The Places That The North Americans Have Never Heard Of.

James - I think you missed off Windsor, Stratford-on-Avon and Edinburgh off the standard list.
I will add a few:-
- lots of rural areas that match or often beat The Cotswolds whilst being much less crowded - Shropshire, Herefordshire, Powys, Dorset, Wiltshire, Suffolk, Norfolk, Yorkshire etc etc.
- the whole of the Lake District
- the Forest of Bowland and Forest of Dean. Each very different, very quiet and beautiful
- Chatsworth House - the best stately home in the country and beats Highclere Castle hands down
- the cities of Liverpool and Manchester - full of sites of interest

I love this topic! Please, keep the suggestions coming.

Isle of Wight, The New Forest, The Wye Valley, The Jurassic Coast, Scilly Isles and The Channel Islands to mention just a few.

I never see Somerset mentioned yet it’s far more accessible than the Cotswolds. Bruton is a charming small town with a direct rail link to London. Not far away you can find the Newt Gardens, which are admittedly very expensive to visit, but absolutely incredible. There are formal gardens, cider making, a deer park and several attractions including a recreation of a Roman Villa. Huge amounts of money that have been spent on the project and it absolutely shows.

https://thenewtinsomerset.com/[newt Somerset ]1

Durham. Berwick Upon Tweed and Seaham with the stellar statue, Tommy.

Northumberland- which we already have a whole thread on.

I also have a couple of threads running on lesser known parts of Cumbria- Cumbria is a large county, yet all the tourists concentrate on a tiny part of it- the Central Lake District. But even then I am not mentioning places like the Cumbrian Coast at the moment, as there seems to be zero interest.

In Scotland I recently did a whole thread on Dumfries and Galloway. Except Arran there are the Clyde Islands of Bute and Cumbrae which seem to be off the radar.

Everyone goes to Skye and Mull (but on Mull interest in Ulva is rare), with a select few getting to Islay and Jura, but the garden isle of Gigha is never mentioned.
From Mallaig (ferry port for Skye) the Small Isles of Eigg, Muck, Rum/Rhum and Canna never get mentioned. Further offshore there is North and South Uist and Benbecula in the Outer Hebrides.
Wonderful islands- but people who get to Lewis and Harris don't seem to island hop down the Isles to Eriskay, Barra and Vatersay.

How many people who go to Orkney for the neolithic sites get to any of the out islands- easy by inter air service and inter-island ferry?

The lack of interest in much of Wales is currently covered by another discussion thread.

It’s easy to understand how it happens. When I think of visiting a new country it’s always the most well known sights that I’m aware of that draw me there. Then you just assume that because they’re well known they must be the best places, when often they’re just the places that for various reasons have the longest history of tourism.

2nd vote for Northumberland as most know, lol although some locations are more difficult to get to via public transport.

I did a tour of the area specifically because the itinerary included Lindesfarne which just was more than I wanted to figure out!

Additional treats on the tour included Belsay House, castle and quarry gardens, Craster area for the walk to Dunstanburgh Castle along the coast path and Seahouses for a boat trip out to the Farne Islands.

I am in the Peak District right now. It is absolutely lovely, yet all the attention goes to the Yorkshire Dales and North Yorkshire Moors, which I also love. We are staying in Bakewell, which is a delightful town with lots of hiking and walking options right from town. The people are friendly and there are lots of places to eat.

I would certainly not criticize anyone for going to Yorkshire instead of coming here. We went to those places first and loved them. We are very fortunate that we could come back and see more of England.

Back to Northumbria I am always bemused by how, when walking Hadrian's Wall, everyone thinks Hexham and Haltwhistle.

Yet hardly anyone considers Corbridge.

Apart from the Romans and other history Corbridge also has the fantastic The Valley Indian Restaurant in the Railway station buildings. As it is at a station the totally Unique 'A Passage to India' train runs from Newcastle 6 nights a week. You won't find it in any timetable but 1 of the 2 cars of an early evening service train is block booked by the Restaurant. The staff are in Indian costume, snacks and drinks are served on board and Indian Music played, and clients order their meals en route.
Even for those in the other train car it is an experience.
And they now have another restaurant at the old Railway Station at Jesmond, Newcastle, which is in a historic, 1912, train car.

Although I'm based in the USA, I've chosen some destinations for my upcoming trip based on locations from the (British and original) Antiques Roadshow. This includes Waddesdon Manor, Hughenden, and Compton Verney (where a current exhibit of Birds by Audubon is underway and I have 18 smaller-sized prints of the same hanging in my house).

I'm also fortunate that one of my local PBS (public TV) stations focuses only on UK/BBC/Australia shows and two shows newly broadcast here are Celebrity Antiques Road Trip and Landscape Artist of the Year (link included here is for the Wikipedia article about both the Portrait OTY and the Landscape OTY shows, the Landscape series episodes are available in a variety of formats.

In the Celebrity Antiques Road Trip show, the focus is on the celebs going shopping, however each episode includes an informative segment about a local area of interest. One episode included Harewood House, another featured a smaller-scale Sistine Chapel ceiling painted by a local amateur artist in the south of England, and another featured a WWII training exercise -- Operation Tiger -- where a Sherman tank was found buried in the water and the local Brit who brought up the tank and the memorial to him and the American troops who died in the exercise (also in the south of England). If the latter sounds familiar, yes, it was part of a Foyle's War storyline, which is another show from which I hope to draw some other places to visit on a future trip.

