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London Connection going out of business

I got an email this morning announcing that London Connections has filed an Article of Dissolution due to the Covid crisis. I had put down a significant deposit for an apartment for end of September. I guess I'll be on the phone this morning with my cc company to figure out next steps. I'll report back in case my info is helpful to anyone else.

Posted by
9776 posts

Me too, Allan. Very sad for them and for us as we have stayed with LC many times. I will wait for whatever refund Thomas can send out in May. I expect he will handle this in an honorable and legal manner.

Posted by
1862 posts

Laurel, I've only used London Connection once and thought the service was outstanding, but I've got nothing else to base the company's integrity on, so I hope you're right. I tried to call my bank this morning regarding the deposit paid on my credit card but the lines are jammed and so I'm not hopeful of finding any information that way anytime soon. I did investigate my cc insurance and learned I'm not covered for loss of deposit. Interesting though, if I had been in London when this happened and unable to get into the apartment, then my trip interruption insurance would kick in and I'd be fully covered. So I'm not covered for the $1500 loss, but I would have been covered for the $3000 loss plus expenses.

Posted by
85 posts

Allan, you may be able to put the charge in dispute by logging in to your credit card account on the Web or in the issuer's mobile app. I can do this with Citi here in the US, for example, though not with my credit unions. Card issuers in Canada tend to have less sophisticated online offerings, but it's worth checking in case it lets you move faster and avoid waiting on hold for ages. Either way, good luck!

Posted by
18 posts

Hi Allan,

Right there with you, in the same boat.....we also put down a significant deposit with London Connection for a late-July trip. Was thinking about cancelling soon anyway, but now of course we're worried we're out of luck on receiving any return of our deposit.

Any luck with your credit card company?

Thanks!

Posted by
1862 posts

Kris, I haven't been able to get through on the phone for the last 2 days. I figure I'll just wait until end of month when London Connection has promised refunds if possible. Thankfully it's a dissolution instead of a bankruptcy so it will be faster. I'm no expert but I was reading that companies often choose to dissolve at a point when they anticipate being able to pay creditors in full. So I choose to remain optimistic.

Posted by
388 posts

We also have a deposit on an August stay with LC. I was so sad to hear the news of their dissolution. I knew we weren't going on this vacation (was waiting to cancel until later), but figured we would just postpone all the reservations until a time when it's safe to travel again. But having LC go out of business is a hard reminder that things won't all be the same in the future -- many, many companies will be gone and travel will be different with maybe fewer opportunities available.

In any case, I am going to wait until the end of the month and see if I receive some or all of our deposit. Once I have that, I can make a decision to follow up with my credit card company or travel insurance (if dissolution is even covered; I haven't checked yet).

Posted by
18 posts

Thanks for your replies, Allan & DebVT!

Tried calling my CC company and couldn't get past the automated system to speak with a person. So I'll join you in hoping that we may get something back in May.....fingers crossed!

PS---Our travel insurance policy does not cover financial insolvency :(

Posted by
164 posts

@ Allan

It seems that the owners of this business are domicile in North America. Likely they have filed to protect their assets. You are all now probably classified as creditors along with the suppliers of goods and services in UK and the place of company registration. You need to seek legal advice about this and your relationship with your credit card provider. Legislation setting out rights and obligations are different to mine. This is not advice, but I suspect your c/c provider is unlikely to refund monies.

My QC friend suggests that the company is probably a shell company that may be traced to a tax haven like the Caymans. Could be looking to cash in on the USA bailout legislation.

On a positive note your federal government under Trudeau, is doing a competent job so far. My personal view is that both our countries because of our similar political and legal systems and largely mining based export economy, will survive and recover steadily.

Regards
Ron

Posted by
1862 posts

An Update. After days of calling my bank and being on hold for hours on end I finally got through to RBC's Mastercard Disputes Centre. They've reversed the charges, but warned me that due to volume I may not see it back on my credit card for a few weeks. In the meantime, London Connection has 10 weeks to dispute it.

Some advice, Don't delete anything and also document a call or send an email to London Connection to show a path that you tried to make contact and come to a resolution. I was asked to send a copy of the email I had received from London Connection and they asked me questions about the confirmations I received when I booked, and also dates and how I tried to contact London Connection after receiving the message. I'm also a Canadian with Canadian banking and credit cards and so I have no idea if the laws are any different up here as compared to the US when it comes to making a claim like this.

Posted by
557 posts

So disappointed for them and all of us who stay with them. We used them to book a lovely apartment in Mayfair last summer that they had recently acquired. I couldn't decide between two apartments/neighborhoods and the owner himself spoke with me to help me decide. I hope they see better days in the future.

Posted by
1132 posts

Just a shout out to Ron in Hobart -- Your marvelous town is one of our favorite places, no, maybe our favorite small town, of all of those we've visited worldwide. We hope to get back there again someday.

Regards,

George

Posted by
1862 posts

CaliMom; our apartment was also going to be in Mayfair. What did you think of the area in terms of ease of access to the Tube, restaurant choices in the evening and just general wandering about in the evening?

Hello,

We’ve also booked an apartment for the entire month of July owned by London Connection through the VRBO/Homeaway website. I did purchase trip cancellation insurance but the rules are iffy. If it wasn’t for this forum I would never have known the status of this company, my reservation or my money. Thank you all so much! I have not been contacted by anyone at London Connection and cannot reach any of the reps I was working with. I did send a WhatsApp that has been delivered and read but she hasn’t responded. We’re about to contact VRBO and our CC company to resolve this on our own.

I really appreciate everyone who posted on here. Thank you.

Posted by
164 posts

@ George Sat 11.30am

A pleasant surprise to wake up and receive your shoutout. Shout out back to you, George. A bloody long way to shout!

Thank you for your nice words.

Hobart is doing all right so far. Indications from national government is that Australia’s boarders are likely to be closed till well into next year. So, I am staying here, NZ may open for us.

I hope you can get back. Any time you come back it would be my pleasure to advise on sites etc and buy you a couple of beers. Offer extends to anyone on this forum.

Many thanks. Ron

Posted by
1862 posts

We’ve also booked an apartment for the entire month of July owned by
London Connection through the VRBO/Homeaway website. If it wasn’t for
this forum I would never have known the status of this company, my
reservation or my money.

Lisa, that's worrying if we can't trust companies like VRBO or AirBnB to make contact and advise. Please keep us informed how it goes.

I booked directly with London Connection and received an email about the dissolution, how did everybody else book that received an email?

Posted by
388 posts

I booked directly with LC and received an email. Still waiting on a refund; the email said a check would be cut by May 1 if I’m getting one, so a couple weeks to go. Fingers crossed.

Posted by
6 posts

Hello all- just wanted to chime in with my me too story. I booked a flat in Mayfair with London Connection last summer. My husband and I reserved for end of June 2020 for one week. I have never been to England or out of the country, I have been planning this trip for over a year! I had gotten an email from London Connection in early March touting their cancel for any reason free trip insurance for new reservations. I should've seen the writing on the wall at this point. I called them to feel them out and ask how everything was going. I asked what the penalties were for cancelling now- money back minus one night. We were due to pay the remainder of our balance by April 30(850.00). I told them I'd make a decision in about a month, but then their articles of dissolution email came in on April 2. What a punch to the gut that was. Out of all the scenarios I'd imagined, I hadn't prepared for that one. I guess it's just a waiting game now. I did try emailing them several days ago for a status update but no response. My husband said it's too late to dispute with our credit card company. I've never had to do this before, so I don't know. Good luck to all of us!

Shelley

Posted by
1862 posts

My husband said it's too late to dispute with our credit card company.

Did he call and ask or just assume the fine print? The fine print on my credit card said I couldn't dispute after 45 days from purchase, but when I called I was told that the 45 day limit wouldn't apply to circumstances like this.

Posted by
6 posts

Allan- sorry can't figure out how to reply to your previous post. We haven't tried calling the credit card company yet because we were waiting on possible refund from London Connection. I was under the impression we couldn't contact them until May 1st? I didn't know there was a limited time frame for disputing a charge, we booked the flat in August 2019. What a nightmare this is! Next up is canceling our airfare from United. Our trip was scheduled June 21- July 4. We will try again for next summer.

Shelley

Posted by
3 posts

At least you have got an email.
I am the owner of one of the properties being rented by London Connection in London (Mayfair) .
We were not even notified . The payments simply stopped and any requests for overdue payments (Feb and March) will remain unhonoured (as any claim for damages or notice periods).
I hope LC will behave better with you, as clients - if there is any consistency in behaviour, I would not expect much...

All,

I did receive an email from VRBO this weekend when I attempted to access the property I rented online. The email stated the property is no longer available and if I’m unable to resolve the issue with LC then I can contact VRBO. We’ve paid $5880 so far and are calling VRBO today because all attempts to reach Tori Tilley, our LC contact in Ogden, Utah, have gone unanswered. I’ve also sent an email to their main address. This is a horrible way to treat a customer who has already paid you over $5000. If anyone can share how I can get in touch with this company I’d really appreciate it!

MSClonda: I thought LC was the sole owner of all properties they advertised?

Fingers crossed for all of us!

Lisa

Posted by
1862 posts

MSClonda: I thought LC was the sole owner of all properties they
advertised?

That was my assumption too. MSClonda, I had booked a property in Mayfair for September through LC, which property is yours and do you offer it through any other platforms?

Posted by
759 posts

The Company website is gone. They could have left it up with informational notices, they chose not to. Those who reacted instantly with their credit card company may have gotten some relief. Time is not your friend here. Do not worry about deadlines- contact your cc company immediately.

I hate to be blunt, but stop wishful thinking. There may be a bankruptcy filing but if so the dollars will be short and the list of creditors long. Or they can just shutter the LLC and it is simply gone in thin air.

To the extent they own properties in London, I would suspect they were heavily mortgaged. No income, no mortgage payments, out of business quickly happens.

Posted by
3 posts

I know other 4 property owners renting out to LC. I am pretty sure that LC does not own any property or any substance in London (otherwise I would have claimed against it).

Posted by
1647 posts

It's really not safe to post your email here. Instead, ask interested people to send you a private message.

@onefastbob

Exactly! Why did they shut down their website? They could have left it up like many reputable companies! “We’re sorry for the inconvenience”, “Due to the global pandemic”, “This is what we can offer”, “Would you like to be accommodated at a later date”,
“Here’s what’s provided”...but No!, nothing. Not to mention their PUBLICIZED, ONLINE statement that they OWN all properties offered on their website. How disappointing. Again, $5000+ paid to them so far, for the entire month of July at a property they listed as owned by them: 50 Maddox Street, Mayfair, London, England. I’m shocked that London Connection, Thomas Moore, Tori Tilley can dismiss a customer who has paid this amount of money. No contact still. Does anyone on this site have any way I can contact this company?
Flat 2-58 Maddox Street, Mayfair London

Thank you,
Lisa

Posted by
1647 posts

If they publicized that they owned all their properties and they did not, I think I'm happy they're out of business. But I feel very sorry for those who are caught up in this.

Posted by
2 posts

I never received an email and learned about the dissolution on their Facebook page, which no longer exists. My friends and I booked directly with LC for 2 weeks in Egerton Gardens in mid-June. I emailed LC on March 19 asking to cancel. On 3/20, Tom replied that the reservation was cancelled and he’d refund the deposit less one night. I waited several days and the money was not credited back to me. I emailed again, he said he’d look into it by Friday of that week if the credit did had not gone through. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, I waited until after the weekend. I called and texted and didn’t hear back. I reached out to my bank and they gave me provisional full credit even though the deposit was placed last year. They are going after LC for payment. From what I’m reading, that’s not going to happen.

Irony of ironies, Tom Moore lll has an Instagram account. He just posted that he and his wife spent a month in Spain/Portugal and 5 weeks in London before flying home to Utah. Today they went for Covid testing just to be sure. They are having a good time with everyone’s money.

I, too, was under the impression that they owned the properties in London. They apparently were the letting agents for property owners who are also being cheated. Such a sad and unfair situation for all .

Posted by
18 posts

I've also initiated a dispute/chargeback through my credit card provider, which the CC company is researching.

If you receive a refund (according to original email from London Connection, checks will be mailed May 1), I'd be interested to hear if people are getting back what they're owed, or just a small portion of it. Should be interesting to see how this shakes out.

Several London Connection customers had been sharing info on the LC Facebook page, which has now been taken down, so it seems like this is a good place to see what's happening with customers' refunds once the numbers are settled.

