French language etiquette

Always je voudrais ("I'd like"); je veut is "I want," and sounds just as harsh in French to a waiter as it does in English.

or you could say "Je prends" when ordering which means "I take"

You say bon jour to waiters just as in any other initial interaction.

Depending on the situation, after the bonjour you can drop the verb and go to the un/e .... s.v.p.

You can communicate just fine in a restaurant with no verbs -- the name of what you want and sil vous plait works -- or even pointing and silvous plait works -- but the bon jour at first interaction is obligatory if you don't want to be considered a clod.

Hi Denise,
I agree with Harold. I rarely use "je veux" as it sounds a bit harsh. In fact, when teaching my children to speak French, I haven't even introduced them to this yet. They use "j'aimerais" as "I would like..." and "je voudrais" is perfectly acceptable as well. The fact that you're trying to figure this out now tells me that you are going to be well received over there. Have fun!

I also say "j'aimerais" when ordering food. My son, who had only 1/2 year of French 1, said "je voudrais." He always ordered in French and he was complimented many times. Don't worry about getting it perfect -- just do your best! And don't be surprised if you have difficulty understanding French menus. They are full of specialized words!

The fact that you are even asking about using "voudrais" puts you in the minority of the minority of tourists and French as a second language students!

If you ask " qu'est-ce que ça va dire?"[what does this word mean?] servers will be helpful.

In my experience, your efforts will be noticed and appreciated. If you are humble about your abilities, I have noticed people are more likely to be patient and helpful.

So ... is it better to ask the waiter if he speaks English before attempting poor French pronunciation, in the interest of time?

I think it's a matter of chance once the French waiter/waitress hears your American accent and will automatically switch over to English, whether that matters to you or you like it or not. My French isn't bad but it is obviously not native, which obviously they can detect, or even close to any level of fluency. There were times when the waiter did switch to English upon hearing me order, just as there were times when they stuck to speaking French when they knew (obviously) I was a foreigner. This applies not only at a restaurant but also at check-in at a small hotel. Usually, they stuck to speaking French (a greater chance of that) if the place was outside of Paris.

Fred says that sometimes the French "stuck to speaking French" even though it was obvious he was a foreigner. Of course, it may not have been nastiness on their part .... maybe they could not speak English. It always surprises me that everyone in France is expected by some people to be perfectly comfortable in English. I doubt the French when visiting America expect to be spoken to in French.

When ordering, how would you say: "I would like this." (pointing to the item on the menu)

Je voudrais ça, s'il vous plait.
or
Je voudrais ce (m.) or cette (f.), s.v.p?

I have had the same range of experiences as Ben and Fred. I would say that some waiters "chose to stick to French" in response to my attempts, not because they could not have switched to English just as easily. There have been waiters who did speak English to other customers, but continued to reply to me in French, if I continued to address them that way. I also think that a younger generation of servers working today are more schooled in English and less likely to stand on formality.

In the fancier restaurants I have visited (thinking of Michelin-starred places near San Sebastian, Spain), each meal started with the waiter asking which language I would prefer to speak.

Ben, thanks for the reply.
What you said corresponds to my understanding, this versus that. And I think either one would work for me in a restaurant ordering situation.
I think I'll go with that (ca), since apparently I don't have to know the gender of the noun (I'll be pointing anyway).
And my French will already be so bad that they will probably not even care if I end my sentence with a preposition. As long as I get my bonjour monsieur and s'il vous plait in there! :)

In case anyone doubted I did not mean to imply nor was I suggesting that those French I came across in the service industry had any nastiness on their part by sticking only to French. Since they did, so did I. I assumed they probably were not comfortable using English (assuming the person knew it) and since I had started the dialogue in French, ie at check-in, it was natural to proceed in French. In 1984 my first time in Metz I used German at the train station hotel since that reception guy spoke that too and my French was next to none then.

In response to Kent's question -- I echo Ben in saying that I don't think you can phrase the sentence that way (and I loved your phrase Ben about doing less preaching and more learning).

My instinct tells me that if you were trying to do this, you would have to point at the item and say, "Je voudrais ce plat-ici" . . .but overall it strikes me as a bit "off" and not really done (and you'd have to know masculin/feminine for plat, dessert, etc. because ofr feminine, you'd say, "Je voudrais cette entrée-ici)." And none of that still sounds right (again, to my non-native ear, so I may be totally off-base.

I think you're much better off with "Je voudrais la cote du boeuf," (while indicating the item on the menu with your finger), je voudrais la crême brulée," "je voudrais les oeufs brouillés" . . . you still should distinguish between the M/F le/la, but doing the wrong one is much less obvious with le/la than if you're having to choose correctly among ce/cet/cette or celui-ci/celle-ci . . .

Kim, thanks for the suggestions.
The language thing gets so complicated that I may just stick to my original Paris eating plan: a combination of picnics, informal cafes, and falafel stands.
Formal restaurants seem to expensive, too complicated language-wise, and eating too late (it doesn't work for me eating a big meal at or after 8pm).

Kent -- I don't mean to discourage!

And I'm still trying to think up some good casual places for you . . . but you've had so many good ideas already, I don't feel TOO bad.

I definitely get tired of eating full, sit-down meals when I'm traveling. Sometimes I just don't feel like going through the whole ordeal and spending that much time and psychological energy. That's where the take-out, the roast chicken from the rotisserie, the cobbled-together meal from the grocery store . . or, the FAST FOOD comes in.

Kim, and the others:
Thank you, you've been very helpful.
With respect to Paris, I can totally identify with Kim's statement: "Sometimes I just don't feel like going through the whole ordeal and spending that much time and psychological energy."

Exactly, all we want to do is eat. The informal cafes, picnic and falafel stand are looking better all the time. :)

Cobbling together a meal, yes! Some of my favorite (and cheaper) meals in Paris have included cold chicken from a grocery store, some incredible cheese from a fromagerie, beautiful fruit from a market, a bottle of wine, pastries from Gerard Mulot, and a place to sit on a quai along the Seine and watch the boats go by.