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France and Italy trip - 2018

Hello,
We are planning our European trip around May 2018. Basically we'd like to start our journey from Paris then to Bordeaux, Lyon, Nice, Cannes and Milan Italy which is the final destination and will fly back home to LAX from Milan. We will stay around 3-4 days in each city. What's the recommended rail pass to purchase? Does the rail pass covers all the cities mentioned above? Any seats reservations do we need to make in advance? Please advice.

Thank you,
Paul

Posted by
8069 posts

Rail passes are almost always a terrible idea; since you know your itinerary buy point to point tickets 3 mos or so in advance for lowest rates. Rail passes require reservations on all long haul/high speed trains and they are costly and limited (there are only X number available for pass holders). Be very sure you have costed out the alternatives before investing in an expensive pass and be sure it will actually save you money. They are sort of like Traveler's Checks -- largely obsolete.

Posted by
11294 posts

You will need reservations for most of these trains. If you buy a ticket (in advance or on they day of travel, online or at the station) any required reservations are included. If you use a rail pass, you have to buy a separate reservation.

For France, the number of reservations available to rail pass holders is limited for each train. So, even if there's space on the train, once the rail pass holder reservations are gone you can't use your pass. You can then either buy a full ticket (no longer cheap since it's close to travel) or take a different train that does still have pass holder reservations available.

For this reason, even Rick Steves recommends getting all of your required France reservations at the time you buy your pass - negating one of the main potential advantages of a pass, spontaneity.

Also, French train tickets can be quite cheap if bought in advance, as long as you can live with non-refundable and non-exchangeable tickets (or tickets that severely limit those actions). Since it sounds like you already know when you're traveling where, this shouldn't be a problem. Full fares on some trains in France can be quite high. On the other hand, if you buy French rail tickets right when they go on sale, you can often get first class for just a few euros more than second class!

For Italy, reservations are not quantity-limited for rail pass holders. Here, the problem is that regular fares are low, and advance purchase fares are even lower. So, a pass is a waste of money.

If you want to learn more about the issues of using a pass vs last minute tickets vs advance purchase tickets, read this great summary from rail guru The Man In Seat 61: https://seat61.com/Railpass-and-Eurail-pass-guide.htm#railpass-or-point-to-point-tickets

To find schedules, including which trains have mandatory reservations, use the Bahn (German Rail) website http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en, following Rick's tutorial: http://www.ricksteves.com/travel-tips/transportation/trains/online-schedules

To find out where to buy tickets, go back to The Man In Seat 61: https://seat61.com/Europe-train-tickets.htm

Posted by
4132 posts

Given some logistical constraints, you might consider connecting these dots as follows.

By train: Paris > Lyon > Nice (w Cannes day trip).

Then fly to Bordeaux, and fly to Milan.

It will save you a lot of time and wear.

Posted by
7175 posts

Rather than Lyon, I would travel direct (cross country) via Carcassonne and Provence to reach the Côte d'Azur.

Paris
Bordeaux
Carcassonne
Arles (Provence)
Nice (Cannes)
Milan

Posted by
1825 posts

That's an odd choice of stops for someone who doesn't seem to have been to Europe before, why those places? Have you already booked airfare? Bordeaux and Lyon sound like you are a foodie but I'd swap Burgundy for Bordeaux because Bordeaux is way out of your way. If you skip Milan you could do a big easy circle around France. Unless you want a full day of trains I'd fly between France and Italy which will narrow your choices.

Posted by
2 posts

Thanks for all the responses. It really helps in finalizing my France & Italy trip itinerary.