Posted by
1862 posts

I've been going through all paperwork for both times I used London Connection and I can't find any evidence that I actually gave them my address at any time. Does anybody remember giving them an address? It makes me suspicious of the cheque will be in the mail statement.

Posted by
759 posts

Has anyone been in touch with Utah authorities? If not, why not? It may be a simple business failure or it may be something more. I’m not passing any judgment here. But with avenues of contact disappearing I guess I’m a little more unforgiving. And I do not have thousands of dollars in this game.

If interested:
London Connection LC
2342 Washington Blvd Ogden UT 84401-1412 (801) 393-9120
Corporation; incorporated: 1/28/2002

Mr. Thomas . Moore Sr., President/Owner
Fax
(801) 393-3024
Phone - other
(020) 738-8533

Alternative web address: http://www.lcpm.net appears to be an inoperative link to London Connection’s former web page

Posted by
164 posts

@Allan

Perhaps you could try this site

https://secure.utah.gov/bes/index.html

Then type in London connection. Should give company details. Shows no lodgements for dissolution and company is shown as still active. Hope it works for you.

Maybe you can find a good-hearted USA domicile legal person who may be prepared to conduct initial inquires pro bono. Someone in Utah on this forum may know how to help. I think I have seen on this forum, profiles indicating lawyer status in other states.

I do not know about class action in Utah. You may have to live in the state.

I suspect the laws and jurisdictional limitations have been drafted and enacted to protect the wealthy.

Sorry I cannot help you from here, not my jurisdiction. May be able to look at financial reports if you can lay your hands on them. Accounting is a universal language thanks to de Medici’s.

Justice can be a long, winding, and frustrating road. Regards Ron

Posted by
1862 posts

I’m just having an issue getting my mind around the idea of giving
someone thousands of dollars and a detailed record of the transaction
doesn’t exist.

There are detailed transactions, emails and receipts, but nothing that I have that shows I gave my home address. I may have online when I booked the place, but I don't recall. This isn't my first time using London Connection. I chose them again because because of the quality of service in the past. I did check my credit card this morning to see if MasterCard had credited my account yet, but nothing yet, they did say that due to volume of claims it could take awhile.

Posted by
18889 posts

I have never used an apartment-rental agency, but I think every time I make an online credit-card payment I have to either provide my home address or verify one I previously provided when I initially set up the account. I imagine most companies do retain the address (not necessarily the credit card number) in their records, but I do not know that for a fact.

Posted by
18 posts

Here's why many of us thought LC owned the properties we were renting: (From an archived copy of their website)

We Offer Our Own Properties
All of our properties are in our own company portfolio. We own, lease, maintain, decorate, and control the upkeep of all the flats. We are not a middle-man company between owners and guests. When you talk to LONDON CONNECTION, you are talking with the owners directly. THE BUCK STOPS HERE. We are not a company that simply provides advertisement for other people’s flats. We know the standard and quality of our properties because they are ours. Our properties are rented full time and are not someones primary residence. LONDON CONNECTION properties are in our rental pool fifty-two weeks a year. You will not be renting a vacation property where you have to confront an owner’s clothes, tooth brush, and towels/linens. The flats have been prepared for our visitors by a very skillful London team.

So, I went to HM Land Registry website, and downloaded the property title info for the flat we were supposed to rent this summer.

Sure enough, the owners are not Thomas Moore Sr or Jr. Owned by a couple based in UK & Spain. So, I'm guessing the couple who owns the flat was indeed renting it to London Connection as was mentioned a few days ago.

Posted by
2 posts

We were all snowed by these people. I looked up the US address in Ogden UT and it is the Missionary Store. They sell clothing and accessories to the Mormon community.

I remember reading an old review of the company and it was mentioned that they were previously known by another company name before becoming London Connection. There were mixed reviews as there are for any business, but I felt confident enough to book with them. I hope you all get some satisfaction for all the cancellations; Chase Bank worked with me and gave me back my full deposit.
I paid that deposit last year and explained the whole situation to the bank. I’m so appreciative of their consideration. Best wishes!

Posted by
24 posts

This may be a link to the old review where London Connection was known by another name

https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g57090-i2196-k1194319-Beware_of_London_Connection_aka_Connections_Management-Ogden_Utah.html
Cortez35 says: I am writing to warn other travelers and tourists about a company in Ogden Utah called the London Connection, a.d.b.a. the Connections Management Group, LLC .

I also am shocked! I have rented from them 7 times and I was renting again this July. I also thought they owned the apartment, especially with the furnishings that were in them. The group in London who met you appeared to be sincere and David Norman whom you could pay to pick you from or take you to the airport was certainly very nice.
The WhatsApp number belongs to Cristina who is/was their London Manager.
BTW I looked at my previous invoices and my home address is listed so if we are getting any money back, they do have our home addresses.
Judith

Posted by
1862 posts

BTW I looked at my previous invoices and my home address is listed so
if we are getting any money back, they do have our home addresses.

With a little more digging, I found a contract with my home address as well. I've left it in my bank's hands now, so we'll see how that goes. The original email regarding the dissolution said they'd start mailing out refunds by Friday this week so I guess we all hope.

Posted by
18 posts

An interesting tidbit here from the State of Utah, Division of Corporations & Commercial Code.

Searched for London Connection in their database, and it was listed as an "Active" business.
I emailed them Thursday 4/23, to find out if London Connection had actually filed the Articles of Dissolution on April 1, 2020 as stated in their email to clients dated April 2.

(From the original email from Thomas Moore:
Due to the recent Corona Virus, London Connection/Connections Management Group *was forced to file Articles of Dissolution, on the 1st of April 2020, in the state of Utah.***)

The reply from State of Utah ,Division of Corporations:

corpucc@utah.gov>
Thu 4/23/2020 9:40 AM

Good morning,
London Connection Limited Company
entity # 2044349-0160
Has not filed a Dissolution or a Termination with our office unless it was filed after 4/21/2020 and we have not entered it yet.

So, as of last week, no Articles of Dissolution have been filed.

I will email them again this week to see if there's any update, but when I just checked the database now, as of Monday 4/27 at noon, the company is still listed as "Active".

Posted by
938 posts

The more I read of this thread the more disturbing it is.

We stayed at the Egerton Gardens apt. back in 2017 and while the apt. was nice, the furniture was like sitting on bricks. I was complimentary in my review of the apt. although did critique the uncomfortable furnishings in the living room and the slumping mattresses in the twin bedroom. Because I was critical of some aspects my review was never placed on their website for Egerton 2-34. When I perused other apts. I noticed a big gap of time had elapsed between reviews in a few apt's and was only able to surmise from looking at full future bookings that they were holding back on any negative reviews. That did it for me right there as far as any future rental from them was concerned.

After seeing they were going out of business I noticed their web page was taken down fairly quickly and that was a shame because they had a fairly nice blog going. I guess they didn't think about their facebook page for a week or two though because it remained active, but only to the extent of reviews from customers who felt they were cheated as they had both deposits and final payments made right up to the last moment as LC was closing up business. On fb they had told at least one of those people they could not afford to refund people's monies but were promising everyone future bookings at no further charge or that they would allow them to cancel but would withhold some monies as penalty for canceling and would refund the rest.

I sincerely hope that you and the others are lucky in getting your money back but I wouldn't wait on them to be forthcoming. I would be as proactive in getting it as possible. And yes, they have your address as you gave it when booking.

Much luck and let us know how it turns out. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Posted by
1 posts

Is there a way I can get a copy of the email from anyone? I did not receive an email. We do however have a reservation with LC for May 7-12, 2020. I have tried emailing Tom, Tori, Kim - all of them. I get no response. I have called the three phone numbers I have and get no answer. Only by doing a Google search did I find this information. My CC company says that I have to have a copy of a letter or email showing where they have stated they are going out of business in order to start the refund process. I appreciate if you can forward. If you can let me know and I will get you my email address. Thanks!

If someone could please post an email address to get in contact with this company I would also appreciate it. Seems strange that some are receiving emails saying a refund is coming because they’ve filed for dissolution, some are receiving nothing, their Facebook page said no refunds because they can’t afford it and now they’ve disappeared. I’m exhausted. I’ve emailed Tori, tried calling her tried all the numbers I could find but no answer still.

Thank you,

Lisa

Posted by
2626 posts

Very sorry to hear about all of your bad experiences trying to get money back from this company.
They listed some great looking properties, as many of you know.
Too bad the coronavirus and the associated panic has driven many businesses into closure.

Posted by
24 posts

We too are in the position of trying to recover the deposit for a flat rental, and until a week ago were expecting a prompt and satisfactory outcome. We are astounded at these reports. We have been renting lovely flats from London Connection for almost 15 years now, with no complaints, and always found both Tom Moore Jr. and all the staff a pleasure to deal with. A few years ago when the Iceland volcano eruption prevented us from traveling to the UK, although under no legal or contractual obligation to do so, Tom cheerfully gave us full credit for our paid-up rental against a future trip (which we used a few months later).

Unfortunately, we too have been victimized. On March 30, when we cancelled our May trip, Tom confirmed by email that "a refund, less the 1 night penalty, will be issued." This was the day before the emails announcing "dissolution" (which we did not receive).

Posted by
18 posts

@purplelivin
Just sent you a private message with a copy of the "Dissolution" email. If you'd rather have that email message forwarded to your personal email, send me a private message with your email address and I'll get it to you in the next day or two.

For Lisa.....Here's the company's most recent email address: info@londonconnection.com

Posted by
18 posts

Since some of you never received the email on April 2, here it is.....

Notice of Dissolution - London Connection / Connections Management Group

Thomas Moore - London Connection Info@LondonConnection.com
Thu 4/2/2020 12:59 AM

London Connection / Connections Management Group - Notice of Dissolution

Due to the recent Corona Virus, London Connection/Connections Management Group was forced to file Articles of Dissolution, on the 1st of April 2020, in the state of Utah. I have been appointed manager to liquidate business affairs.

We do not have final financial numbers yet. Preliminary information shows that the company liquidity will be shared between London lease liabilities and clients with upcoming reservations.

Final numbers will be settled by 30 April 2020. If a refund is available to you, a check will be mailed by the 1st of May.

Feel free to send any questions to info@londonconnection.com, but know that there will likely not be answers at this time.

Sincerely,

Thomas Moore

Posted by
1009 posts

Just a thought, but you might want to go out on social media and complain. Not sure if LC have a Twitter or FB page but I had problems with some businesses that never got resolved until I posted my experiences/complaints on Twitter and Facebook. It was amazing how quick the response was once that happened. As they say, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Just a thought.

Posted by
759 posts

Thank you Heather- but just know that LC had a web site, they had a Facebook page. They have shuttered all of those. They are not responding to any attempt to communicate with them. At this point they can careless about negative social media. Those directly impacted have either filed with their cc companies or have (or need to ASAP) contacted the consumer fraud division of the Utah Attorney General.

Posted by
7474 posts

Reading the email Kris posted ( the 'notice' from T Moore) all i see is smoke and mirrors and the holes from a slice of Swiss cheese.
To me it looks like a ploy to gain time to loot the business of any assets and leave everyone else holding an empty bag.

Point 1-- filed for dissolution and got appointed to be the one in charge all at one time. mighty speedy efficient court system in Utah

Point 2- expects to have all the 'numbers' worked out in 30 days ?

Point 3- admits they leased ( not owned) the properties

At this point I suspect the only satisfaction any customer may get will be if the state prosecutes him for fraud and deprives him of his ill gotten profits

Posted by
24 posts

Thanks Onefastbob for suggesting the consumer fraud agency. I just did this as I am getting NO acknowledgement or resolution from Chase, my credit card company....

Posted by
1290 posts

How about calling the state District Attorney’s Office and file a complaint and with the BBB as well. I wonder if they might be trying to hold out and come back with another name in the future.

Posted by
1009 posts

I'm not a lawyer but I would email or call the Utah AG office and explain your situation.Legally, a contract was entered into and money was put down. If unable to fulfill the contract, renters should be entitled to something. It must say in the contract that you received before money was sent. When I read that they've told people they sent in articles of dissolution and Utah has no record of it, my first thought is they are stall for time and trying to spend or squirrel away the money received somewhere it can't be retrieved. Sorry but it sounds like the owners panicked and took the money to pay their bills and are trying to remove any trace of the company.

Your best bet is with your insurance company and to alert the Utah government about them.

