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90 Day beyond Schengen agreement between France and US?????

I recently read that France and US have a reciprocal agreement in which US citizens may remain or travel to France for an additional 90 days beyond the 90 day Schengen limit. During that time, they are not permitted to leave France (though I don't know how you would regulate that) and they must depart from France. Can anyone confirm this?

Posted by
5010 posts

I've never heard of that before.

You say you recently read it. Where?

Posted by
1121 posts

I have heard of this but it it not a 90 day extension to a regular 90 day visit. The 6 month visa requires your obtaining special permission which is not unlike an ordinary 1 year visa. It´s a lot of work and expense for only 6 months. You´ll need to make an appointment at the appropriate French embassy or consulate and complete the requirements which include, but are not limited to proof of medical insurance, adequate financial resources, and background checks.

Posted by
3436 posts

Yes, apparently it is true. Talk to your closest French consulate or embassy.

You can stay 90 days in Schengen, leave to a non Schengen country, and then return directly to France and stay an additional 90 days. You must then return directly home to a non Schengen country. You are supposed to stay in France during the additional 90 days. You cannot work. You may be required to show proof of financial situation that will cover your expenses plus insurance for the time you are in France.

Posted by
2815 posts

I knew this was true in Denmark, did not know about France and Poland! Quite a sensation. But note that if you do this, you can't fly Icelandair or WOW back to the US, then you exit Schengen in Keflavik, not Paris or Copenhagen, you must exit Schengen where Danish or French or Polish law is in effect and overwriting the Schengen treaty. Ditto returning from France or Denmark via Delta @ Amsterdam or United @ Frankfurt, those would not work.

https://www.nomadicmatt.com/travel-blogs/how-to-legally-stay-in-europe-for-more-than-90-days/

For U.S. citizens, France has a bilateral agreement that allows the US citizens to stay an additional 90 days beyond the Schengen limit – without a visa!! Seriously. You can spend another 90 days in France. You can enter from any Schengen country, stay 90 days in France, and then fly home. But you have to go home. You can’t go elsewhere. You have to leave Europe so you can’t use your time in France as a sneaky way to reset your Schengen clock.

Additionally, Denmark and Poland also have bilateral agreements with the United States that let citizens stay an additional 90 days in each country separate from the regular Schengen Zone visa. The Denmark rule applies the same way as the French one. You must travel directly from another Schengen country to Denmark. After your stay in Denmark, you cannot transit through other Schengen countries to get back to the US, you will have to fly directly or transit through non-Schengen zones. The Denmark additional 90-day stay is applicable for citizens of Australia, Canada, Chile, Israel, Japan, Malaysia, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea and the US.

Posted by
8889 posts

I am vary dubious about this. Entrance rules are agreed internationally as part of the Schengen Treaty. Any country letting people in above the limits would cause a row with the others.
"During that time, they are not permitted to leave France" - how do you stop them?

What you are perhaps confusing this with is a residence visa. Each country has their own rules about who they issue residence visas to, and under what conditions (is working allowed?). A residence visa only allows you to live in that country, you are still limited to 90 days in the other Schengen countries.

Can anybody provide a link to a (reliable) website that says this?

Posted by
3436 posts

Since the information found so far on the net is not from the French government, that is why I stated to consult with the embassy or consulate. And just like any other entry into France, or other European country, you may be asked for details such as your financial situation at time of entry.

Sure, it is difficult to stop someone from exiting France into the surrounding countries. But, for example, if you get stopped by the police outside of France after the 90 day Schengen limit, you will probably be fined and forcibly sent home for exceeding the Schengen limit if there is no actual visa to show that would allow your extended time.

Posted by
2815 posts

Here's the Danish exemption which is somewhat well known,

https://www.nyidanmark.dk/NR/rdonlyres/661EB9C1-74E3-4FFA-BF18-721DD5635A73/0/overview_travel_documents_17102017.pdf

page 14, the odd thing with Denmark is that the passport holder is only eligible for 90 additional days in Denmark if the previous 90 Schengen days have not been in the "Nordic Countries." So 90 days in Spain then 90 days in Denmark is OK, 90 days in Sweden then even one more day in Denmark is not.

Posted by
646 posts

Let me see if I am understanding this. If I wanted to stay in the Schengen zone for between 90 and 179 days, I could spend the first 90 days anywhere in the zone and then on the 90th day cross the border into Poland, Denmark, or France and stay in that country for 90 days. After that I would have to exit the Schenegen zone. If so must my immediate destination be home, or could I head to Britian for 180 days and then return to the Schengen zone?