I am in the Peak District right now. It is absolutely lovely, yet all the attention goes to the Yorkshire Dales and North Yorkshire Moors, which I also love. We are staying in Bakewell, which is a delightful town with lots of hiking and walking options right from town. The people are friendly and there are lots of places to eat.

Carroll, I absolutely loved the Peak District (although I also loved Yorkshire). And I have it to thank for my addiction to the Bakewell tart! It's definitely on my radar for next year's return to England. I stopped in Ashbourne and loved it there but was also in Bakewell.

One place I found in that area that was so charming and SO far off the beaten path was a tiny village called Tissington (this was a while ago, I admit). I found it by accident when I turned down a little unmarked road and happened upon a collection of incredibly old stone cottages. I parked near the church and graveyard (no town is complete without one!) and took a walk through it. I wound up talking someone in a small shop there and it turned out the village belongs to Robert Fitzherbert, and has been in his family for over 500 years. Each family pays rent to him for their dwelling. The Fitzherbert family still occupied the Hall - I saw one man walking the grounds (don’t know if it was the owner or a caretaker) carrying a brace of pheasants in one hand and a rifle in the other.

I didn't think these were places that nobody had heard of, but maybe I'm wrong as both have less mentions on this Forum than the OP's examples, and I'd never heard of either of his.

Bodiam Castle is the kind of castle that you might have drawn as a child if you were asked to draw one. https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/visit/sussex/bodiam-castle

Lewes is a town about a 30 minute train ride from Gatwick and a perfect place to rest after a long overnight flight. It's got castle and abbey ruins and is perfectly walkable. https://www.visitsoutheastengland.com/places-to-visit/lewes-p196231

The Chilterns and the Thames valley. I loved my stay in Bourne End and visiting Cliveden. Cookham is a lovely village, with a tiny but wonderful Stanley Spencer gallery. I enjoyed my quiet Sunday stroll to Wooburn Green along the burbling Wye, with church bells tolling as I walked by the church. I hope to go back someday and spend more time in the Chilterns. This thread is making me want to drop everything and go back right now!!

How does Crosbost, Isle of Lewis, Outer Hebrides stack up if anyone can attend to that? I'm reading "The Blackhouse" from "The The Lewis Trilogy: The Blackhouse, The Lewis Man and The Chessmen" by Peter May. The description is breathtaking. I've been wondering if it lives up to its description, and does it qualify as being off the beaten path? Perfect timing for this thread for me.

On my last trip to England, I spent a few days hiking in and around the Hadrian's Wall area and it was the highlight of my trip. Visited two nearby Roman forts, Vindolanda and Housesteads, both of which were excellent. I met many British tourists while out and about and also at the Inn that I stayed in, but no other Americans for once.

An outside the box answer to this question might be...London. I don't think most people give London enough time to see much beyond the major sites and museums, but there is so much more. Art lovers should go to The Courtauld, The Wallace Collection, The Dulwich Picture Gallery, etc. Garden lovers should go to Kew. You can go up to Highgate and see the cemetery and Kenwood House. Like Indian food? Then visit Brick Lane. None of these places are necessarily off the radar, but you will certainly encounter more locals than Americans.

Hallmuir Ukranian Chapel, near Lockerbie, Scotland.

Everyone has heard of the Italian Chapel on Orkney, well Hallmuir is the only other surviving POW Chapel in Scotland- but little known.

EDITED 11 JULY after visit.

Locally it has brown tourist board signs. However I can confirm that it is currently locked, although you can see in through the windows, and I now have some images.
It is now in the middle of McCalls bus depot, but I had no luck in finding out what has happened to the Caretaker. Still worth going though.

Great topic!!! Dorset, including Durdle Door and Lulworth, Stourhead, and the Tank Museum (Bovington); Yorkshire: Fountains Abbey; Derbyshire: Hardwick Hall, Suffolk: Sutton Hoo, Flatford Mill (John Constable's Hay Wain painting). Exmoor.. Saxon church and chapel at Deerhurst (near Tewkesbury).

The Fleet Air Arm museum in Yeovilton, Somerset. Loved it as a 10 year old in 1972, and looks like it's still going strong!

I am addicted to the YouTube vlog "Planes, Trains, Everything." It's a done by a guy who lives in Scotland, and a lot of the episodes feature very out of the way places in Scotland and England. He also focuses on budget friendly transportation options. I will confess, however, that no amount of savings could entice me to take the North
Sea ferry trip he did in January!💧🌨🌊

When we visited the UK in 2018, we spent a few days in Wales. We drove around and found some of my ancestral homes. They were mostly around the Lake Vyrnwy area. Lake Vyrnwy is beautiful but there used to be a village there. It was removed before the area was flooded in the late 1800's. I believe the reservoir is for the Liverpool area.

It was fun driving around Wales. We stopped at roadside restaurants that had no tourists. And we got to hear Welsh spoken, which was special for me.

Someday I'll go back here.

https://www.lake-vyrnwy.com/

Well, my home county of Essex doesn't exactly scream tourist attraction, but there are some hidden gems if you travel a little more North East along the Essex/Suffolk boarder. Castle Hedingham, Lavenham, Kersey, (a little hard to find), Dedham, Flatford Mill (Constable Country). Finchingfield, Thaxted and Audley End House. All my American friends have loved traveling around these pretty villages.

https://www.english-heritage.org.uk/visit/places/audley-end-house-and-gardens/
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/visit/suffolk/flatford/flatford-and-constable-country-walk
https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryMagazine/DestinationsUK/Lavenham/

Outer Hebrides are amazing. We were there last year, but it took 5 years to arrange (one year was due to Covid-19). Accomodation is scarce and we wanted to travel without a car. https://www.visitouterhebrides.co.uk/information/product-catch-all/hebridean-hopscotch-holidays-p529041 planned a 12 day trip with bus and ferry from Oban -> Castlebay to Stornoway->Ullapool

This year I visited https://www.edenproject.com/, which is not really unheard of, but which I have not seen mentioned here. I did it on a whim, with only two days preparation, so accomodation was hard to find. But well worth the effort.