Posted by
24 posts

Re the owned-vs-leased issue: In light of the company's recent actions, I take any of their representations as suspect. But in fairness I'd point out that British real estate law and practice is very different from that in the US. Many properties are owned by families or entities that lease them for terms as long as 99 years. The long-term lessee may himself (or itself) sub-let the property to yet another person or entity, sometimes also for a very long term with the right to sub-let. The actual occupant of a property may be several steps removed from the actual "fee simple" owner (to use a legal phrase). Long-term lessees often or even usually have the right to make substantial changes to the premises that would be unheard of in the US. For practical purposes, they are the "owner."

In other words, if London Connection were a "lessee" under such a long-term lease (say 10 or 20 years, if not longer), and had all the practical incidents and responsibilities of "ownership," I would not be particularly perturbed by its promotional material. The reports in previous postings on this thread do give me pause, however.

Posted by
18 posts

Filing an official complaint will "Begin the official complaint process, which may result in an investigation and possible legal action by the Division." according to the Utah Division of Consumer Protection website.

Here's a link to Utah Division of Consumer Protection complaint form:

https://dcp.utah.gov/complaints.html

Who knows, maybe if several of us file complaints, they'll look into it.

Posted by
10 posts

We booked 12 days in London in July. We were scammed out of our deposit too.
I am sending complaint to Utah A.G.
Thomas Moore Sr. is a crook.
I filed with my C.C. Company.
Keep up the posts as you get new info.
Perhaps we can file a group claim, but I’m not a lawyer.

Posted by
1 posts

Another who didn't get any email.Looks like a total loss.
Our booking was for 15/5 for 8 nights in London.Interesting that our final payment was due in December but wasn't processed until March.And the name on the receipt had changed.It appears Mr.Moore may have set up another company.

TRAVEL & ENTERTAINMNT TRX

94043-1140

UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (THE)

800.800.0000

Posted by
24 posts

Rondolton, This could be tremendously valuable information. Thank you for sharing. Can you tell us where you got this?

Posted by
18 posts

Checked again this morning with Utah Division of Corporations & Commercial Code, asking if they had received Articles of Dissolution from London Connection. Their reply below:

As of 4/29/2020 we have not received an dissolution for that entity.

The Registered Agent has no authority of power in an entity.

Thomas C Moore - Registered Agent
Thomas J Moore - Member

I would suggest you contact Consumer Protection at 801-530-6601 and see if they can offer any assistance.

Posted by
24 posts

Re the "new company" or "new name": I wonder if the phrase "TRAVEL & ENTERTAINMENT TRX" isn't just a category of merchant in which the entity submitting Rondolton's charge is classified by his or her card issuer.

I have learned, however, that what appears to be a phone number ("800.800.0000") is, whatever else it may be, the phone number of a personal-injury law firm in Oakland, CA. And that the hyphenated nine-digit number is, whatever else it may be, the Zip (postal) code for an area in Mountain View, CA that prominently includes Intuit, Inc., the accounting/tax software firm (think "Quicken"). A nice person at the law firm told me they have been receiving many unexpected phone calls from callers who thought they were calling some other person or entity, including American Express (whether she meant AE was calling, or callers thought they were calling AE, wasn't clear).

Posted by
5631 posts

Curious if anyone has received the promised refunds?

Secondly, no one likes bad press. Is there a local Utah news reporter who might find this entire situation a story to investigate?

Posted by
24 posts

I have not gotten any refund nor any replies via email, Facebook, phone.

Regarding newspapers: here is what I found online
"The Standard-Examiner is a daily morning newspaper published in Ogden, Utah, United States. With roughly 30,000 subscribers on Sunday and 25,000 daily, it is the third largest daily newspaper in terms of circulation in Utah, after The Salt Lake Tribune and the Deseret News."
https://www.standard.net/

Posted by
24 posts

I found another email address for Thomas Moore & London Connection which was current on Feb 23 as Thomas Moore replied to me that day regarding my deposit.
Today I sent a question to Thomas about my deposit... As you can see, he has deleted this email account

Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.

TMoore@LDNCXN.com:
No mx record found for domain=LDNCXN.com

Posted by
56 posts

Just weighing in to say that I, too, have had no contact or refund from London Connections since receiving their email regarding dissolution. Based on what I'm reading here, this seems unlikely to happen. What a shame for all sorts of reasons: they came highly regarded (I booked in part because of recommendations on the Forum) and their website and communications, at least in my case, were excellent. Perhaps I might be more sympathetic toward them if they hadn't suddenly evaporated and ceased communication. Best wishes to all who have written about this situation.

Posted by
6 posts

Hello again- just checking in again and wow this thread has gotten long! I haven't heard anything from London Connection and don't expect to. I tried calling their main number and left a voicemail. I also called Tori Tilley who was my point of contact for this reservation, no response. I left an email with info@londonconnection.com as well. We haven't received a refund check and I guess it's time to just let it go at this point. I did fill out the consumer complaint form with the state of Utah, so thanks to whoever suggested that. I also contacted my credit card company to dispute the charge and they are investigating, but I reserved this back in August of last year. Does anyone know if contacting Rick Steves Travel will get you anywhere as far as making them aware of what happened with the company? I remember reading in one of his travel guides his recommendation of London Connection for renting flats. I don't know, just a thought.

Shelley

Posted by
1862 posts

I left an email with info@londonconnection.com as well. We haven't
received a refund check and I guess it's time to just let it go at
this point. I did fill out the consumer complaint form with the state
of Utah, so thanks to whoever suggested that. I also contacted my
credit card company to dispute the charge and they are investigating

I've done all of the above. I contacted my credit card company mid-April and they are investigating and warned me it could take awhile. I have file a complaint with the State but haven't heard a thing.

Posted by
24 posts

Kris, Thanks for: Filing an official complaint will "Begin the official complaint process, which may result in an investigation and possible legal action by the Division." according to the Utah Division of Consumer Protection website.
Here's a link to Utah Division of Consumer Protection complaint form:
https://dcp.utah.gov/complaints.html

I spoke with an investigator today as I had clicked on the Something else link which said to call into the department; he listened and took notes. He told me to fill out the Purchase form (and fill it out with documentation)
Wanted others to know that this is the form to use to get an investigation going.

Posted by
18 posts

@ Judith---Thanks for the update on filling out the Utah consumer complaint form. Glad you spoke to someone at their office too. Hopefully some major red flags will start to go up when so many of us submit complaints.

In the sadly delusional hope that a deposit refund check would magically appear in my mailbox this week, I've procrastinated on filing an official consumer complaint.

But when it turns out my mailbox is empty tomorrow, the complaint form will move to the top of my To-Do list!

Posted by
7 posts

We also have a deposit with London Connection for a July 12 night stay. This would have been our 4th stay with them in the same West End apartment. We were extremely shocked to hear from them. We would have never expected this from them. Now because they have Lied to us and then disappeared, it is clear that they are not going to do the right thing unless they are forced to. We have filed a dispute with our CCC and submitted a form to Utah’s Attorney General. We will now fill out a Utah Consumer Protection form. Let’s all keep in touch in this forum.

Posted by
7 posts

I just spoke to an Investigator at the Consumer Protection Division. We ALL must fill out the forms and make a complaint. use the section for Purchases/Services and supply documentation. If we all do it, they will have more reason to investigate it thoroughly. Please do it. Their phone number is 801-530-6601. They have no intention of returning any of our money. The lack of communication has been appalling!

Posted by
24 posts

Has anyone tried telephoning the woman in London who is/was LC's local manager? i suspect she is just an innocent bystander/collateral damage, but she might have relevant information, including how to reach the Messrs. Moore pere et fils. I hesitate to post her name and number publicly, but they are on LC's booking confirmation/instructions documents.

Perhaps one of the property owners in the UK could easily try calling. Or really, anyone with an international phone plan (which does not include me).

Posted by
6 posts

Hello all, just an update - I've filed a complaint with
1. State of Utah Consumer Protection
2. Utah Attorney General
3. filled out feedback form for Rick Steves guidebook
Anybody have any other ideas?
Shelley

Posted by
2588 posts

Just ran across this thread. I'm saddened for all of those who have lost money. The thread kind of reads like an episode of American Greed on CNBC.

Shelley... Consider calling a Salt Lake City television station and point them to this thread (and Yelp reviews!). This is the sort of thing tv reporters love (and can earn them awards for investigative reporting that benefit their career). If Mr Moore lives in Ogden, the TV station will likely have resources to find him, knock on his door, and ask him about all this.

Posted by
1009 posts

Dave, here in DC, our newspapers and a TV station have a consumer reporter which helps people out with business problems such as this thread. There must be something like that in SLC.

Normally, I'm not a name and shame person, but these people have made off with people's money and since they haven't filed bankruptcy or dissolution, are probably spending it on themselves. I think the benefit of doubt has long since passed. Hopefully most people on here will get resolution from their credit card companies.

Posted by
18 posts

I went ahead and emailed "Get Gephardt" (Matt Gephardt) at KUTV news in Salt Lake City. He does consumer complaint investigations for their news division. I summarized our situation and included links to this forum and recent Yelp reviews.

If he gets back to me, I'll let you know.

Posted by
1 posts

We have used LC many times with no problems. Talking to Christina and David it was always clear they had long term leases on properties not ownership. We had paid for a spring 2020 stay and have yet to hear from Tom regarding any refund. I was not at all surprised they had gone bust-in the current climate and with travel on hold for perhaps a year until a vaccine is found many independent travel and hospitality firms will fold. I suspect we will all be out of pocket for our payments as flat owners will have first dibs on any $. If anyone hears from Tom pls let the rest of us know.

Posted by
24 posts

At the risk of being thought not to take the LC problem with the seriousness it deserves, I note that other strange things are happening in Ogden, UT. See this morning's news reports about the 5-year-old child in Ogden who took a joyride in the family car, heading for California to buy a Lamborghini. He got 3 miles down I-15, following the signs for Los Angeles, before being pulled over for driving only 32 mph. I am not making this up.

More to the point, has anyone tried phoning Christina in London? She might well have relevant information, and might even be willing to share it if she too has been left high and dry.

Posted by
759 posts

Joel- you apparently have her name and number. Call!
What is your delay?
Have you turned the name and number over to Utah authorities?

Posted by
7 posts

We have been assigned an Investigator with Utah’s Consumer Protection. His name is David Christensen. Keep filling out those forms. They make it clear that they are not acting as our attorney.

Posted by
24 posts

Esther, this is wonderful. Thanks for notifying us.
I do have a question on how we are to send the Consumer Complaint form with documentation to the Utah division of Consumer Protection? I only see a street address and the pdf does say to send it there. But is there an email address also that you'all have been using or just the street address?
Thanks.

Posted by
56 posts

Thank you for the update, Esther.

Yesterday, I called Utah and the young man who answered had heard about the situation. He helped me navigate the online form, which I filled out. It goes in the mail today, with copies of my email regarding dissolution and my original receipt from London Connection.

While I'm not certain that I'll see that money again, I am pleased that there is a mechanism for issuing a complaint.
Thanks to the Forum members who investigated.

Posted by
1862 posts

Judith, here is the email address I was told by the person on the phone to send it to. consumerprotection@utah.gov

Esther, how long did it take from when you sent your complaint and you were assigned a person? I emailed mine a week ago and have received no response.

Posted by
7 posts

I emailed the complaint form and my scanned documents on Friday and I was notified on Monday.

Oops - I emailed Consumer Protection on Friday, but my husband had sent mail to the Attorney General about a week before, and the email they used On their response was his. So it took about a week to get a response.

Posted by
1862 posts

Update. Mastercard credited my account for the $1500 this morning. I'm told that London Connection still has 6 weeks to dispute and if they do, I will be contacted to possibly submit more info. If I do not hear back in 6 weeks then the dispute is officially closed. It was by accident I noticed that my account had been credited, because the credit was dated on my statement back to the original purchase in February and not the most recent line item from yesterday on my credit card. I had been given no notice from the bank that this had been done and so I called and received the information I explained above.

**I should note that the terms of my credit card is that a dispute has to be started within 45 days of purchase, but there are exceptions, and this was one, so don't think it's too late to file a dispute.

Posted by
24 posts

Thanks Allan for the email address and congratulations on getting a credit. Thanks to all for your help in this process.

I just emailed my complaint form and bits of supporting information to consumerprotection@utah.gov attn: David Christensen
I have also filed a complaint with the Utah Attorney General https://attorneygeneral.utah.gov/contact/complaint-form/
and put an "update" to Rick Steves which included a link to this forum

My Chase VISA credit card last sent me a "we'll contact you" on May 2.....so who knows about that

Posted by
24 posts

The name and phone number of LC's London manager are on every invoice for every deposit and other payment. I offered the suggestion of calling her in order to be helpful. I'm not sure why making that suggestion obligated me to act on anyone's behalf, much less to do so on anyone else's timetable.

