Thoughts on two day London itinerary?

Emma makes some very valid points.

I think that you will find that you don't have time for half that you have planned each day.

If you want to get tickets for a show, Saturday night will be the busiest night for the theatre and therefore there will be fewer discounted tickets available. The TKTS booth opens at lunchtime, so try to get there as close to its opening as possible. If the bike tour finishes at 6.30, you are going to be pushed to get back, showered and out for a show. You don't have time, even forgetting the shower part!

I am an experienced cyclist based in the UK, but there is no way you would get me on a bike in central London! Far too much traffic and manic drivers.

Excellent point about biking. I also agree trying to jam too much into day of arrival.

Keep options open and consider these spots for dining.

Leadenhall Market or The Blackfrair pub instead of Hung, Drawn and Quartered after your tour of the Tower. The first is a glass covered market (been there since the 14th century) adjacent to the sci fi architecture of Lloyd's of London. Very unique.The Blackfriar is a gorgeous art deco across the road from the Blackfrair station. The pot pies are lovely.

If I had teenagers I'd bypass Greenwich and explore on of these markets; Brick Lane, Spitafields, Camden Lock or Portobello markets instead. Far more eye candy and far more "hip." Just go early to whichever you choose and I mean by 9am.

As far as a Sunday roast if you happen to explore Portobello Market as suggested on Saturday you can walk over to The Castle on the corner of Clarendon and Holland Park Avenue and make a reservation for your Sunday roast. Lovely neighborhood pub. http://www.castlehollandpark.co.uk/sundays

Maybe you could start Sunday at Camden Lock Market in the morning then tube to Holland Park for you afternoon pub roast there, then walk it off by walking to Kensington Gardens and Hyde Park.

Enjoy your stay.

I would suggest getting to TKTS prior to there opening(10:00am i think)

Thanks for the suggestions and the language clarity! It seems like trying to make the Borough Market before it closes at 6 is unlikely, so I will be flexible. Our plan was simply to be outside and walking on that first day. We plan to stick to the south side of the Thames, and will go on the bridges because my kids like bridges and are excited to be on the bridges they have seen in movies, but will only go partway out and back. We really have no other plans than a Thames walk that afternoon/evening for the glorious views and the bridges, so we can easily be flexible about eating. Are there lots of food truck/ quick bite places along the Thames? I'm not sure sitting down in a dark restaurant while trying to keep sleepy teens awake is a great idea. The plan is to boat back after the walk for the views, but we can easily take the tube back, as well.

We may swap out Camden Market for Greenwich on Sunday morning, if the kids want. We had looked at it previously for an afternoon jaunt, but were put off by reports of streets being so jammed on Sundays that it is hard to get around. The suggestion to go in the morning might help with the crowds. We do come from the San Francisco area, so there are similar stores and markets here. DH is interested in Greenwich and standing on the Prime Meridian and seeing the Maritime Museum, so we will have to weigh those options out that morning, I think.

The bike tour we have chosen is done mostly through the parks and bike lanes. We go by Kensington Palace, Buckingham Palace, Westminster Abbey, and Trafalgar Square. It should be minimal street exposure.

I love the Blackfriar idea. It seems quite convenient, as well. Thanks for all of the suggestions and the reality check. I will check out the other ideas tonight after work.

Emma: Calling a grocery store or a supermarket just 'a market' is a regionalism, NE USA I think. It's not standard American usage.

There are trains direct from Gatwick to London Bridge, then a black cab from there would make a lot more sense then goofing around with Victoria and the tube.

The whole itinerary is really 3 times what a person could comfortably accomplish. Both the first and last days are just silly. Two things a day, or 1 big thing and 2 little, is a realistic goal.

I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding the tip, but when you say that we are trying to do too much on our first day, do you mean our arrival day? Because all I have planned is a walk and grabbing a bite wherever along the walk (although looking for recommendations!) Our last day the plan includes Greenwich in the morning and trying to hit St. Paul's in the afternoon with nothing else definitive planned (but options if we need them). Am I that far off base on what we can accomplish?

To that point, I agree that trying to hit a show on Saturday (2nd night) probably won't work out. It's too much. We will just grab a bite to eat and wander around Covent Garden on Saturday.

I was wondering about which train was better to where we are headed in London. I will take your advice and take the train to London Bridge. I guess Victoria Station is crazy?

Thanks for all of the advice!

Walking from your apartment to the Eye is 3 miles which may be realistic but seems like a lot to me. I'm not sure the first half is a quality walk. You may find taking a boat or tube to Bankside or Blackfriars and starting a walk there makes sense as you can see the water easily starting there and going west. Tate Modern is open Fri/Sat evenings and is free.

I don't think seeing both big churches back to back makes sense with children. Unless you are regular churchgoers and your children are used to the boredom I'd not substitute a normal visit for Evensong, which is sitting, standing, music etc and no sightseeing.

Here's the Westminster Evensong drill: church closes and is locked at 4:30. Queue for Evensong starts. Everyone in line will be interviewed to confirm worship only no sightseeing and that you will stay the whole hour. Supervised entry starts about 4:45 and the doors are locked before 5 so no late entry. Exiting church is also supervised, no stopping.