Great suggestions so far - keep it coming.

I will add another area that appears to be unknown to foreigners - Exmoor - which is on the north coast of the SW peninsula. The A39 road goes through this area and the first place to call at when coming from the east is DUNSTER. The main town of Minehead is worth a look but it is west of Minehead that you go through wonderful scenery. Detour for 1 mile to the thatched village of SELWORTHY and perhaps also pop into ALLERFORD which has a little humped bridge. LYNMOUTH is well worth a stop.
https://www.visit-exmoor.co.uk for more info.
Dunster > https://www.discoverdunster.info

You can even find the bridge built by Fred Flintstone in Exmoor:>https://www.exmoor-nationalpark.gov.uk/enjoying/tarr-steps

Allan, we love Bodiam Castle and have visited twice – once during a light snowfall. Magical!

Doune Castle near Stirling in Scotland is also lovely – a bit more well known, as it was a filming location for Monty Python's "Holy Grail" and more recently "Outlander" (I think). They told us they welcomed the increase in visitors, as the corresponding increase in revenue has enabled them to restore parts of the castle that really needed it. It still has a Bodiam-like charm of not being too restored.

We really liked the Falkirk Wheel in Scotland, and when exploring the woods behind it, stumbled onto the "John Muir Way" and walked part of it, which was exciting to us, as we have hiked part of the "John Muir Trail" in California's mountains.

It was Tony Robinson's videos which introduced us to the Coastal Path in Cornwall – we loved poking around on the Lizard Peninsula and finding tiny coves with fishing boats, pubs, etc and not a 'touristy' feeling. And his history videos have introduced us to many other places, including out-of-the-way towns on the canals.

Bellringing has taken me to places I wouldn't otherwise have visited, including Birmingham in March and Preston next month (my 19th visit to the UK). Also next month I plan to find the house in Derby where my grandmother was born, and try to find the village in Warwickshire where my husband's ggg...grandfather was born in 1636.

Canal boat rental.

Not so much a place as a way of travelling. The BEST way to see off-the-beaten-path England. Even at 3 mph, there is a village or a pub every hour. Super relaxing way to see the best of England.

I will add another area that appears to be unknown to foreigners - Exmoor - which is on the north coast of the SW peninsula.

James, I have been wanting to go to Exmoor ever since I started reading Agatha Christie mysteries in grade school. Several of her books were set in that area and her home was actually in Devon (which I know is farther south on the peninsula). I'm hoping to get able to explore that whole area next year.

Mardee - ExmoorNational Park is mostly in Devon! There is a bit of the national park in west Somerset but it's mostly in Devon.
Devon county covers both coasts of the SW peninsula east of Cornwall.

Apart from Canal boat rental there are also hotel narrowboats. Some are single narrowboats, some are boat and butty, which typically take about 8 to 10 people.
There is even a broad beam hotel boat with a grand piano, on which recitals are given.

Stealing from another post, Whitby is now on my list. I'm a sucker for literary referenced locations and the other post refers to Whitby as some of Bram Stoker's inspiration for Dracula.

I have been to Lockerbie today on a formal visit obtaining images of the Lockerbie Air Disaster memorials.
I have just been looking on the forum and am very surprised to see almost no mention of the town. The one post I can find has wildly inaccurate information on how to get there which is now unchangeable, being on a locked thread.
Yet anyone driving the M74 to Scotland passes the town.
I will be doing a post on it eventually as there is new information to impart on the memorials. Americans do visit, and in large numbers. I was invited unexpectedly to a talk today on the subject in the Town Hall, and two people from Syracuse were there, like me invited on the day. And I saw other Americans at Dryfesdale Cemetery.
I have been recording war memorials for 13 years, today was by far the most emotionally challenging such visit I have done.

Stealing from another post, Whitby is now on my list. I'm a sucker for literary referenced locations and the other post refers to Whitby as some of Bram Stoker's inspiration for Dracula.

Allan, I loved Whitby! I was there in 1996 and the old town was very quaint with very narrow, winding cobblestone streets. You can walk up the 199 steps to Whitby Abbey, an old monastery built in the 6th century and now in ruins. Caedman, the first English poet, lived here, and, as you have read, the ruins were supposedly the inspiration for Bram Stoker’s “Dracula”. When you get to the top, you can see for miles out to sea. With all the colorful fishing boats lining the harbor, it made for a very picturesque view.

Whitby is where I met an older gentleman at the old cemetery. He came up and started a conversation. His wife of 55 years had just died ten months before, and he seemed very lonely. He had very strong opinions on various subjects, though. Some of the items we covered included royalty, child raising, and celibacy among the clergy (not sure how that one got in!). He wound up giving me a lift back into town, which turned into a rather hair-raising ride as he started talking about his heart condition while he was careening around curves. Definitely an adventurous ride!

You can walk up the 199 steps

I always count the steps and find the number varies from when walking up. It is usually over 199 and the record was 215. Coming down I always make it 199.