If locating her contact information is too difficult for someone, here it is:
Cristina Teixeira, (01) (44) 0795 658 3747.

Posted by
1009 posts

Sounds promising that the Utah government is aware of this problem. Fingers crossed.

Posted by
24 posts

Everyone, please be clear. It might be satisfying if Utah acted against LC and/or its owner(s). But the likelihood of any customer seeing any money as a result is, at best, not far above zero. One cannot get blood from a stone. A "Limited Company" is called that for a reason. The reason is that the owners' liability for debts of the company is limited to the company's assets. Only if the customer's money can be proven to have been fraudulently obtained is there even a possibility of holding the individual who committed the fraud personally liable. And fraud is difficult to prove.

So please don't get your hopes up.

Posted by
1862 posts

Best bet is to file a dispute through your credit card. As indicated yesterday, I received my money back yesterday, 3 weeks after filing a dispute.

Posted by
24 posts

Joel, for me personally I want the state of Utah to close down their business. As of today it is still showing an active company. Yet we were told LC had filed an Article of Dissolution by Thomas Moore (which could be either the father or son) on 4/2/20. And on their phone message you can hit #1 to still make a reservation (as of 5/9/20). I have no thoughts that any money will come out of this action. I just don't like dishonest merchants and do not feel they should be rewarded.

Posted by
4528 posts

just for information the number for Cristina Teixeira above is that of a personal EE mobile phone.

Posted by
7474 posts

is that of a personal EE mobile phone.

"EE" ?

How is an ' EE mobile phone' different than a 'mobile phone' ?

Posted by
3400 posts

Allan, so happy you received your money back. I hope the same positive result for the rest of you.

Posted by
25742 posts

How is an ' EE mobile phone' different than a 'mobile phone' ?

I noticed that this was a mobile number when it was posted, although the way it was first posted it looked to me like it was a digit short.

"0795 658 3747" sort of mushes the number into a US format, which threw me. The dialing code should be 07xxx as a group of 5, then 3+3. It would be much more British if it were (07956) 583 747. A London landline would have started with 0207 or 0208 or 0203. If it were a national but local price landline it would have started with 03.

EE is the name of a mobile phone company here. The format of the number starting with a 07 indicates to me that it is not traditional office phone but a mobile telephone. For whatever that's worth.

Mobiles have different dialing codes to landlines, unlike in the US.

Posted by
24 posts

LC's invoices show Cristina's number in the US format I used, but that should not be surprising since most of their customers are/were in the US. I do recall from calling it a couple of times when in London that it was for her mobile. (I don't think they had an office as such, just Cristina, her son, some housekeepers, and possibly a handyman). But that shouldn't keep one from reaching her (if it's still in service).

Posted by
1 posts

I stumbled upon this forum yesterday and really appreciate all the information that's been shared. I received the notice of dissolution email from London Connection on April 2nd and had been waiting for word on my refund. I too tried to reach them but didn't get any reply. Thanks to the postings, today I took action and filed a dispute with my credit card company. I was advised that unless London Connections challenges my claim, I will be able to get my deposit refunded which is a relief.

I also filed a complaint with the Department of Commerce Utah so hopefully an investigation will take place. Good luck everyone.

Posted by
24 posts

I received word this morning from Chase that they have given me a credit for/refunded my deposit to London Connection. It's the same message as others have written about: LC has 2 months to contest. If there is no response from LC in this time, the credit remains on my account.
This was 6 weeks after first notifying Chase (4/3/20 thanks to Allan having started this forum) and 3 weeks after finding and filing the dispute form so hopefully the rest of you will be hearing soon.

Also I received an email from David Christensen, the investigator from Utah, that he has received my complaint form.
"The Utah Division of Consumer Protection received your complaint. This complaint was opened and assigned to Investigator David G. Christensen.
The investigative process typically involves sending notice of this complaint to those involved and allowing the business to respond. These initial steps generally require at least 60 days. If the assigned investigator requires additional information from you, the investigator or another division staff member will contact you using the information you submitted on your complaint form."

Hi all, i am also in the same position. Thomas moore does not answer to our emails, has disapeared with our money. We have sent a complaint to Utah consumer protection but has no answer until now. Also we filed a form in BBB but also without answer at the moment. We are also trying to our Credit card.

Posted by
7 posts

For those of you who are having difficulty communicating with London Connection via its business email, allow us to share with you the following address for Thomas Moore (father of the father-son ownership team), which we fortuitously found from correspondence we had exchanged with father Moore a few years ago: tmooresr@me.com. We included that address in our complaint to the State of Utah Consumer Complaint Form. FYI, the father regularly posts on Facebook under Thomas Moore III and lists the following telephone number on FB: (801) 791.9918.

Like so many of you who have posted, London Connection has also wrongfully refused to refund our pre-paid rental payments. In our case, the amount owed is almost $3000. We are now pursuing remedies through our credit card company, as well as law enforcement authorities in Utah.

Posted by
10 posts

I contacted Thomas Moore III a month ago on his FB site. He told me that he has nothing to do with the London Connection and to basically leave him alone.

Posted by
24 posts

Mr. Moore Sr. (or Mr. Moore III, whichever/both) had plenty to do with LC until it went dark. He was a primary contributor to its promotional "blog" and website. My understanding was that he founded the company, and is a co-owner.

Posted by
5631 posts

And again I ask isn't there a member of the media who would like to make a story out of this debacle.
The closing of LC is supposedly due to the virus. In reality it is a story of deception and broken dreams.

Posted by
24 posts

@ Barry; I think we may have both posted on Thomas Moore iii's FB on the same day- when he shared about the British being asked to wear masks; It was 5/1. I never received a message from TM iii but noticed the next day that that post about British masks was gone as well as our messages to him.

Posted by
7474 posts

https://www.smartbackgroundchecks.com/people/thomas-moore/ogden/ut/El00ZGH5AmH0ZQL2BQxjZQL4AGDm

After performing an extensive deep review of Thomas Moore's records, we have discovered that this individual also has 10 business ownership records, 3 web domains, 1 legal judgments, 5 liens, 48 properties, 17 vehicle registrations. To see all of the information including property records, possible liens, judgments, court records and much more, click here to unlock the full background report. ( for a fee?)

Fascinating what one can find with the phone # 'auntieg808' included in her post

Posted by
24 posts

Be wary of these "background check" websites. They search free public records, but for a fee. Their "reports" typically include information on multiple people with the same or similar names. They prey on people's anxieties and suspicions. Assume nothing.

I think the problem addressed with this thread is not one of finding out information on the Messrs. Moore. We all know who and where they are. The problem is one of finding a way to get refunds of deposits (not to mention final payments) made. Your credit card issuer should provide full refunds. Trying to persuade the Utah authorities to act will add nothing to that, except psychic satisfaction. If curiosity is the driver, try calling Cristina Teixeira in London. I'm not bothering to do it, but certainly would be interested to learn the results if anyone else does.

Posted by
7 posts

Please allow me to clear up any potential confusion over the two London Connection owners in conducting background checks on them and/or pursuing remedies through credit card companies and responsible law enforcement entities: Thomas Moore III is the father, while Thomas Moore Jr. is the son of the father-son team. As an earlier post pointed out, both were actively involved in running the company. The father's proclamation that he has nothing to do with the business is a bald-faced lie. Among other activities, he procured leases for many of the London flats, decorated them, and was primarily responsible for writing the flats' flourishing descriptions on the LC website. As well, on the father's Facebook page, he regularly posted photos of his London Connection office in Utah and often boasted about the wide array of rare collectibles and antiques displayed at his office. After bragging about his many valuable possessions, it truly is a shame that he has taken no financial responsibility for causing significant losses to so many innocent customers.

Oh, by the way, with respect to another earlier post disclosing that LC remains dissolved as of late April, notwithstanding its April 2 email stating the contrary, one wonders whether the company might have retained its legal status in order to seek benefits from the various pandemic-related stimulus packages aimed at protecting small businesses and their employees. Just a thought!

Posted by
18 posts

Regarding the issue of whether Thomas Moore might have applied for Paycheck Protection Act business loan, I emailed the Utah office of the Small Business Administration a couple weeks ago to find out if he did apply and receive funds.

Got no reply. Maybe I'll try again.

Both my brother-in-law's small business and my church have received funds recently (during the second round of the Paycheck Protection business loans), so I'm also curious to know if Thomas Moore might have tried to get those funds as well.

Posted by
7 posts

Spotted an oversight in my previous post: in the second sentence, I left out the word “not” before “dissolved”. Apologies to all.

Posted by
24 posts

If LC truly is insolvent, it might well at some point file a bankruptcy petition, at least if it has any assets at all. And it must have some assets, if only its Ogden office lease and office equipment. Its London leases also are assets. (Obviously, leases are associated with counterpart liabilities.) Caution: I am not a Utah lawyer, nor a bankruptcy lawyer. But as best I can determine, neither London Connection, Connections Management, nor anyone named Thomas Moore has done this yet in the U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the District of Utah.

This would be something to check on periodically, at least if for some reason one cannot get a credit card chargeback from the card issuer. Alternatively, any creditor or group of creditors can file an involuntary bankruptcy petition to force liquidation of assets and distribution of the proceeds among creditors. One never knows what assets might legally be company assets (for example, bought with company money) but in the personal possession of an individual corporate officer or stockholder.

Posted by
18 posts

Another asset......London Connection LLC owns the building they were operating from.

Info from the Weber County, UT Parcel Search:

Owner: London Connection Llc (the)

Market Total $279,670.00
Taxable Value $279,670.00

2342 Washington Blvd
Ogden Ut 84401-1412

Posted by
24 posts

It occurs to me (perhaps belatedly) that a public forum like this may not be the best place to exchange information and ideas on how to nail LC and/or the Messrs. Moore. If someone more techie than me were to start up some kind of private email group on Yahoo or whatever, I'd be more than happy to participate.

Posted by
1 posts

I have read the above with interest. May I suggest contacting the small claims court. You can obtain info at: OgdenCity.com/176/small-claims-court. This is what I have done. As a Utah resident, this is easier, but much of this can be done on line. If the company or its principals have property/ assets in Utah, a lien will placed on the assets. I’ve also gone to my CC company. They have issued a temporary credit.

Posted by
24 posts

The Small Claims procedure in Utah Justice Court is valuable in the right circumstances. But no one who lost a deposit (or even final payment) at LC should get their hopes up on that basis. For one thing, it's not free. The filing fee is $60, and a "process server" must be hired to physically find and then deliver official papers to the defendant (you cannot be your own process server in your own case).
Successfully serving process is not as easy as one might think. The more difficult, the more costly the work.
And even a professional process server may not succeed.
Furthermore, no court procedure is quick, not even small claims. And most importantly, the plaintiff is required to physically appear in court for the trial. As a practical matter, this procedure is of no use to out-of-staters, and maybe even most Utah residents outside Ogden.
Has no one tried to call LC's London manager Cristina Teixeira to learn what can be learned?

Posted by
2 posts

Someone should send this thread to the Ogden Standard Examiner and the Salt Lake Tribune. Thomas Moore III has a big social media presence on both FB and Instagram...usually highlighting fabulous properties and possessions. He’s not difficult to track down.

Posted by
3400 posts

No question that the papers have been notified. The question is will they care in the midst of all the pandemic news?

Posted by
1862 posts

I suspect local media is only going to care if they can find a local resident that has been impacted by the closure so they can turn it into a local human interest bit.

Posted by
4 posts

We were scheduled for an April stay, our third in the Gloucester Mansions Apts at the junction of Soho and Covent Gardens. During our first stay 2017, we asked about the apt owner and was told that it was a woman from Europe. That led us to believe that London Connection was the rental agent who provided certain services including holding the funds between client and owner in escrow, as Airbnb and other agencies do.

Perhaps London Connection could not stand seeing the property owners making bank on these always-booked rentals, so they decided to buy into a bigger piece of action? And financed it using the prepaid moneys they require months in advance from clients? That does not sound legitimate to me, but perhaps there's another explanation?

The other thing is the timing of the dissolution notice, which occurred barely two weeks into the pandemic and only a week after we had to cancel our $1,500 reservation after some of our air carriers left us with no way to execute our trip. LC readily offered a voucher for a future stay, which we thought was equitable. But then it appeared that LC ran for the exits early (a sign that they were highly leveraged and could not survive any downturn?).