Non-museum London attractions like St Paul's, Westminster Abbey and the Eye are very expensive. 16 and over is an adult in the U.K. for admission and lodging purposes. I was told that parents can order alcohol for 16+ year old children and did it, but not sure if that was a joke or not. Groupsave ticket Gatwick to London Bridge Station is 25 pounds on a Friday (assuming one child under 16), and if you bought above ground rail tickets London Blackfriars Station (rail not tube, it's over the river) to St Pancras for the Eurostar I believe that you could use these two tickets to qualify for the 2 for 1 offers. Short black cab rides to each station about 6-10 pounds. Buy both rail tickets in advance online and print out at station using the emailed number code to avoid the drama/worry of having the credit card not work in a kiosk. You should be able to print both sets of tickets at Gatwick on arrival. I'm making some reasonable assumptions here but could be wrong. If both children under age 16 family tickets to the large attractions may be cheaper than 2 for 1 offers.

I'd skip oyster cards for this short a stay and maybe buy paper travelcards for your one full day if it saves you money.

I'm looking into Portobello market now, as a different option. It seems more low key, and its proximity to Notting Hill is neat. It would be fun to see. I know it's cliche, but that's one of my favorite rom-coms. I'm downloading the city mapper app as I write this to help us figure out the transport while we are there.

Thanks for all of the recommendations for restaurants. I will be looking into them. I'm also grateful for the info on evensong. It's probably not what we are looking for, even though my weird and wonderful teenage son is a fan of choral music. I've never been to evensong, so I wasn't sure what it entailed. The description helped rule it out for us. My son said he would rather sightsee St. Paul than evensong in either.

I have a question about the 2 for 1. If we are coming in from Gatwick and have rail tickets to St. Pancras, does that even count as a 'return?' I had looked into the 2 for 1 specials earlier and couldn't quite figure out how we would manage rail tickets on our touring days (Saturday and Sunday) without a return ticket to Gatwick. I did, however, find smart save with 20% off a couple of the sites we wante, but 2 for 1 would be better. It looks like those 20% offers go on and off, though.

Again, thanks for the info. Your advice has me looking in directions I hadn't thought of before.

As I posted on another topic, I think for short London stays (not one week stays with one week travelcards where commuting to sites every day works better) it is nicer to be within walking distance of multiple attractions, i.e. not Notting Hill. I'm thinking within a few blocks of the river between the Houses of Parliament and Tower Bridge. This allows you to return to your rooms easily and recharge, and take advantage of the evenings better (and not be stuck with a neighborhood that's just shopping, restaurants, and Madame Tussauds, and not interested / too tired / just not up for another tube commute).

The 2 for 1 is very complex, try this site https://www.londontoolkit.com/whattodo/london_travelcard_2for1_discussion.html

For the 2 for 1, note that normally the Eye is not available for summer months and the Tower is not available July 15-Aug 31. Ages of children will matter in the calculation of the value of jumping through hoops to qualify for these.

Okay let's reevaluate the first night of arrival.

After you've secured your travel cards Upon arrival at Victoria ( or London Bridge), unpacked and freshened up I'm going to suggest you head straight to Parliment Square via the tube. You'll be heading to Westminster Station. You'll need to walk to the Tower Hill station and hope a District or Circle line train to Westminster. 20 minutes.

The area is lovely as sundown begins and the buildings light up. You are London why not see the most iconic part, Big Ben, Parliament and Westminster Abbey the first night?!.

From there you can walk back over Westminster Bridge and snap photos of the Eye or ride it if you feel the need and the wait isn't enormous. As mentioned many eating places close by. on Waterloo road closer to the BFI MAX ( British film institute IMAX) past The Wellington pub and just under the bridge is Fishcotheque where I get fish and ships. If that's a deal breaker then try a pub meal at The Wellington.

OR from Parliament Square walk up Whithall past the Horse Guards and number 10 Downing Street to Trafalgar Square. Maybe try the Cafe in the crypt of St Martin's of the fields.

When you arrive at Victoria or Tower Bridge and have gone to the ticket windows look for the free pocket size tube maps that are usually on the counter. Absolutely the most convenient way to find your way around London via the Underground is referencing those maps.

TKTS in Leicester Square has a website that will give you an idea of what's on sale for today, and even a day or two in advance. You could send just one person to the booth, you don't all have to trek over there,

If there is nothing you want at the TKTS booth, you can always try the box office of the theatre that has the show you're interested in. You may, or may not, be offered a discount on the day.

The food at the cafe at the Tower is quite good. Museum and gallery and similar cafes are much better in the UK, than in the States, in general. There is also a Pret quite near the Tower if you need to grab a sandwich to eat on the go to your next sight. Again, in the UK, the prepackaged sandwiches (which tend to only be available at gas stations in the States and should be avoided at all costs) are quite good.

We have stayed in the St Katherine's Docks area and enjoyed it very much. The Waitrose nearby is an excellent supermarket/grocery store and their prepared foods are very good (handy if you're renting a flat, and have kitchen facilities and hungry teens). The nearby Tesco Metro, in the other direction, is much better than you would think, to look at it.

If you are going to Greenwich on Sunday, I'd look for a Sunday roast there.

I'd take the DLR one way to Greenwich (sit up front) and the boat the other way.

Hope you have a good holiday.

Thanks for all of the help. I've revamped some plans and simplified.

Saturday :
morning bike tour (lunch stop at Covent Garden on the tour)
St. Pauls
Trafalgar square wander
Dinner at St. Martins Cafe in the Crypt
Free time for whatever

Sunday:
Tower 10-2
Late lunch-blackfriar?
Free time choices: camden or portobello market/ piccadilly square or wherever we feel
Ceremony of Keys 9:30

I've decided to keep more time free to see what we feel like doing rather than plan too much. Just being/walking around the city might be what the kids prefer. Thanks for all the advice.