St Mary's Church at the top of the steps is well worth visiting too . It is actually older than the abbey and the chancel is Norman. The nave is one of the best examples of a Georgian interior dating from the early years of the C19th with box pews crammed in everywhere, galleries and a three decker pulpit. Look behind the pulpit for the hearing trumpets used by the rector's wife who was deaf.

There is also Fortune's Kippers at the end of a street below the Abbey. They have been smoking kippers here for over 150 years and they are satill using the original smoke house. Just follow your nose to fin d them. They are some of the best kippers I've ever tasted.

James, great topic and will bookmark this. Love getting away from the madding crowd. We were going to spend a couple of nights in Windsor after landing in Heathrow and then head to London for 2 nights. (From there, we go to Bath as a base). In lieu of Windsor, are there any suggestions as to where to stay for a "soft, quiet landing" before heading to London? Perhaps a place of natural beauty with an historic site, interesting old town, or garden to visit? We won't have a rental car. Thanks for any suggestions.

Rutland and South East Linconlshire around the market town of Stamford. Its like the much vaunted Cotswolds without the tourists.

The Yorkshire Wolds are much under rated too and also have a lot of attractive small villages. On the edge of the North York Moors is Hutton in the Hole which is the equal of anywhere in the Cotswolds and also has a very good Folk Museum too. No offence, but we do need to wean people off the Cotswolds!

Great suggestions from everyone. I see that STOURHEAD has been mentioned. I visited Stourhead in late May and it was fantastic because the azaleas and rhododendrons were in flower and the trees were in all their spring glory. Somebody else visited one August and was disappointed - I guess no flowers and it might have been a dull day. I have seen photos of Stourhead taken in late October in the sunshine and again, it looks wonderful. So, sometimes it depends on the weather and season regarding how a place can look.

Anyway, not far from Stourhead is LONGLEAT HOUSE and gardens - which also includes a safari park. This place is about mid way between Bath and Stonehenge and the nearest rail station is Warminster. Looks like it would be difficult to reach without a car. I have not seen it mentioned on these forums so guess it is another place that the Americans have not heard of.
https://www.longleat.co.uk/longleat-house

I missed the reference to holidays on the canals. I have been boating on the canals since 1974 and we have had our own boat since 2003. So I have travelled the majority of the connected network in England and Wales is anyone wants any specific advice.

My paternal ancestors came from Cardiganshire, SW Wales in 1716. We visited that small town in 2017 and loved it. The locals spoke the Cymru language until we arrived and switched to English.

We also visited Chepstow Castle and Tintern Abbey and highly recommend those. Also, there are many more amazing castles in Wales.

I've never been to Longleat, but had always assumed there would be public transport to such a big tourist attraction.

But on looking the question up it's not- there is a bus along the A362 from Warminster to Frome, every one or two hours which has several stops, each of which is a mile or so walk away, but that is it.

Oh, this is such a good thread - I'm finding so many ideas for next year!

It appears that most of you have heard of Cornwall but how many have heard of PEMBROKESHIRE = the south westernmost county in Wales? It has stunning coastlines and the only industrial bit to avoid is around Milford Haven which is a port for oil/gas tankers. Pembroke Dock is also to be avoided but the town of Pembroke has a castle:>
https://www.visitpembrokeshire.com/attraction-listing/pembroke-castle

The main town for tourists is TENBY - is this the most beautiful seaside town in Britain? In north Pembrokeshire, visitors might like St.David’s - which has a cathedral. Tenby is on the railway but with only one train every other hour. For ST. DAVID'S, Haverfordwest is the nearest train station - then bus. For the far north of Pembrokeshire - train to Fishguard - which also has ferries to Ireland - as does Pembroke.

Having a car in this area is obviously preferable as that allows you to reach more places. My top pick on the south coast west of Tenby is Barafundle Bay and the walk by the nearby Bosherston Lakes.

By the way, in north Pembrokeshire is the Preseli Mountains/Hills and it from here than Neolithic people quarried the stones for the inner circle at Stonehenge. Ever since people have been wondering how and why they dragged/floated these stones all the way to Wiltshire? You can see one of the ancient tombs left by these people - but you will need to go down some back roads:>
https://cadw.gov.wales/visit/places-to-visit/pentre-ifan-burial-chamber

https://www.visitwales.com/destinations/west-wales/pembrokeshire
https://www.pembrokeshirecoast.wales/about-the-national-park/
https://www.visitpembrokeshire.com/articles/48-hours-in-tenby

Someone on You Tube has posted a walking tour of TENBY:> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJCCKnLLfOA

PS. A US tourist put ‘Caldy Island’ into the satnav. He drove through Tenby & down a slipway only to get stuck in the sand on the beach. Presumably he intended to drive across the sea? This story is true - just google it.

Whitney is one of my favorite places too. It was 199 steps by my count - I always count the steps too. We stayed on the other side of the harbor — no steps, but a very hilly climb up. The views of the abbey are fabulous, especially at sunrise. It’s worth getting up early for. You can look down at the beach and sea, which is gorgeous. I loved dropping down to the beach after sunrise and walking along the water watching the waves crashing against the rocks. There are no or few people at that hour. It’s fantastic.

I’m sure Carroll means Whitby and not Witney, which is a town in Oxfordshire. Could well also be pleasant (I’ve never been), but a long way from Whitby.

@wasleys & LSF – I had several nice visits to Louth, Lincs – enjoyed the 3x/week markets, the sheep and cattle markets, the old-timey stuff like cheesemongers ... really felt like I was in pre-WWII England at times. Lovely.