So per their April 2nd email notice, exactly who/what are the "London lease liabilities" with which we, the "clients with upcoming reservations," have to "share the company liquidity" (i.e., OUR money)? I haven't seen hide nor hair of the any refund check that was promised by early May, so are we to assume none are coming? I have received no answer to my email to LC last week simply requesting a status. I believe we need to know the status in order to file a dispute to the credit card company.

Perhaps we will all end up being fractional owners in some London apartments???

Posted by
1862 posts

I believe we need to know the status in order to file a dispute to the
credit card company.

Mark, when I called my bank to dispute the credit card charge all I was asked to provide was a copy of that April 2nd email. My account was credited a few weeks later. The bank says LC still has a few weeks to file a dispute in response but I don't see them having much leverage. My advice is to jump on it now, my sense is shared by many on this post that there is no money coming from LC.

In 2018 we stayed at the same apartments as you. We were so impressed with the service we recieved that we booked with LC again for this Fall even though we'd found another place nearby that was a bit cheaper. At the time I felt that LC had earned my trust and my business. Now I'm going to have trust issues when it comes time to book an apartment again through someone else.

Posted by
4 posts

Allan,
Thanks so much for sharing. I second your motion to ACT NOW with your credit card company, as I did this morning. My down payment of mid-January was just outside of the window that my credit card allows for filing an on-line dispute, so it took an agent and her supervisor this morning to approve the filing. So much for waiting in good faith to see if there would be a partial refund coming from LC before entangling the credit card company in what might be an evolving situation.

I also had some lesser refunds from European airlines that I've been waiting on, and I've moved ahead disputed those too. I understand cash flow problems, but they should issue vouchers instead of promising refunds when they can't make good on them.

Ditto on the trust issue. My experience with Airbnb refunds (and we had 9 of them from cancelled trips in April - June) has been just the opposite, since Airbnb is truly a third party holding the money in escrow until the transaction between owner and renter is complete. Live and learn.

Posted by
7 posts

For those of you who were successful in obtaining temporary refunds from your credit card companies, can you kindly provide the name of the credit card company/bank that issued the refunds? An earlier poster mentioned that Chase issued her a temporary refund. Interestingly, in my case, Chase denied my refund request. I would like to appeal that decision and hope that a list of other companies/banks that have issued refunds will help my cause. Many thanks!

Posted by
10 posts

I put in our LC dispute with Citibank Visa. The bank contacts LC and they have until 7/9 to respond. We received a conditional credit on our account. A conditional credit is temporary and it applies until your inquiry is resolved. Depending on the outcome of the inquiry, the conditional credit will either become permanent or be removed.
I think it would take a miracle for this credit to remain permanent.

Posted by
7919 posts

“I think it would take a miracle for this credit to remain permanent.”

Why? You didn’t get what you paid for.
LC committed fraud by keeping your money when no service was rendered.

Posted by
1862 posts

I think it would take a miracle for this credit to remain permanent.

I'm also curious why you think that. Is this just a feeling or do you you have some past experience you can share?

Posted by
1862 posts

Chase denied my refund request. I would like to appeal that decision
and hope that a list of other companies/banks that have issued refunds
will help my cause.

Mine was a Mastercard through RBC. Did Chase give a reason for the denial?

Posted by
10 posts

If LC actually has gone bankrupt or is in dissolution, there may not be any money in its account to deduct. In this case Visa will require that Citibank cover my loss. “I hope that happens and I get my deposit back”, but I don’t trust the bank or CC company to work in my best interest.

Posted by
7 posts

Thanks "barry24" and "Allan" for your replies. The letter we got from Chase provided no explanation and, from its wording, we aren't even sure that the representative reviewed the documentation we had submitted. We will appeal her decision, armed with info that CitiBank and RBC (as well as another Chase representative) had accepted other disputes.

By the way, earlier today, I noticed Moore (the father) posted on Facebook that he visited his son this weekend. Along with announcing his visiting his son, Moore the father also posted pictures of his impressive turquoise collection and impressive jewelry items with the caption "Family seals dating back to 1783 gathered on a gold bracelet. Stephanie (his wife) says it is too heavy to wear. One of my favorite heirlooms." Wonder if father visited his son to discuss how to respond to credit card company inquiries or, better yet, how to liquidate some of his family's precious belongings so they could repay well-intentioned customers they stiffed . . . yes, I believe in the Tooth Fairy!

Posted by
1862 posts

Here's a couple of links that I had researched while waiting to hear back from my bank. From what I interpret, the credit card companies are bound by law to help you. My bank is Canadian so laws are possibly different and maybe that is why I had quick success, it appears that one of these articles is American and one British.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/company-administration-help/

If what you purchased cost £100 or more, and you paid all, or even just the deposit, by credit card, then your credit card company is as equally liable (as the retailer) under Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act.
That means whatever rights you had with the retailer/company, you have with the credit card company, so you can get your money back from the card firm.
This is a legal protection that credit card companies have no choice about – when you spend on a credit card, you're entering into an arrangement to borrow (even if you pay off in full), so you get these rights.

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/getting-your-deposit-back-when-company-goes-bankrupt-2013-07-18

**Who foots the bill?*
Of course, if the merchant's gone bankrupt, there may not be any money in its account to deduct. In this case, Visa , MasterCard and American Express require that the acquirer cover the loss. It's not merely a suggestion, says Teri Charest, a spokeswoman for U.S. Bank. "Banks are bound by [these] rules and parameters established by the card networks," she says.*

This is my first experience with a situation like this and so I'm far from an expert. But I'd stay positive and keep digging.

Posted by
25742 posts

money saving expert (also known as Martin Lewis -sold but still is the figurehead- ) is British. Married to his lockdown camera and producer, Lara Lewington, she of BBC Click fame.

The key might have been in the £ sign, and the fact that Section 75 is UK law.

Posted by
7 posts

Many, many thanks to Allan for sharing his research. We can appreciate that current times are tough for everyone associated with the travel industry, but the manner the Moores handled this situation has been unethical and deceitful. We wish all affected much success in their efforts to recover monies owed.

Posted by
1862 posts

I was doing a google search the other day wondering about the whole situation and was surprised how little info is out there. A link to this page is usually one of the top feeds that comes up on the search.

I'm hoping other people are starting to have success getting money back through credit cards or through disputes with the State.

Posted by
9 posts

I've rented from London Connections for about six summers and have met Tom Moore, Sr. and his son, Tom, and his wife, Stephanie. Once when a daughter and I had an extra theatre ticket due to my husband's illness and inability to go to London, we took Stephanie as our guest. The Moores were very involved with the Clarges Street apartments. They first had the two bottom ones. Then got the third-story one. Finally the fourth-story one. Once while staying in that building we met the woman who had just leased to them the 4th story apartment, so yes, it was always about leases vs. ownership, as far as I knew. The Moores were less involved with the other apartments we rented from them in Mayfair, but again, mail came to those apartment buildings for the owners. When I spoke to young Tom last fall, he told me the family owned properties in Utah. Tom Sr. cannot get away with disclaiming involvement -- well, maybe he can legally but not in real life: he offered regular guided tours to a well-known antique district (didn't go on those, but they were offered for several years). The Moores were well known to the restaurant owners in the Clarges St. area. Tom Sr. spoke often when we saw him about his love of collecting antiques. It would be interesting to know if the Moores took the clocks, drawings, etc. out of the apartments pre-liquidation. I've lost a $2613. deposit for an August rental and at 82 years of age lack high-tech skills, but would like to help in any way I can to try to get us back our money. I've been on hold for an hour with Chase to see about filing for a refund. I live in Washington, D.C.

Posted by
7 posts

Matt Gephardt has changed TV stations. He left KUTV at the end of 2019. He is now at KSL I found his email address as matt@ksl.com.

Has anyone gotten any feedback from the State of Utah after filing your complaint? We have not heard anything yet.

Posted by
1862 posts

I filed with the State of Utah and never heard back-not even a confirmation that they received my information. I never followed up though because in the meantime the charges were reversed on my credit card.

Posted by
356 posts

Perhaps 15 years ago, I booked an apartment in London through LC. I was still getting LC email messages a few months ago, and I do remember Christina.

I feel for anyone who has lost any payments. But a practical problem is that though the amount lost is enough to contact credit card companies and banks, and make phone calls to consumer protection agencies in Utah, it is probably not enough to hire a lawyer and file suit. However, a few quick questions:

  1. The website for the Utah Secretary of State should show the legal status of the LLC. There should be a legal process to be followed before dissolution of the LLC. Have you checked the website?

  2. Has the LLC or owners sought bankruptcy protection?

  3. Did the contract you signed state that any lawsuit would have to be filed in Utah and that Utah law would apply? It probably did, but you may want to check. And another issue might be whether such venue and choice-of-law provisions will be enforced in your state, though they are common (I bet RS tours have those clauses in their contracts) and probably will.

Posted by
356 posts

The website for the Utah Secretary of State shows the status of London Connection, a limited company, as active.

Posted by
9 posts

I reached Chase after two hours on hold and was told my Visa card would be credited, but I suspect that Chase will conduct an investigation, as it should, and then determine if those of us who lost money to The London Connection are entitled to a refund. I sent an e-mail to Matt, at his new TV-station address; no reply so far. I plan to call the three major newspapers next. Today (6/11) I telephoned the Office of the Attorney General at (801) 366-0260 and a polite woman there, who seemed not to have heard of The LC bankruptcy, referred me to the Utah Department of Commerce, Division of Consumer Protection, at (801) 530-6601. I telephoned and reached a polite man, Nathan, who sent me a Consumer Complaint Form. I am able to download PDFs but not fill them in and return them on the internet, but Nathan said I could snail-mail the form to the Consumer Protection's address, in SLCity, on the form. I will do that. I think our chances of retrieving any money are very slim, but the Moores have treated us badly and I'm willing to pursue the matter to this extent. Thanks to all of you who have the skills, which I lack, to uncover facts. If any of you have further suggestions of ways in which I can be of help, please let me know. Thanks from susan

Posted by
56 posts

Dear Forum,

Just to update my situation with LC. I filed a complaint with my credit card company, supplying the necessary information according to their own directions. Yesterday, the company wrote back to inform me that, after having opened an investigation and contacted the merchant, they were reversing my refund (!!!). It seems that LC said that the charge was not fraudulent because it was made by me personally.

So, this tells me two things: first, someone is able to contact LC; second, whoever is advising claimants at the credit card company is not doing a very good job of it. Of course, my payment was not initially fraudulent; what is at issue is that we were promised a refund and did not receive it (nor will we be able to receive the promised services).

The company has provided a mechanism for continuing this process. I will now take it up with my daughter who is an attorney! I expect it will require at least one phone call and lots of paperwork.

Good luck to all who are doing the same.

Posted by
24 posts

Julie in Chicago -- Who is your credit card issuer? Can you post a copy of the issuer's message notifying you that the chargeback had been reversed?

Posted by
759 posts

Telephone contact is generally not enough to protect your interests with the credit card company. Most have timelines AND require documentation. Yes- the old world of envelopes and stamps. A change in refund policy is generally not grounds for a credit card reversal. You must allege that you did not get what you bought. You put down a deposit on an apartment and they (LC) cancelled the reservation and refused to refund your deposit—they refused to provide the service (Apartment) your contracted for. Do Not delay. And keep copies of the letters you send into the CC company.

Posted by
1009 posts

Actually with the corona virus, more companies are using scanning/fax and dropbox or emails instead of letters. But yes, keep all documentation showing your deposit with LC and any emails/phone call conversations that you had about refunds. You may have to on the credit card company.

I guess this does show that LC are still in business and are aware of the credit card refunds and have probably decided to start fighting them.

Posted by
356 posts

To secure your booking, you probably had to sign a contract prepared by LC as well as make some initial payment. What does your contract say regarding the resolution of disputes and the right of LC to cancel?

Does the contract require arbitration, or that any suits be filed in Utah, or that Utah law be the controlling law?

And does the contract say anything about LC cancelling the booking for emergency reasons and the return of prior payments? Because LC was a small business, its contract would not have been as elaborate as the contract people taking a cruise sign. But I am sure those seeking reimbursement did sign something drafted by LC.

Posted by
1 posts

Hi. I just received a charge back from my Visa card. I am anxious that London Connection will dispute it and recharge my card. I note that there has been a dispute with one poster. Has that happened to anyone else? It feels like all the cards are in the hands of the company not the customer.

