French Waiter Article

I'm not very tech literate but this MAY be the link to the article. Fun read! http://www.wsj.com/articles/in-defense-of-the-notoriously-arrogant-french-waiter-1424371178

Cool article. I love the waiters at Les Deux Magots.

I enjoyed the article. I try to speak in French to waiters (fortunately there are only a certain number of phrases that have to be said, you're not going to discuss the meaning of life with him).

But I've had mixed results: I survived (not the food but the interaction with the waiter) has been the best outcome.
I've had worse outcomes: One restaurant in Paris completely ignored us and we finally took the hint and left after 20 minutes. Apparently we had unknowingly gotten into a locals only or French only restaurant that just didn't serve certain people (and we were nicely dressed). It's only happened once.

I've been grateful to be corrected by waiters as to my pronunciation of French, and also corrected in wine selection when I ordered a wine that would conflict with the sauce on the meat dish. I thanked them, but these days I just order the house red or house white, depending on the food I'm going to order. I was told that, unlike here, no good French restaurant would risk its reputation by having a bad house wine, so it's a safe selection and you only have to choose between red and white and not make more sophisticated judgments. :-)

And I learned (this is for dinner in a formal restaurant): Don't order coffee (cafay) until the end of the meal. You can order it before, and he may just nod, but you won't get the coffee until last.

And don't call him garcon!

Very good article. Years ago I was a bit testy with the service in France. I was really tired, from not sleeping well for a week. Had a manager in training from Ireland. He explained to me the difference in French servers VS US servers. French servers are not as friendly as US and they are like that to everyone. Most Americans think they are just like that to Americans. Once he explained the difference I was fine. Part of traveling is experiencing the different cultures. And sometimes I wish we had some of there customs here. Europe they do not rush you to turn over the table. Once you sit down that is your table for the night. They do not bring you your next course until your done with the current. We where once in a restaurant and didn't want to eat the whole salad and kept waiting for them to bring out our main dish. We finally placed the dish aside and the waitress hopped up and returned with our main dish. She was waiting for us to finish or indicate we where done. How many times are you only half way thru started salad and your main coarse come out here?

Good points Wendy. And thank goodness, no server in France is going to tell you "good choice" or "do you want the change."
I really like that she demonstrated the professionalism, the efficiency, and the discretion of the servers in France. Too bad she brought up silly stereotypes beginning with the title.
OTOH,
You rarely order dessert when you order the first two courses, only when it's marked on the menu because it's a tart or souffle that takes time to prepare, and finally, she didn't really get the wry humor of the waiter who told her he doesn't contradict ladies.
After forty years with a French husband, I could hear that line opening into a pretty funny banter between all of us. Waiters do make small talk, silly wry jokes. She didn't get it.

(edit: she didn't say the following--it was in the comments at the end--my bad-senior moment: "in the article she says to say "bon courage" to someone who is working; it's condescending. You'd say it to a good friend who is working, but not someone serving you in a restaurant, a store, etc.)

I've never experienced what I would consider intimidation or condescension from any waiter in France. Personally I love their professionalism and demeanor a great deal more than the usual waiter in the US with all the phony friendliness, facial piercings, and tattoos. TC

The article is saying French waiters seem to have a certain attitude.
What do you think?

I agree with Emma. French waiters are not arrogant, they are professional.

What I find really annoying is the people who stand outside the restaurant trying to entice you inside. You find them in some mediterranean resorts (especially Greece), in Italy, and in Mexico.
The moment I stop to read the menu, they seam to pounce. What I want to say to them is:
"I can read the menu, I am not illiterate, and you insisting on reading the menu out to me is an insult, because it implies I am incapable of reading the menu myself. Furthermore, your wages for your waste-of-time job presumably is included in the cost of the meal. I refuse to pay you to annoy me". Whenever I encounter these idiots, I move on the the next restaurant.

Emma & Chris,
Exactly so.

Oh Chris - I found that in Rome and Venice especially they are waving the menus at you - but only in the really touristy parts. I am learning now when we travel to get off the beaten path for better food at a better price.

Never had any issue in Paris that I remember - but we don't frequent expensive places (not that pricey = 'arrogant').

My weirdest interaction - the first or second time we ate at Friendly's while travelling in Maine or NH...we were trying to decide what to eat, so the waitress is like...'well, I'll just sit here with you while you decide' and she plops herself down in the booth! I wasn't sure whether to LOL or WTF! Of course, then we felt very pressured to hurry up and decide (whether that was her intention or not) and after we ordered I say to hubby...well...I guess that's why they call it Friendly's! And we do tend to eat at Friendly's at least once whenever we got to the States...I love the ice cream! One time we ordered a meal that came with the sundaes for dessert...we told the waitress hubby didn't like cherries so she could put his on mine...I swear to God I had 8 or 9 cherries on my sundae when it came out...too funny.