But, I did have a start looking at a map placed on my bedside table at the old coaching inn where I was staying – at first glance I thought it said "Louth: capital of the world!" :-) and I thought, that's a bit of an overstatement – it's a nice town and all, but ... haha
upon closer inspection I saw that it said "Louth: Capital of the Wolds & Historical Market Town"

I've been scared off of visiting Whitby b/c I had heard it was becoming too popular owing to the Dracula connection. It sounds like – except perhaps around All Hallow's Eve – it might not be too much of a zoo. I would love to visit, but don't like crowds and commercialization. I suppose it is enough off the beaten track that it's still charming? I've heard they illuminate it – which would be cool to see, but not with a rowdy crowd. (I avoid places like Salem, Massachusetts, around Halloween ... too many wacky people, haha.)

Bran Castle in Romania was wonderful and I'd go back in a heartbeat. Again, a bit off the beaten track. The only rampant 'commercialization' I saw there was some gas/petrol prices written as if dripping with blood :-)

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Yesterday I told you about Pembrokeshire in SW Wales. Today, I am going to tell you about some of the places you could stop off at on the way:> CASTLES & GARDENS OF CENTRAL CARMARTHENSHIRE.

The M4 is the southerly route across south Wales. In Carmarthen shire it becomes the A48 (dual highway) to Carmarthen. Midway between the end of the M4 and Carmarthen is >https://www.visitwales.com/attraction/garden/national-botanic-garden-wales-647925
It is only about 5 minutes off the A48 and well worth visiting in summer. It has the largest single span glasshouse in the world.

If you were to turn R on leaving the NATIONAL BOTANIC GARDEN OF WALES (route B4310), you would soon find yourselves in THE TOWY VALLEY - B4300 runs east - west along the south side of this valley with the A40 on the north side. This valley of lush farmland with dairy cattle contains two ruined castles. DRYSLWYN CASTLE (not much remains) is free - just park up and climb to the top for wonderful views. https://www.visitwales.com/attraction/castle/dryslwyn-castle-cadw-1843262

A bit further east - just west of the town of Llandeilo is DINEFWR CASTLE. Here you just pay to park and wander through meadows and up to the castle ruins. Again, fantastic views over the Towy (Tywi in Welsh) Valley. Near the parking area is NEWTON HOUSE (NT) for which the National Trust charge an additional fee for entry - which I think is worth it.
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/visit/wales/dinefwr/visiting-newton-house-at-dinefwr

CADW is the name of the Welsh Government department responsible for most historic monuments in Wales. However, somebody has written an excellent site about Welsh Castles and I will provide the link as it explains fully about DINEFWR CASTLE:>
https://www.castlewales.com/dinefwr.html

Between Dryslwyn and Dinefwr Castles is ABERGLASNEY GARDENS (though I was not that impressed) >https://aberglasney.org

Not in the Towy Valley but about 4 miles east of Llandeilo is the most amazing of all these castles = CARREG CENNEN. It sits a top a crag with sheer drops on the south side. It is surrounded by amazing countryside. Inside, you can pass through a door way and down a passage on the cliff and into a cave under the castle (torch needed).
https://cadw.gov.wales/visit/places-to-visit/carreg-cennen-castle

Carreg Cennen is on land owned by a farmer who has created tourist facilities near the parking area. He has a large barn where you can buy food. http://www.carregcennencastle.com/

Of the places I have mentioned here today, only Dinefwr Castle and Newton House can be reached by train via Llandeilo station (trains very infrequent) plus a 2 mile walk. The A40 through the Towy Valley has buses and infrequent buses go to the National Botanic Garden. Really you need a car in this area.

BTW, the river Towy enters the sea south of Carmarthen at LLANSTEFFAN which also has a ruined CASTLE. (Don’t go in the sea here - dangerous currents). https://www.llansteffancastle.com
You can see Llansteffan Castle across the estuary from the train if going to Pembrokeshire.

Rick Steves forum Mods:
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Some of you have mentioned Whitby. Did you know that you can rake a scenic bus ride to Whitby from York - which many tourists visit? A present, I believe that the fare is capped at £2 which must be the biggest bargain available in the UK.https://www.transdevbus.co.uk/coastliner/exploringcoastliner

A heritage railway operates between Pickering and Whitby:> https://www.nymr.co.uk

Whitby:> https://www.visitwhitby.com

My wife and took the bus from York to Whitby and back last Saturday. It’s a serious investment in time, 2.5 hours each way but it is spectacular and, until the end of October at least, only £2pp. Or for us English seniors, nothing!

Places That The North Americans Have Never Heard Of

taking that literally I will heave in a few that perhaps fit:

Wyre Piddle

Wisbech

Saffron Walden

Brownsea Island

Minety Lower Moor

Lydiard Tregoze

Kingston Bagpuize

Mousehole

The Merry Maidens Stone Circle

and, in memory of Compo and Clegg - Upperthong, Netherthong and Thongsbridge

Nigel, we got happily lost trying to find the Merry Maidens; but I think we finally did. Good memories of a ramble on a long summer evening. We did find Mên-an-Tol and the Lanyon Quoit. Baffled how we had the places to ourselves in August!

& we love saying "Mousehole" :-)

haven't heard of the rest of your list, but Wisbech sounds like it's straight out of the Nine Tailors :-)
I think I will be ringing tower bells at Landbeach next month.