Posted by
56 posts

Dear Forum,

Just to update what I pm'ed Joel. My credit card company reversed their initial refund based on their communications with LC. There is an appeal process which I have initiated both online (with a document-laden PDF) and by mail (with the same documents). I feel some of this might have to do with the clunkiness of the online portal by which you make your initial complaint - although we were directed by an employee on how to fill it out. It made it all too easy for LC to prove that I had paid the deposit and there was no fraud! This was not my dispute.

Technically, the fraud will occur in December when the apartment I paid for is not available, but surely that is obvious when one reads the Dissolution email (also supplied by me for the appeal). I made a brief search in my files for a contract; I thought that I could get it via the link in my confirmation email. Alas, that material is no longer available.

Good luck and stay safe everyone,
Julie

Posted by
1 posts

My wife and I are in the same bucket. Paid the deposit and Mr. Moore is now claiming that we never cancelled the reservation. Our check-in date is not until late August 2020, which is 66 days from today. So I sent my cancellation via FedEx with a Direct Signature option as proof of delivery. It would appear that Thomas Moore is not concerned about refunding anything.

I did find a positive item on the web. Although, it is from July 2013, it is interesting .
URL: https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/getting-your-deposit-back-when-company-goes-bankrupt-2013-07-18

I found it strange that I would have to cancel a reservation for a company that is out of business. However, according to the State of Utah, he did not file any Articles of Dissolution on April 1st or any time since then.

Next step, contact the Consumer Protection Agency and the Attorney General in Utah.

Posted by
6 posts

Hello all, just wanted to check in and update everybody. I'm so happy to report that our credit card company resolved our case yesterday in our favor. We now have a permanent credit applied for 841.22. Citibank gave London Connection two months to respond and dispute-we called them on April 17. I am so thankful to the Rick Steves Forum and everybody on here for their advice in this matter. A big shout out to Allan who started this thread so we could all share our unfortunate experiences with London Connection. I have not heard back from Utah consumer protection or Utah attorney general. I wish everyone the best of luck.

Thanks again,

Shelley

Posted by
1862 posts

Good News Shelley. One thing to take from your original comment on this post is that your husband didn't think you could dispute the charge on your credit card because it was more than 45 days old. Glad you didn't listen to him ;) obviously there are special circumstances.

Posted by
7 posts

Like Shelley, our charge for London Connection was made with our CitiBank card. We just received notification that our dispute was resolved and we are receiving a credit of $1149.39. We are very happy that this has finally been resolved for us. Keep pushing forward with your credit card company.

Posted by
9 posts

Congratulations to those who have received their deposits back on their credit cards. It will still be a while before I hear from Chase whether our charge is only temporarily resolved or whether it will be permanently resolved and I didn't want to sit idly by. I telephoned the Missionary Store at 2342 Washington Blvd. - (801) 781-4040 - and learned that the Moores do own that building. The store rents from them. The Moores moved out from the space in the building they used for LC about a month ago and have rented those premises to someone else. While the Moores have pulled a disappearing act from all of us, the person at the Missionary Store telephoned Tom, Jr. about my call. Made it clear, as if it wasn't already, that they are only inaccessible to LC landlords and renters. I have a call in to the Ogden newspaper. My husband and I have Pulitzer prizes and I invited the person answering the phone at that newspaper to go to Google and check out our names so they don't think I'm a crank. If I don't hear from the Ogden newspaper in a week or two (they're not publishing their weekly edition today because of the July 4th holiday) I will try the Salt Lake City newspaper, in fact I may do that anyway. A question for the London landlords on whom the Moores walked out. Did they remove their handsome clocks and furnishings before they left? I want to round up all the information I can for the Utah newspapers and the Utah Consumers Agency. I normally would be sympathetic to a travel outfit in pandemic times and have indeed tried to help local merchants stay in business. This liquidation, however, leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth. Upon reflection, we were sent emails c. Aprll 1 saying checks, if any, might be sent out on May 1. That now seems like a simple delaying tactic. A Utah journalist could look into whether even one LC client received a refund. The Moores surely have other business ventures and perhaps may, post-pandemic, reopen another venture in London. Let prospective future renters beware of the Moore family. At least our losses will have served a purpose.

Posted by
10 posts

Catfred3,
Ryan Christner is City Editor. I have been in contact with him about LC. You and others can contact him if you wish to add information.
The Standard-Examiner
332 Standard Way | ‪P.O. Box 12790, Ogden, UT 84412‬
O: 801.625.4229
C: 620.200.5108
rchristner@standard.net

Posted by
5631 posts

Hopeful by going to the media LC will be punished for their unprofessional and fraudulent undertakings.

For those affected by LC’s closing and refusal to refund $’s please keep the forum informed if and when the State of Utah takes action.

Posted by
9 posts

Called Ryan Christner at Ogden newspaper. Extremely courteous. Utah has a primary today, but he sounded as if he might assign a reporter to this when time permits -- post-primary, post-4th of July. He has my e-mail and telephone #. I'll wait a couple of weeks and see if he gets back to me, then try the SLC newspaper if he doesn't. When I told young Tom last year that one of our daughters was visiting friends in Utah and going with them to their summer place in Bear Lake, ID, young Tom said the family owned property there. This family has assets it will surely try to protect from creditors. Let's hope the law is on our side. susan

Posted by
10 posts

catfred3,
Susan..WTG! I hope they expose the Moore’s for the crooks that they are.
BTW, We got our $1100.00+ deposit back via a Citibank CC dispute. We sent them the evidence and we won!

Posted by
7474 posts

Happily I am not one of "the rubes" who got swindled, but I suspect much of the ire is the result of the lies and deceit that has been perpetrated on the customers. It appears many were loyal repeat customers who have been treated quite shabbily and the Moore's are doing their best to make everyone else bear the costs, while they keep the profits they have made for decades.

The concept that it is okay to steal from others because its going for a "good cause" ( i.e. my mortgage etc) is mind-boggling.

Posted by
759 posts

More #$&* and f*&$# by the Moore’s via their stooge. Yes the pandemic hit but they pulled the plug well before travel to England was stopped. Oops, you missed that point. They had huge sums (6-7 figures) in deposits in their accounts, opps. They stopped all communication and shut down their website instantly- opps. Many of their “owned” properties were not owned but leased and they weren’t making lease payments per posts by owners trying to find them-despite having renters in those properties- opps. Oh, they were busy posting on Facebook ABOUT THEIR Rich and Famous lifestyle travels- another opps. Dude, you really need to get your story (fairy tale) straight before posting on the Internet.

Posted by
10 posts

To Thomas Moore Jr. or his supposed surrogate Just passing through.
“If you act like THIEVES, we’ll treat you like THIEVES.” .....KARMA.....

Posted by
7919 posts

Dear Just Pissing Through...
Predators who steal people’s money need to be caught, need to be held accountable and need to suffer the consequences of their actions.

Gee, maybe they can even sell one of their properties to pay back what they have stolen. A moral and ethical person would do that on their own, others need to be forced.

Posted by
24 posts

Apparently I missed a post defending the Messrs. Moore that's been taken down. Does anyone have a screenshot they could re-post?

Posted by
1 posts

Thank you so much for all the information. My American Express credit card company just issued me a credit for our April stay that we couldn't do. They will go after LC for their money.
AF

Posted by
7919 posts

joel, it was a post from someone claiming to be a friend of the moores, he/she verbally attacked all the posters here whose money has been stolen by the moores.

Posted by
10 posts

The Moore defender said he is a friend of theirs.
That’s good...it tells us they are probably reading these posts.

Posted by
3 posts

I had a trip planned for August. I made a $3100.00 down payment with London Connection. I waited about 3 weeks past the date we were told refunds would be mailed before I filed a dispute with my credit card company. I have provisional credit at the moment and waiting for a final decision.
This year was going to be the 4th time I rented a flat from them. I have always had a good experience with London Connection.
I am very disappointed in how this was handled.

I am also bothered by the Instagram posts as well. Seems in bad taste considering a lot of people are out of thousands of dollars.

Posted by
2 posts

The Moore’s are hardcore LDS and well-known in Ogden, not exactly an inconspicuous couple. Hopefully the local newspaper and State attorney general will look into this mess for all involved. It’s unbelievable that they still have a presence on social media. FYI, don’t let their lavish lifestyle fool you. From what I’ve seen on the web, they’re a couple of social-climbers from humble backgrounds who would like everyone to think they’re from Old Money.

Posted by
7474 posts

Any update regarding credit card refunds or anything else?

Posted by
56 posts

Dear joe32f,

I resubmitted my claim against LC with my credit card company after they rejected my earlier claim (please see earlier post). This time I did it both on paper and online, with substantial documentation and a written explanation. I also referenced the Utah investigation. The credit card company has emailed twice, saying that the complaint is still pending and that they have not heard from LC. They did provisionally refund the credit, but that happened last time as well. I believe that LC has a bit more time to respond. This is an improvement over the first claim to which LC responded saying that it wasn't fraud because I had paid the deposit.

Julie

Posted by
2588 posts

Julie--

There is nothing in this thread that casts LC in a good light, but it seems particularly repugnant that its owners challenged your charge back on a service they had clearly indicated they would be unable to provide.

Posted by
24 posts

Can anyone confirm that there actually is a Utah investigation? Posting a letter or acknowledgement from the investigating agency could be helpful to those of us with pending credit card chargeback requests.

Posted by
24 posts

I received this email on 5/14/20
May 14, 2020

RE: COMPLAINT #118682

Dear Sir or Madam:

The Utah Division of Consumer Protection received your complaint. This complaint was opened and assigned to Investigator David G. Christensen.

The investigative process typically involves sending notice of this complaint to those involved and allowing the business to respond. These initial steps generally require at least 60 days. If the assigned investigator requires additional information from you, the investigator or another division staff member will contact you using the information you submitted on your complaint form. After 60-90 days if the case is not resolved, it will be transferred to another investigator for appropriate action. Please note that cases are investigated in an order of oldest to newest.

Unless there has been a change in circumstances or you have resolved your complaint with the business involved, please allow 30 days prior to calling the Division or the investigator assigned to your case to request a status update.

Please note, that the Division does not represent you and cannot provide legal advice to you. The Division is not a mediation service, but an enforcement agency charged with investigating deceptive business practices and various other violations of the law. You can find information about the Division’s enforcement authority at www.dcp.utah.gov
Sincerely,

David G. Christensen
Investigator
Utah Division of Consumer Protection
Email: davechristensen@utah.gov
Main Office: 801-530-6601
Direct: 801-530-6397

Posted by
24 posts

Thanks, Judith. Presumably a card issuer can verify with the agency that this Complaint # relates to LC.

Posted by
3 posts

I filled a claim with Chase on my Preferred Sapphire card. I received a temporary credit after giving them all the details and just received notice, in the mail this week, that my credit will remain. Just wanted to say THANK YOU! Without the forum and post and I would have no idea what was going on with London Connection and would have lost $2,660.

Posted by
3 posts

I also received word back from my bank (KeyBank) this week that my temporary credit is now permanent. Thank you all who have posted.

Posted by
56 posts

Dear Forum,

I just received this email from the Utah investigator assigned to the LC case:

"This is to advise that due to potential violations in the matter, and the need for further investigation, and Phase I deadlines, I am transferring the case to Phase II. Please note that Phase II investigators work cases oldest to newest and it can take many weeks or months before they get to a case. They should contact you when they start working on this case.

Phase II continues the investigation process. They may find no violation, close the case. They may work on a settlement with the business. They may issue citations."

Has anyone else received a similar message?

Julie

Posted by
6 posts

Hi Julie- I was just coming on here to post the same email that I received from Dave Christensen. It's been just about 3 months since I originally filed the complaint on May 6 2020. I'm not sure what this new email means, if anything.

Shelley

Posted by
24 posts

I received this same email this morning. I'm not sure what it means either especially the "due to potential violations in the matter" .

Judith

Posted by
7474 posts

"due to potential violations in the matter" .

Reading the entire text, I see it meaning that Dave has run out of time to work the case based on their internal rules. The case being moved to 'Phase2" implies he found enough to warrant continued investigation, but not enough to make a conclusion.

The rest of the message is cautionary verbiage that the ongoing investigation does not mean a conviction is a forgone conclusion.

The message had to be carefully worded, so as not to give the Moores any grounds for a claim of 'defamation'

It looks like it will be a long slow grind, but perhaps this has given the victims enough that the credit card companies will be more easily swayed to giving refunds ( and hopefully going after LC and its owners assets for restitution).

Posted by
7 posts

We received the same email today, too. Who knows where it will lead.
Grateful that we got the refund from our credit card.

