Train to St. Pierre des Corps 11:17 am-1:04 pm
Pick up car rental at SPDC
Arrive to lodging near Amboise
Dinner

THUR–LOIRE VALLEY

Cadre Noir–10:30 am-11:30 pm show then 1 hr stables tour btwn 2-4pm only
Saumur
Winery or tasting visit
Dinner

FRI–LOIRE VALLEY

Château Chaumont-Sur-Loire

Roches mushroom cave
Chenenceau chateau
Winery or tasting visit
Dinner

SAT–LOIRE VALLEY

Chateau Azay Rideau
Musée Maurice Dufresne museum
Wine tasting
Mass–6:30 pm
Dinner @ lodging

SUN–LOIRE VALLEY–BURGUNDY

Drive from Loire lodging to near Semur-en-Auxois
Auxerre–3 hour stop
Arrive to Lodging
Dinner

MON–BURGUNDY

Semur en Auxois
Flavigny sur Ozerain
Abbey of Fontenay

Dinner @ B&B

TUE–BURGUNDY

Vezelay
Noyers sur Serein
Castle of Bazoches
Dinner
Wine tasting at B&B

WED–BURGUNDY

Chateauneuf
Beaune and in particular the City of Climates and Burgundy Wines
wines at a winemaker in Auxey-Duresses
Dinner

THUR–BURGUNDY–ALSACE

Drive from Burgundy to Bergheim
Tastings in the afternoon
Dinner

FRI–ALSACE

E-Bikes rental
Bike to Bergheim – Ribeauvillé (co-op)– Hunawihr (butterfly sanctuary)
Wineries
Dinner

SAT–ALSACE

Towns driving – Riquewihr - Kaysersberg- Eguisheim
Dinner

SUN–ALSACE

Mass
Walk the ramparts of Bergheim
Lunch in a traditional winstub
Kintzheim–Monkey Mountain
Wineries

Dinner

MON–ALSACE–PARIS

Train Colmar–Paris Grand E’ste– 10:01 am-12:35 pm

Gare de l'Est–take Metro 4 to Denfert-Rochereau, walk to lodging
Bags to lodging
Butte-aux-Cailles street art
Dinner–Verbalon? Chez Gladines??

TUE–PARIS

9:00 St. Chapelle
Walk ½ day (from map listed above)
Musée Marmottan
Dinner??
8:45 Vedettes de Paris River cruise-sunset

WED–PARIS

Mass and Visit Notre Dame
Climb ND Towers
Lunch–L'Initial (12-1:30)
Wander Paris
Cemetery Montparnasse
Walk along Rue Daguerre
Dinner–Creperie La Creperie Bretonne, Creperie de Josselin, La Crêperie du Clown, Plougastel crêper

Churches that look interesting and may try to fit in if near to where we're at:

Notre-Dame-de-Lorette
Saint-Germain-des-Prés
Église Saint-Augustin
Saint-Séverin
Crypt Beneath St. Joseph des Carmes

THUR–DEPART PARIS–CDG–HOME

8:00 am RER B train from Paris to CDG
(Walk to Denfert-Rochereau, take RER B to airport )
Flight home Noon

On your Wednesday in Paris, all the creperies you list are along the same street, right? There are also some interesting restaurants in the area if crepes don't appeal. You can certainly walk down the creperie street but if you decide you want something different, here's a video from Vero who is a Rick Steves guide. She likes a cafe called Le Select for French charm and good food. I've eaten there and I agree.

https://youtu.be/xlB_SftPL6U?si=xc-J6a3vDL2UgWGZ
https://francewithvero.com/blog/le-select/

Here it is on the map from Creperie Josselin so you can get an idea of the location and how near it is.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/r3g34FMfyvdu6dYV7

If you or your husband are Josephine Baker fans, you might want to pop in for an "apero" (before dinner drink) at the art deco La Coupole where she often went along with other celebs! It's pretty pricey for me for dinner so I prefer Le Select.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Coupole_(Paris)

I also thought of you yesterday but I didn't remember who it was that is staying in the area, lol. There is a garden that is opening to the public for the first time after a huge renovation. They are the Jardin du Val-de-Grâce at 74 Boulevard de Port-Royal. Here's a link if you do FB.

https://www.facebook.com/love.french.france/posts/pfbid037UjdkjtVaQB5fmr7EavBCkUsQQCC8NKHTERjLxgb6HhGiLyKkJYsPLrV6EoXmZeVl?rdid=dQe80QFjpYkVUMNi

Hi Pam,

Thanks for the info, I've put it all in my notes :)