CARDIFF & FOUR VERY DIFFERENT CASTLES.

OK, I know that you have heard of Cardiff the Capital City of Wales but did you know that 4 castles can be found in & around the city?

https://www.cardiffcastle.com is found in the centre and dates from Roman times. In the middle is a Norman keep (1087) but much of the castle dates from the 1800’s when it was owned by the Marquess of Bute. CARDIFF CASTLE is now under the control of Cardiff Council who unfortunately allow events to take place on the green in the middle.

CAERPHILLY CASTLE is a massive medieval fortress just a 20 minute local train ride north from Cardiff. The town of Caerphilly is a dump in an ex mining area but the castle is everything that you would expect of an 1100’s fortress complete with moat. If you are visiting Caerphilly, you might like to break the journey at Lisvane station and walk for 5 minutes across the car park and into CEFN-ONN-PARK (free). In spring it is very colourful with azaleas, camellias, rhododendrons and bluebells all under the canopy of a temperate rain forest. https://www.outdoorcardiff.com/parks/parc-cefn-onn/

CASTELL COCH stands on a hillside in north Cardiff. If you have a car - it is M4 junction 32 and you could easily visit this castle and Caerphilly Castle in one go. If visiting by bus from Cardiff - you need Stagecoach 132 from Greyfriars Road and alight at Tongwynlais (about 25 minutes out). The walk from the bus stop to castle is about 17 minutes uphill.

ST.FAGANS CASTLE & MUSEUM OF WELSH LIFE is just to the west of the city. The site is vast and needs at least half a day. You have grounds with buildings of significance brought from all over Wales and re-erected. The Castle is really a 1500’s Manor House. You will also find gardens near the castle.
You will also find indoor galleries explaining about life in Wales through the ages - handy if it starts to rain.
Note that if driving in from M4 junction 33 - take A4232 southbound for about 2miles and SLOW DOWN in slip road as turn is sharp to enter Museum. Large vehicles such as coaches should enter and exit via this route as roads in from the east are narrow.

LLANDAFF CATHEDRAL is about 2 miles NW of Cardiff Castle.

If visiting Cardiff, I suggest you visit CARDIFF BAY - which is just over 1 mile south of the city centre.

https://cardiffmuseum.com is a small museum about Cardiff in the centre of the city. THE NATIONAL MUSEUM OF WALES is found just N of the shopping area next to the City Hall.

If visiting Cardiff, note that the city holds major events - especially in the Principality Stadium. This can result in hotels charging massive rates to cash in on all the fans and transport systems are stretched.
Best to avoid such events if of no interest.
https://www.visitcardiff.com

It seems to be that many of you are going from Bath to Conwy by train. This involves a change at Newport - which is only 15 minutes away from Cardiff. You might like to consider visiting Cardiff which has the added benefit of direct trains to Conwy.

PS. If on the M4 near Cardiff, you might like to come off at Junction 28 and visit TREDEGAR HOUSE (NT).
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/visit/wales/tredegar-house/things-to-do-in-tredegar-house

Here is a You Tube video that I found of Cardiff by some visiting Americans.

Laura and geovagriffith both mentioned visiting ancestral locations.

My husband and I have found this to be a very satisfying way to plan a vacation---or at least part of one. It's a wonderful way to bring obscure locations to life. We have visited my husband's ancestral locations in Germany and Ukraine (brought a 2nd cousin, twice removed back to attend high school for a year), and last year he and our 3 adult kids reclaimed Luxembourg citizenship through a gggrandfather. Last summer we returned to the German villages (and Luxembourg) with our kids.

In 2018 we spent 3 weeks primarily visiting my ancestral locations in Cambridgeshire, Essex, and Suffolk. (In addition, my grandmother was born in Walthomstowe, which has an lovely William Morris Gallery https://wmgallery.org.uk/?gmb

The little, off the radar villages were delightful as well as meaningful. (Helpston, Cambridgeshire has ancestral significance for me, but now I see that Trip Advisor names it one of the best places to visit, 2023. I had not heard of it until I learned of my family history) When it's just the my husband and I travelling, we always have a reservation for the last night before flying home as well as a few other key locations along the way. We leave parts of the trip as flexible as possible. This worked particularly well in Suffolk when I made a FB connection with a village historian the morning after our visit to my gggrandfather's village, Stradbroke. We had spent the night in a nearby village, ready to leave the area the next day. We were discouraged that we hadn't made any discoveries in the graveyard nor the records office (in a larger town).

Because we had a couple of days before our scheduled reservation in Cambridgeshire, we ended up returning to the village to meet the woman whose late husband had been the village archivist.. We met with the woman in the graveyard which we'd visited the day before. (The lighting was different and we spotted at least one tombstone with the family name.) It turned out that she had a copy of the petition my ggggrandfather and 29? others had signed requesting $ from the parish so they could immigrate to Canada. The parish was happy to shed the financial burden of these poor families. We learned they'd set sail from Great Yarmouth. After a visit in the woman's home to see the document, we headed out of town to wander through a few villages to eventually find accommodation for the night. We came to a T in the road. One arrow pointed to "Great Yarmouth." My husband and I looked at each other and said, "Let's go!". We pulled into a nearby lot, looked at the map, reset the satnav and off we went. It was amazing to think that the statue of Nelson I saw by sea was probably the last thing my ggggrandparents (and my young gggrandfather) saw as they left.

(Sorry, I get carried away once I get sharing about the serendiptous events on our trips.)