I just read the Denmark exception. It's complicated. Anytime spent in a Nordic country in the 180 days prior to the 90 day extension is deducted from the 90 day extension:

"Irrespective of whether they may have stayed in another Schengen State
prior to entering Denmark, nationals of Australia, Canada, Chile, Israel, Ja-
pan, Malaysia, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea and the United States of America (USA), with which Denmark has bilateral visa exemption agree-
ments, have the right to freely enter and stay in Denmark for up to 90 days
reckoned from the date of their first entry into Denmark or another Nordic
country. The time the foreign national has stayed in Denmark or another
Nordic country within the last 180 days will be deducted from the men-
tioned 90 days."

Posted by
4457 posts

It is true for Denmark:
https://www.nyidanmark.dk/NR/rdonlyres/DBCBF916-FDF6-4209-AFFB-027416AB394B/0/overview_travel_documents_04042017.pdf

V. Stay in Denmark after a stay of 90 days in another Schengen State

Irrespective of whether they may have stayed in another Schengen State prior to entering Denmark, nationals of Australia, Canada, Chile, Israel, Ja- pan, Malaysia, New Zealand, Singapore, South Korea and the United States of America (USA), with which Denmark has bilateral visa exemption agree- ments, have the right to freely enter and stay in Denmark for up to 90 days reckoned from the date of their first entry into Denmark or another Nordic country. The time the foreign national has stayed in Denmark or another Nordic country within the last 180 days will be deducted from the mentioned 90 days.

Posted by
2815 posts

No luck finding any (other) reference for France, but did turn this up, unofficial, for Poland, see "Old Bilateral Agreements with Poland and Hungary"

http://trueanomaly.org/2017/08/16/how-americans-can-legally-stay-in-europe-more-than-90-days/

Which jibes with the Denmark situation, a pre-existing national law that was NOT changed by the Schengen treaty.

NB: "After spending 90 days in either Poland or Hungary, its not safe to directly travel outside either of these countries to any other Schengen nation without being at risk of deportation"

Would be nice to get real life examples of people who use these exemptions, and also if there are any Schengen re-entry issues with a passport showing a (non-recorded) Schengen overstay.

Because these country-by-country exemptions operate beside the Schengen Treaty, there's no value in posting links to the Schengen Treaty regulations.

Posted by
6513 posts

Can anyone confirm this?

The French Embassy/Consulate office

Posted by
401 posts

This would be a good place to provide a reference to the source providing that information.

Otherwise, you can work with your prevailing French consulate to work through the paperwork and obtain a valid visa for a longer stay.

Posted by
2815 posts

Otherwise, you can work with your prevailing French consulate to work through the paperwork and obtain a valid visa for a longer stay

But visa fees and travel costs to a French Consulate can top $1000. Assuming that the reason for the longer stay is to save the costs to return home, well, by getting a visa you haven't saved anything, it costs the same as going home and flying back.

Posted by
85 posts

I have just sent an inquiry to French Embassy and will share results when I hear back. Thank you all for your feedback.
Sally

Posted by
85 posts

Somewhere I learned about an additional 90 day visa which requires one to purchase medical insurance overseas policy. Haven't look into it further as my travel plans have evolved elsewhere. Interested in learning more.

Posted by
5719 posts

This is all quite interesting; I look forward to someone nailing it down. Getting an extended visa is a real pain so this would be great for many people if it is in fact possible t do.

Posted by
85 posts

Never heard back from French Embassy and energies diverted elsewhere but very interested in details for future travel if someone has time to nail them down. Thanks.

Posted by
8293 posts

Why don't you phone the French Embassy, asking for the Visa Section. One phone call won't take up much of your time. The nearest French Consulate might work for you, too.

Posted by
8889 posts

The way to check this is to exit the Schengen Area on day 90 to somewhere nearby, say the UK, and then a few days later try to get a train from London to Paris. The Schengen immigration check is done at St Pancras station in London by a French immigration officer.
See if they have heard of this special exception for US citizens going to France.

That is, AFAIK, the only way to enter the Schengen Area, directly to France, on a land border. All other ways in are via other Schengen countries, or involve flying. In the latter case it is an airline employee who checks your passport, and they are very unlikely to know this rule (if it exists).

Posted by
6513 posts

Looks like the webmaster has done some 'house cleaning'....?

Posted by
8293 posts

Earlier today I reported it as questionable.