Nicole - An advantage of living in the northeastern US - Friendly's ice cream is generally not only available in the chain supermarkets, but is often loss-leadered. And as for the restaurants, they are at least consistent across locations and you know basically what you are getting.

Enjoyable article. I definitely prefer a professional French waiter to an American waiter who pretends he's your best friend. And for those WSJ subscribers out there, I wonder why I was able to read the article from the link. Normally a link to a WSJ article (including from this forum) bring you to the headline with a statement that you have to be a subscriber to read it.

That was an entertaining article. I rarely encounter waiters of the type described in the article, possibly as I don't frequent the high class joints. I've found the waiters in Paris are very efficient but definitely not chatty.

I've yet to encounter a Paris waiter like the one in the National Lampoons European Vacation movie. There's a YouTube clip of that scene, but I can't post it here as it's not exactly "polite".

A bit of warmth in a waiter is to my liking, otherwise just substitute tablets.

I didn't realize there was already a thread on this article. I thought this comment, under the story was also interesting:
"My family had an interesting experience with a Paris waiter who perfectly embodied their attitude, and the requirements of the customer. Seated just a few minutes before a french couple, our family of four was enjoying our pre-dinner drinks when the waiter returned and before taking our order volunteered with a nod towards the couple "They did not say Bonjour I will not serve them". We were a little shocked at his candor, but indeed some 20 minutes later after we had been served our diner, the other couple stood up and left, not having been served so much as a glass of water. Thank goodness we took to heart the guidebook advice to always preface a conversation with "Bonjour Monsieur" or "Bonjour Madame". So it dawned on us the renowned Paris rudeness was not rudeness at all, but a strict adherence to manners."

Personally, I'm a huge fan of dry humor. You know what they say, "He who laughs last, didn't get the joke."

I'm glad Brad posted this because you can't overstress the importance of the hello and goodbye in France, even in Paris. It's a real slap in the face in France not to recognize the other people in the room, even if it's only a nod and a mumbled bonjour. You don't have to shout out to all the diners, but you do have to acknowledge any personnel you run across. Nods and communicating with the eyes go a long way in these cases. The same is true in small stores, except a pharmacy where you want to be more discreet. In a booming cafe, you won't intrude on people, but you need to greet the personnel.

On the other hand, it's still a bit surprising that personnel who work with the public, meaning international public, aren't always used to the ways things are done in other countries and don't realize it's not intentional rudeness but a different way of interacting. Bottom line: it's very insulting in France to enter or leave a place, particularly a small place, without acknowledging the presence of other human beings--and their dogs, of course.

I appreciate waiters correcting my French pronunciation. I have also recently appreciated several Parisian waiters who could just as easily have spoken English, but then they remembered, "this one wants to speak French," and humored me.

A very interesting article. It is worth mentioning that French waiters and waitresses vary in their style according to the type of establishment they are working in. In a small cafe frequented by locals who go there almost every day there will be banter and jokes between the customers and the waiters. But it is true that a waiter will almost never interact any more than is necessary with a customer that they do not know, for the simple reason that it is assumed that customers go to restaurants and cafes to eat and drink and talk among themselves, and not to have a conversation with the waiter other than to discuss eating options.

Note to Robert, the WSJ is not consistent about locking or unlocking their articles. I think sometimes when they think they have something that is going to be really rich clickbait they unlock it to increase page views. And it also seems to matter whether you find the article from Google, or search on the WSJ site. And also the phase of the moon.

Great article. Thanks for the reference.

Our experience with the waiters, and service personnel in general, was very positive -- from polite and professional to downright friendly, with one waiter even bringing us a free banana loaf to go with our cafe cremes after a very helpful, energetic, and cheerful lesson in polite french conversation.

We have been to France for the past 15 years. Many happy days spent in Nice, Paris, Bordeaux, etc. Every waiter we ever encountered was good. There is none of " Hello, my name is Patty and I will be your server today". They are paid good wages and do not need tips to make it. Almost all are efficient and well versed in the menu and accompanying wines if you ask.

Somebody above said a little warmth from a French waiter might be nice.
It would be, but in Paris, as an American tourist you may not get warmth from a waiter. Business-like efficiency, and a professional knowledge of food, if you ask for his recommendations, might be more like what to expect.

I think I understand the approach of both American and French waiters. It's just different cultures.
It's different over there. I think that's one reason why at least some of us go, for the differences.

Hey wait a minute, you mean I'm not supposed to stay in Holiday Inns, want ice in my Coke and visit Mickey D's when I'm travelling? Well then why bother?

In that case you can order a Grenadine instead.

No, I've never been intimidated by a French waiter. They're professional, you do the same. Order in the language, know exactly what you want, say it directly and politely. If you want to engage in any banter, if you see the waiter doing that with other customers, then sharpen your language skills and pronunciation to near fluency.