My heritage is mostly British/Irish, so I can insert an ancestral location into almost any trip in the UK. This fall we will travel to Scotland with our daughter and her partner. He has an ancestral connection to Scotland, and we're eager to see some new sights there as well. My husband and I will have about 4 extra days in which we will visit the Dumfries and Galloway area which I've recently discovered was the birthplace of another gggrandmother and her maternal line. Walking the streets and visiting the churches as my ancestor would have done touches my soul in ways that no museum exhibit does.

I'd love to see the Eleanor Crosses. These are the crosses Edward I erected to honor his wife who had died. Her body had to be transported back to London, and he had a cross erected at each of the stopping places. There were originally 12, but today only 3 are still standing.

Today I have a fantastic place for you to visit and it is free. BIG PIT MINE at Blaenavon in SE Wales. Yes, you really go down a now disused coal mine and learn about life as a miner. Tip - if you arrive and find a backlog of people waiting to go down the mine, the reception will give you a time slot. Don't hang around doing nothing but ask the way to the ‘mine experience’ which is about a 5 minute walk from reception. If you do go down the mine first, I suggest you do not miss out on ’the mine experience' audio visual show.

You could combine Big Pit with a visit to the Brecon Beacons National Park just to the north. (The Welsh Government in their madness to rename everything in Welsh have re-named it the Bannau Brycheiniog - and they wonder why so few international tourists visit Wales)? The scenic A40 route between England and Pembrokeshire runs through the BBNP.

If you are heading east on the A40 towards England, be sure to take a look at RAGLAN CASTLE (beware of sharp left turn off A40 eastbound). To proceed west - leave castle drive - turn left and left again in order to loop onto westbound lane of A40. PS. You don’t have to pre book for the castle - just show up and pay at entrance. Lovely views across wonderful countryside from the towers.

"I'd love to see the Eleanor Crosses. These are the crosses Edward I erected to honor his wife who had died. Her body had to be transported back to London, and he had a cross erected at each of the stopping places. There were originally 12, but today only 3 are still standing."

MaryC, I'm glad you are interested in the Eleanor Crosses! I've been posting about this for years, but nobody seemed interested. There are very few of these crosses still standing. Three are still standing; at Geddington, Hardingstone and Waltham Cross. The rest are gone.
To visit all of the locations, it would be best to rent a car.
One would begin at Lincoln Cathedral, where her body rested on the first night after her death. The journey began from there, ending with her burial in Westminster Abbey.

I'm glad to see this thread started, because it can get boring hearing about the same tourist favorites talked about constantly.
What a lot of American tourists need to be told: There's a lot more to England than London and the Cotswolds.

Nigel
I used to live very close to Wyre Piddle! There was a pretty decent foodie pub there. Not too far from the Cotswolds so sometimes Americans made it to WP.

Has anyone come across Coleton Fishacre? Now a National Trust property, it was once the bolt hole/weekend retreat of the Doyly-Carte family (the ones that founded the light opera company). It’s a large house with even larger gardens perched on the Devon coast. The energetic can walk there along the cliff tops from Dartmouth, having taken the lower ferry to Kingswear.

In the same area of the world are the ruins of Berry Pomeroy, a good old walk from Totnes (we caught the ferry from Dartmouth). We discovered these places (they weren’t actually lost!) while staying at a friends’ place near Dartmouth. Dartmouth has a place in its large harbour (Bayard’s Cove) where the Mayflower docked prior to sailing to Plymouth and thence onward to the ‘New World’ with the Pilgrim Fathers. It left with the ill fated Speedwell, a leaky vessel which ultimately turned back twice to Plymouth, and never made it across the Atlantic.

I’m never sure of what Americans will not have heard of in my locale because familiarity breeds a certain amount of contempt I guess, but how many know of Howarth, home of the Bronte Sisters? Or if that’s greeted with howls of derision, how about Middleham, childhood home of ‘this glorious sun of York’, Richard lll? What about Shibden Hall, now much more well known as the home of Ann ‘Gentleman Jack’ Lister?

Ian

Yes, I have been to COLETON FISHACRE which is near Kingswear in south Devon. This is a lovely part of England known as THE SOUTH HAMS.

DARTMOUTH & lovely SALCOMBE are both well worth visiting. The coast road via Torcross has a memorial to those who lost their lives in the surprise German attack during the war.

TOTNES has some interesting buildings and is on the main line to Plymouth and Cornwall. DARTMOOR is just to the north.

PS. Avoid Torquay, Paignton & Brixham.

Americans - be sure to read this:> https://exercisetigermemorial.co.uk
https://www.tracesofwar.com/sights/7827/Operation-Tiger-Memorial-en-Sherman-DD-Tank.htm

This is turning to quite a lot of information. Anyone interested might like to click FILE and SAVE AS PDF to your computer for future reference - but keep an eye out for more updates. Hopefully it will get visitors to Britain to get out and explore away from the obvious hot spots.

We love bookstores and my husband loves old maps. On a 2014 visit to the UK, we all enjoyed spending a few hours in Hay-on-Wye, which is known for its 20+ bookstores, at least one of which also stocked old maps. And sheep milk ice cream at Shepherds was delicious!

I'd love to see the Eleanor Crosses

I'd suggest that Geddington in Northamptonshire is by far the best preserved and easiest to visit closely and peacefully, being as it is in a very very quiet village in the middle of the road between and across the road from both a very quiet (most of the time) pub and the church, next to a very narrow ancient stone bridge and ford.