Posted by
9 posts

I also received the e-mail from Dave Christensen, dated August 4. By the way, as I could only contact the Utah Consumer Protection people by snail-mail, I printed out the 40-some pages of the thread, which at the time I wrote ended with a post from B on July 8. I, too, received a form from Chase last week saying my c.c. charge would remain. I am so grateful to all who initiated this. Thank you. Susan

Posted by
24 posts

Hi everyone,
I'm so glad many of us have had adjustments from our credit card companies.
I wanted to share something with you'all that I am flabbergasted about.

Tonight I decided to google "apartments in London to rent for short term vacations". One result was Trip Advisor's 10 best London apartments. https://www.tripadvisor.com/VacationRentals-g186338-Reviews-London_England-Vacation_Rentals.html

After clicking on some filters (Mayfair, wifi, ac, etc) I was shocked to see that the first option was the 1-419 Clarges apartment I used to rent from LC and sure enough in the description was "We at London Connection believe that comfort, location, standard, and charm are the components which weave together to create the perfect vacation rental. Our team has just completed what we consider to be the ideal one-bedroom London flat. It is the penthouse in a restored early Victorian building.."

Then I clicked on Show Prices and I saw that it was not available through 12/2021 so I thought it might be an old ad. Then I clicked on See more properties (under About the Owner) and was directed to a screen which showed the 3 LC properties: this Clarges St one, 2-126 Reeves Mews, and 2-45 Grosvenor St with the last two being available from April 2021 onward. This doesn't appear to be an old ad.....

They are all listed as
London C has 3 rentals in London
Here are the vacation rentals currently offered by London C. Contact the owner for more information about a specific property.
Languages spoken:
English, Spanish
Member on: FlipKey
Listed since :Jun 2019

What do you'all think about this?

Judith

Posted by
1862 posts

Judith, 2-126 Reeves Mews was the address of the flat I was supposed to have rented in September before I got the notice of dissolution. Out of curiosity I've sent this message to the owners via Trip Advisor;

This is the apartment I was supposed to rent in September. Who are the
owners of London C? Is there any connection between it and the former
London Connection out of Utah that sent out notices of dissolution a
few months ago?

I'll report back if I get a response.

Posted by
9 posts

The Clarges St. apt. on the 4th floor is the one I discussed in my 06/08/20 post. It's very nice. I rented the apt. above the one on Grosvenor from LC a couple of years ago. Eager to what you learn.

Posted by
3 posts

Wow is that shady! Back at trying to rent to unsuspecting people. We had tried to rent one of the units posted above. I hope Utah is able to do something to these crocks!

Posted by
1 posts

Hello all,
I have been following this site for a while, and it encouraged me to ask my credit card (First National Bank of Omaha) for a refund. Received such a few days ago. We also stayed at the Clargis street flata (units 2 and 3) over the years. Thanks you all!
MSB, Vancouver, WA

Posted by
1862 posts

2-126 Reeves Mews was the address of the flat I was supposed to have
rented in September before I got the notice of dissolution. Out of
curiosity I've sent this message to the owners via Trip Advisor;

This is the apartment I was supposed to rent in September. Who are the
owners of London C? Is there any connection between it and the former
London Connection out of Utah that sent out notices of dissolution a
few months ago?

I'll report back if I get a response.

Reporting back. I sent that message on August 11 and didn't get a response, just in case my message never made it through, I sent it again on the 14th and still have not received a response. On the Trip Advisor website it does say that London C typically responds within a few hours.

Posted by
24 posts

Out of curiosity, I looked at the "London C" property write-ups on TripAdvisor. All three property write-ups actually refer to "London Connection" (not "London C") as the proprietor.

Those who have filed complaints with the State of Utah might want to update their filings by pointing out that the Moores appear to be back in business at the same old stand. They might point out to the State that prompt enforcement action could prevent further harm to the public, not just redress or punish past harm. This is important to consumer protection officials.

Posted by
18 posts

Hello all,
Reporting back to update.......we received our deposit credited back to our credit card account in mid-May. The claim is now resolved, because London Connection did not contest or respond to our dispute within the 60-calendar-day period, which ended in mid-July.

Grateful to all of you who offered suggestions and commiserated with everyone undergoing this confusing and stressful ordeal. While this was an unfortunate experience, it was nice to know we weren't alone in this.

I have also filed an official complaint with the State of Utah Consumer Protection office and will keep following up with the investigator as needed.

Amazed to see a few of the LC apartments offered for rent on TripAdvisor...what in the world?!?!

Posted by
9 posts

I've emailed Dave Christensen, to request that the person handling Phase II of the investigation read the Forum pages after those I snail-mailed to him, i.e. the 40+ ending on 7/14/20. The Utah authorities need to know about the newly offered LC rentals in London. Those of you who have the technology can probably send them to Utah via the Internet. My consumer complaint # is 120245. I don't know if we all received the same # for the London Connection matter. Thank heavens for our credit cards. Susan

Posted by
4 posts

I post to confirm that my bank has finalized my request for a reimbursement to my credit card for our London reservation to Maddox Street in December. It was a lengthy process over a period of three weeks. So that's done.
During this lengthy period, I has some legal friends review the London Connection's Articles of Dissolution and they found that the documents were filed by an established law firm who also managed the company's legal affairs after dissolving the LLC. So there is little doubt about the legality and finality of the dissolution. So that's done.
I found several sources for the business rating of London Connection. The BBB gives the company high marks until this company closure. There don't seem to be any illegal or suspicious transactions brought against LC over the past many years, and I have been curiously searching.
The Moores are apparently a highly respected and philanthropic family as I have found documented in newspaper articles and three published biographies. And of course social media. I am comfortable about who they are and have been for many years that I have stayed in their London properties.
In my view, this all points to London Connection being an unfortunate victim of an uncertain economy and Covid-19, and there doesn't seem to be anything nefarious beyond that.
It appears to me that personal attacks and a noticeable sense of vendetta weaken our position before the State of Utah and the media. They will certainly contact the legal firm handling the case and determine what action to take if any. Let us now focus on helping those who have yet to finalize their refunds, as many of us are now starting to get them, through banks or travel insurance.
We have all struggled through this, but I think we are about there.

Phillip

Posted by
7919 posts

Phillip, the point is the Moore’s did not refund the money. They kept it.

Posted by
25742 posts

Philip's post is so similar to the last - removed - defender. Even similar words.

Posted by
938 posts

At this point I believe there is little dissent by those robbed of their funds. The egregious behavior by the Moore's of London Connections is out there for the world to see. They willfully continued to advertise, solicit down payments with false promises of secure cancellations, and accept final payments along with promising future stays in lieu of returned payment when they had to know those future stays would not occur since they also had not been paying the lessors of the apartments. There are no excuses adequate to explain their behavior which many now find lacking in integrity, without merit, and immoral.

Posted by
2588 posts

Bernie Madoff was a pillar of his community, had impeccable credentials, was philanthropic and had much positive press... until he didn't.

Posted by
346 posts

Am baffled by Philips post. New first time poster. So random and out of kilter.

What's the agenda here? What's the point? Its clear from the thread what's been going on. Making the post so suspicious.

Posted by
24 posts

"Philip" -- Where and how did you obtain a copy of the Articles of Dissolution? Please post it here, so others can be reassured by reading the document for themselves.

Posted by
4 posts

Good morning all.

As far as any previous post that had been removed here. I didn’t see any posts here defending the Moores when I was following the thread (I am not necessarily defending them either, I just don’t see a reason for outrage, personally).

I came here to post after searching for information about London Connection and its ownership – I could see the forums here after getting google results about LC, and read them without registering. When I received my money from my bank, I thought I would register here so I could chime in about my experience – and hopefully assure people that there are ways to get our funds back. I understand people are upset, but it’s no reason to accuse me of being ‘suspicious’. I suppose people are entitled to their beliefs :-)

As I mentioned, I have never had a bad experience in the past booking with LC. Quite to the contrary. I am sad to see that option gone for me. And I could not find other negative comments about the company or its owners in all my amateur internet sleuthing. In fact, most of what I found was people raving about the great times they had in London at the LC properties.

While I didn’t feel the need to officially retain legal help, I did ask some friends who were attorneys if they could look into things without putting in too much time. One of them did some research as a favor, and said that the firm representing the Moores was reputable, and that he was sure everything was done legally and that the LLC was officially dissolved, and there was no indication of a continuation of the same business under a different LLC or similar as far as he could see. I am sure LC used all the capital they had to try and outlast the virus, as they surely have weathered recessions and other hardships in the past, but in the end, COVID-19 proved too big a blow and the LLC had to dissolve under the weight of it all.

He is the one who advised me to continue to work with my bank. He also said that people who booked through VRBO or similar could seek possible redress there as well, since those services often keep the money for rental properties until after guests have completed their stay.

Again, I understand that people are upset. I was too. You can choose to be upset at the LC and its previous owners if you like, but I feel it is a waste of time and energy that can be spent more constructively than chasing after a company/person that, as far as I can see, was forced to close due to a once-in-a lifetime pandemic and resulting financial crunch. I wish you all the best!

Phillip

Posted by
4 posts

Neuhoftraveler - No need to use quotes. My name is indeed Phillip - I never saw the articles myself. My lawyer friend, whom I trust, said he checked and everything checked out. That was good enough for me. I understand if it isn't for you.

Posted by
2588 posts

Phillip--

I have no dog in this fight as I have never done business with London Connection. You seem like a smart, well-spoken guy. So...

  1. You have to know that it is suspicious for a first time poster to pop on a thread like this and write a post that is diametrically different from scores of upstream posts on the thread. I hope you can use some of your calm reason to acknowledge that one is either oblivious or disingenuous to make the statement, "I understand people are upset, but it’s no reason to accuse me of being ‘suspicious.'"

  2. You know that anybody can say anything on the internet. Further, you know that a reference to knowledge that is not public knowledge without supporting verifiable evidence is suspect, particularly when London Connection still shows as an "Active" business on Utah's corporation search website (though, granted, it takes time for legal proceedings to be finalized and there may be delay in the status being changed on that website).

  3. You know that the statement "I am not necessarily defending them either" is patently false when your original post included "The Moores are apparently a highly respected and philanthropic family as I have found documented in newspaper articles and three published biographies. And of course social media."

  4. You know that it seems outside the definition of good character for a business owner to challenge charge backs on services that could not be delivered because the company is filing Articles of Dissolution (see Julie's experience above).

  5. You know that it seems outside the definition of good character for a business owner to shoot out an e-mail about going bust and then go "radio silent" afterward, taking down websites, disconnecting phones, and not responding to e-mail (see multiple posts above).

I agree that the biggest concern is for people to get refunds, but it is also important for a very thorough investigation to be done with respect to the way the Moores wound down London Connection. Toward that end, consumers need to continue to network through threads like this and to push the Utah regulators/investigators to act with due diligence.

Posted by
4 posts

David

Apologies if I came across as insensitive or oblivious. I understand people’s misgivings, and agree fully With the authorities in Utah fully investigating and acting on any illegal activity that might have occurred. I was just stating that I don’t see any smoking gun to support anything illegal on the part of LC, and found the tone of this forum a little quick to make assumptions. Like I said, it’s everyone’s prerogative to pick at it, but I’ve said my peace and genuinely wish everyone well.

Phillip

Posted by
2 posts

As a longstanding LC client I have followed this thread with interest. The Moores have probably been doing likewise albeit with quite a different perspective.

Mainly because of the good locations, from 2014, I stayed in LC apartments five times. In December 2019, I made a sixth booking for a week in July 2020 for the penthouse in Reeves Mews. Five days after the booking was confirmed, LC emailed casually offering an “upgrade”. For me it was in fact a downgrade to a slightly bigger, but much less-appealing apartment on a lower floor. When I declined the “upgrade", I received a hostile email from Mr Moore Jnr and a month was suddenly blocked off on the booking calendar for the penthouse which swallowed up my reservation, effectively cancelling it. I was told this period was for “remodelling" work. When I asked why an apartment newly renovated 18 months prior was being remodelled at the height of the tourist season, Mr Moore Jnr offered no explanation but attacked me personally. In a firmly worded email, I asked for a refund which I received. This happened over the Christmas/New Year period which was stressful but in hindsight, I was at least spared the frustrations and problems that so many contributors here have unfortunately had in recovering their money.

I also took the matter up with Mr Moore III (Snr) but didn’t receive an apology, just much disingenuous posturing about LC being a family business. His words were surprisingly similar in tone to those used to extol the Moore family's virtues in the first of Phillip of Utah’s posts above.