There is a bus which stops on the road passing by 5 times northbound and 3 times southbound to and from Kettering which has a busy train station. The bus journey is only 11 minutes. The out and back times are best around lunchtime with a one hour stay in the village. I'd suggest a taxi from Kettering station. Or a hire car and include the beautiful town of Stamford which is just down the road.

The Northampton (Hardingstone) Cross is on the side of a very busy road, and was falling apart for many years while the different levels of government argued who responsible for its upkeep, but has just recently had some work done. It is therefore much less original because of all the pollution from the road and neglect.

Coleton Fishacre

very nice...

not far away from the really nice Greenway, the home of Agatha Christie - a really nice place (National Trust) and especially if a fan of Agatha Christie novels.

Don't forget to change your money when you visit Totnes.

Nigel -

I forgot Greenway! It wasn’t quite what I expected (I’m not really sure WHAT I expected….) but it was excellent none the less.

Had a top notch cream tea at Dittisham, but not the same day as our Greenway visit - wrong side of river! - before catching the tiny ferry back to Dartmouth as I recall!

Ian

Oh, this is one of the best threads on England in a long time!!! Yes, Coleton Fishacre is a most enjoyable place, both the home and the gardens. The Art Deco interior reminds me...have you all visited Eltham Palace outside London? Combination Tudor royal palace and Art Deco home of the Courtaulds. I, too, liked Greenway, Agatha Christie's home in Devon. I read that several days ago a large tree fell blocking the narrow approach lane, and all the visitors had to wait several hours before the road was cleared.

OK, here's one no one has mentioned yet: Kilpeck Church in Herefordshire. Fantastic stone carvings.
https://kilpeckchurch.org.uk/

I, too, liked Greenway, Agatha Christie's home in Devon. I read that several days ago a large tree fell blocking the narrow approach lane, and all the visitors had to wait several hours before the road was cleared.

Sounds like the plot of a Poirot. What nefarious acts will somebody get up to with a captive audience and a stormy night with all the escape routes blocked?? Oh MY.

Appledore is a lovely town on the north coast of Devon, with cobbled streets by the seaside and views of the barren shoals where the river Torridge, Taw and the Bristol channel collide. Nearby are the coastal towns of Instow and Westward Ho! but all along the coastline of north Devon and into north Cornwall there are places of this sort. Newquay in Cornwall has a great beach as well.

LULWORTH COVE & DURDLE DOR is a spectacular section of the Dorset Coast. (Click the link and the map will show where it is).

A few miles away - on the SE side of Dorchester is THOMAS HARDY’S COTTAGE (NT).

Those interested in architecture would be interested in POUNDBURY - a new suburb of Dorchester.

I drove up a valley a few miles north of Dorchester and pulled into a lay-by and found loads of excited woman.
THE CERNE ABBAS GIANT.

Further up the valley from Cerne Abbas is MINTERN GARDENS - which were wonderful when I visited first week of June.

From Mintern, the next town north is SHERBORNE and is well worth a look. SHERBORNE CASTLE is just south of the town.
https://www.visit-dorset.com/explore/areas-to-visit/sherborne/

ABBOTSBURY sub-tropical GARDENS are also well worth a visit if in Dorset.

or Barnard Castle if you need an eye test

you know - this thread is a mine of wonderful places and names - I just thought that that would be a fabulous source for the Alphabet Game too (shameless plug) https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/general-europe/traveling-through-the-alphabet-part-2

Also in Wales, everyone on this forum seems to go to Conwy, but very few people seem to go round the corner to visit and ride the Cable Car up the Great Orme headland. These are the direct relations to the San Francisco Cable Car- the only surviving one of 44 cable cars which used to run in the United States (and the only surviving one in the UK)- see this you tube video about them-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkaZ94cKxVc&t=0s

The tramway website- https://greatormetramway.co.uk/

And more about the Country Park at the top of the Great Orme- https://www.visitwales.com/attraction/country-park/great-orme-country-park-701629

More about the Bronze Age Copper Mines on the Great Orme- https://www.greatormemines.info/

Llandudno itself is a former grand Victorian Seaside Resort complete with a pleasure pier, which is still very popular with Brits at least.

Dundee, just to see Robert Falcon Scott's RRS Discovery.

The North Pennies,I will cheat a little by starting at the Tan Hill Pub
Killhope Wheel is a great museum and the waterfalls if Teesdale.
Alston ,englands highest town.
The wideranging view from Hartside Cross summit.
Never made it to Blanchard and it's famously spooky inn yet...

Kelmscot Manor ( William Morris home), Sudeley Castle, Crystal Palace Dinosaurs, Farnham Sculpture Park, Stratfield Saye House, Wigan ( great museum there), Torquay, Lyme Regis, West Bay ( think Broadchurch ) and Peterborough.

The wideranging view from Hartside Cross summit.

It's the Hartside Pass (not Cross), between Alston and Penrith. One of the first routes to close in snow. A wonderful road to travel.

There used to be a Biker's Cafe up there, which burnt down in 2018. It is hoped to re-open a temporary facility up there in 2024.

By Blanchard I am wondering if the Lord Crewe Arms at Blanchland (Northumberland) was meant- I have never heard of a Blanchard.

Aye ,you are right on both scores...
Spent many a day in the old cafe..a tragic loss.
Stuart Maconie in " Of Pies and Prejudice" his excellent northern england book sings its praises.

I would second the CONSTABLE WALK near Dedham. Just lovely countryside which looks just like his famous paintings. A stream with swans. I really enjoyed this country stroll.