What’s hard to understand in this debacle is the general silence of the leasehold owners of the approximately 20 properties from whom LC in turn leased their apartments in London. If these leases were broken, which is what the legal dissolution would normally entail, the inconvenience and loss to the leasehold owners while issues were resolved would have been considerable.

Even taking Phillip of Utah’s claim as to who he says he is at face value, a number of his comments rang alarm bells including:

" - And I could not find other negative comments about the company or its owners in all my amateur internet sleuthing."

Unlike his research into the Moore’s philanthropy and biographies, clearly his sleuthing here was not sufficiently thorough to find the hard-to-miss negative reviews on Tripadvisor. Mine was titled ‘London Disconnection’. (If you’d like to read it, a Google search using those words should take you to it.)

Phillip of Utah’s carefully crafted comments seem to be aimed at ruling a line across LC’s past misdeeds in its wholesale disregard of the interests of its clients. Many who booked with LC have at last been able to recover their money in processes that, according to numerous posts on this thread, have been lengthy and arduous. The degree of stress that this has doubtless caused clients who paid deposits in good faith is immeasurable. And, unconscionable.

Hopefully views such as those of Phillip of Utah do not result in LC being able to start afresh with a newly cleaned slate and the Utah regulatory authorities will do all in their power to prevent any possibility of this.

Posted by
56 posts

Dear Forum,

I'm happy to report that Citibank just resolved my LC dispute (second time around) in my favor. Best wishes to all who are still waiting.

Julie

Posted by
2588 posts

Congrats, Julie. Glad to hear you had success!

Posted by
9793 posts

I have not read this entire thread so someone may have mentioned this.

As I'm writng this, my response is the 207th one. I wonder what the record is for number of responses on the Rick Steves Forum?

Posted by
56 posts

Frank II,

Just a guess, but I'm thinking that comfortable shoes for women would compete!

Posted by
1862 posts

As I'm writng this, my response is the 207th one. I wonder what the
record is for number of responses on the Rick Steves Forum?

Are you talking about the England page or the overall forum? Nigel has Travelling Through the Alphabet going right now and it's over 700 responses.

Posted by
2 posts

It’s to be hoped that the minimal activity on this thread in the past 4 weeks (since my post on LC’s management practices) is only because the wheels of justice are quietly turning in the background as a result of all the evidence in the posts here to ensure that those who ran the company can never engage in any of the same behaviour again.

Posted by
9776 posts

Cap One refunded our substantial deposit. First time we have ever had to ask for such a thing.

Posted by
557 posts

Sheesh what a mess! I’m so sorry to hear all this. We had a good experience with them in 2019. Such a shame... I hope you all are successful in getting money back.

@Allan the Reeves Mews apartment is where we stayed. It was lovely, bright and light, nicely furnished, spacious and in great condition. There were five of us and we had plenty of room. While it was centrally located, it was a few blocks off the beaten path for our taste. The Audley, a local pub across the street, closed just weeks before we arrived. There is a Richoux across the street which was a great daily breakfast spot. Other than that, pubs, coffee shops and restaurants were several blocks away. We ran a pretty tight itinerary during the day so we had hoped to “fall into a local” at the end of our long days and it didn’t quite work out like that. This part of Mayfair is very pretty but not super convenient. Hope this helps! Let me know if you have any other questions about the area for a future stay you might have.

Posted by
24 posts

Just a a footnote to CaliMom's comments about the Reeves Mews neighborhood: This is one of, perhaps the, most elegant neighborhood in one of London's most elegant residential districts, dominated to some extent by the former US Embassy in Grosvenor Square. With all respect to CaliMom, there are plenty of restaurants in the immediate area -- but it's true they are not at the coffee-shop or pub level. At least six of London's world-class (and most expensive) restaurants are within about three blocks of Reeves Mews (Le Gavroche, Scott's, The Greenhouse, Alain Ducasse, Helene Darroze, Jean-Georges, I could go on. The shops and galleries in Audley Street are varied and interesting. Whether the neighborhood is right for you depends on precisely what you're looking for.

Posted by
1862 posts

Thanks for the info CaliMom, two years ago we stayed in Covent Garden and loved it. This trip we had decided to try a less lively neighbourhood but we were wondering if we'd regret it. Once we reschedule we'll rethink our priorities.

Posted by
3 posts

I loved the Reeves Mews flat and neighborhood very much. 10 minute walk to Bond Street tube station. There are plenty of great places close by, Popina and Mercato Mayfair were my favorites. Very close to Oxford Street. Marks and Spencer on Oxford for food shopping is less than a mile away. There is a Waitrose about a mile away. Nice parks close by, Hyde Park about 10 minute walk. Quiet neighborhood compared to Covent Garden. I like both neighborhoods. Just depends what you are looking for. I was booked to stay in Mayfair again this year. Hopefully we will all be able to travel again very soon.

Posted by
3 posts

To reply to Mac's post.
I am one of the property owners in London (and maybe one of the few that landed on this blog) and I share your frustration (and that of many others). I have posted my experience before. I am resigned to never recover the $20,000 usd for unpaid rent and damages. I explored legal actions from London but realised that chasing LC in Utah wasn't worth the legal costs. Sometimes that is how things go.

I do not blame LC for running out of business but I do blame them for having taken advantage of both property owners and guests. Reading the blog it is clear that they kept rental fees and deposits while they also stopped paying the rent to the owners - It looks like they will get away with this but I hope they feel ashamed, at least.

Posted by
7474 posts

It looks like they will get away with this but I hope they feel ashamed, at least.

From the perspective of MSCP and the property owners it does look like they will 'get away with it, because of the cost of legal fees.

As for the Moores feeling ashamed, I think it is more likely Satan has ice water.

Posted by
24 posts

TO MSCP -- I've left a private message for you in the "Received Messages" box under your account on this Forum. Would you be so good as to take a look and, I hope, respond?

Looking forward to your response.

Posted by
1 posts

I came across this thread last month, from a Rick Steves email, and started reading it because we stayed in a London Connection apartment a couple summers ago. I got sucked in, and read pretty much the entire thread.

What seemed odd to me was how quickly they shut down LC operations after COVID-19 quarantines began. Back in March and early April it seemed everyone thought it would only last a couple months, maybe into the summer at worst. And they “filed for dissolution” on April 2? Why would they give up so quickly?

I started following the Instagram account (tmooreIII) of Thomas Moore Sr. He and his wife were in Europe from January 12 to March 14, and he posted that he was on the last Delta flight from Heathrow to Salt Lake City. He stated that they would return to London from August 15 to September 15 (they did not go, however). Now a few days ago he posted “I will be back in the spring, once this COVID-19 has been controlled.”

His last weeks in London were spent staying at the Clarges Street flat in Mayfair which appears packed to the gills with framed artwork, porcelain pieces, antique rugs and furniture. He called it their “home sweet home in London.” He also said “Stephanie and I are staying in a different London Connection flat… on Clarges Street in Mayfair” so there must be another property where they usually stay.

In the weeks before they left London, he was working on finishing renovations on a new flat in Holland Park Mews, which he was filling with art and furniture and a big TV to prepare it for renting. It appeared to be almost ready for renting, and he said “Holland Park is beautiful. Visitors will be very comfortable here.” He seemed to really have a passion for searching out antiques to fill the properties.

On February 27 they took “the London Connection team” to a concert and dinner, and posted a picture with six people plus him and his wife.

I guess all this is to express my confusion on why they would shut down so quickly, giving up on decades of a successful business model. Even though they apparently did not own all of the properties, they must have owned some of them. Makes me wonder if these flats are sitting there in London, full of art and antiques and knickknacks, empty and unused.

While I didn’t personally lose any money to London Connection, in an indirect way, we ALL do as the tens-of-thousands of dollars collected by LC, and refunded by banks/credit card companies, eventually get passed on to all bank customers. Meanwhile LC kept all those deposits, continues to own properties, including homes, cabins and office buildings in Utah.

I’m curious to know if LC has actually filed for dissolution of their business, or if any news media has published a story about this deception. I did some online searching, and didn’t find anything, but know some on this thread were reaching out to media.

Posted by
24 posts

FWIW, as of this morning, the State of Utah Division of Corporations Business Entity Search website shows both The London Connection, Limited Company and Connections Management Group, Inc. with active registrations. Renewals are due Jan. 31, 2021. Each entry includes an unclear paragraph that may mean renewal applications have already been filed.

This can be checked by anyone, any time, without charge, at secure.utah.gov/bes.

Can any of those who were pursuing this with the Utah consumer protection authority provide a status report?

Posted by
7 posts

A quick update on our attempts to recover money we'd paid to London Connection for flat rentals that LC involuntarily cancelled due to its alleged "dissolution" . . . after submitting substantial paperwork, both Chase and Barclay's ultimately ruled in our favor and reversed the three payments we'd made to LC. Upon our inquiry, we were told that we prevailed because LC did not respond to our billing disputes. Although we are pleased that we got our money back, we are still quite upset over the unethical conduct of LC's owners, the Moore father-son team. Through their scheme, they were able to keep the rental and deposit payments we'd made for cancelled bookings (without sending those amounts to the affected landlords per one of the flat owner's previous posts) and shift financial responsibility to refund those payments to our credit card companies. Perhaps the most galling aspect in all this is father Moore's constant boasting on Facebook of his valuable antiques and collectibles, his wife's priceless jewelry collection, and the family's numerous properties in Utah. No shame!!!!

UPDATE:

We’ve received a full refund from our CC company, AMEX. VRBO did not help, as the travel insurance we purchased through them did not cover this loss. Actually, you’d be surprised about what the travel insurance doesn’t cover! This was a long process and a real shame that London Connection just vanished into thin air. Disgraceful business practices!

Posted by
1862 posts

Actually, you’d be surprised about what the travel insurance doesn’t
cover!

I may have posted this comment previously but I've long since stopped being surprised by what insurance doesn't over. I checked with my credit card insurance soon after starting this post. I was told I was only covered if I showed up on the doorstep of the apartment and found myself locked out and then I could file a claim. I was on my own until then. Luckily my CC did reimburse me through normal non-insured methods.

Posted by
24 posts

Allan,

You're certainly right about the surprising scope of insurance exclusions generally (which seem to be anything the insurer has ever previously had to pay out on). But with all respect, despite what you were told, I question whether actually showing up on the doorstep would be recognized by any court as prerequisite to a claim when the lessor (or sub-lessor) informs the lessee in "writing" that the keys will not be turned over and the deposit will be forfeited. That would be inconsistent with everything I remember from Contracts I in law school. (Of course, an insurance contract could be written expressly to require it, but that seems unlikely to me.)
Sounds to me like just another attempt to scare off claimants. If anyone ever is confronted with such a supposed defense, just escalate.

Posted by
7474 posts

I once had someone tell me the first paragraph of an insurance policy states what is covered. The next 10-20 pages list what is not covered.

Good to see folks are having success with refunds from their credit card company. Hopefully Visa, MC, Amex etc., get together and pursue the scoundrels.

Posted by
1 posts

I just discovered this forum and have read through many of the comments. I stayed with London Connection for Christmas in 2018 and had a great experience. Was scheduled to stay in London again this past June and paid a deposit. Like others, I received the letter about dissolution and that I would be receiving a refund of my deposit. Since I never heard back I assumed that the money was gone. Reading about some successes with CC companies, I'll give it a try. I guess the first step is to file a dispute with London Connection. Not sure if it's too late.

Such a shame - I had a very good experience with them.

Allan,

You will not hear back from anyone at London Connection. Not via phone, email, text or WhatsApp. Send the messages to cover yourself but immediately contact your CC company to get your deposit back.

L Smith

Posted by
1862 posts

Hi Lisa, my CC reimbursed me in May. Slowly but surely others on this post have been getting positive results from their CC companies. I've never heard feedback from people who had filed with the State. Did anyone get feedback behind that they were looking into it?

Posted by
18 posts

Like many others, I filed a complaint with the Utah Division of Consumer Protection several months ago.

Last thing I heard from the assigned investigator (in August 2020), was that they were adding the case to their list of investigations, and would contact me when they actually start the investigation. I haven't heard any updates yet, so recently emailed investigator for a status check.

Meanwhile, the good news is....Bank of America did reimburse us for our LC deposit! :)

Has anyone else who filed a complaint with Utah Div. of Consumer Protection heard back from the investigators?

Posted by
9 posts

I sent everything to the Utah agency via snail mail last summer. Never heard anything back. Not surprised.