Hello Friends,
Husband and I are going on our first trip abroad in May. We have fifteen days flying in and out of Heathrow. Here is the list of what I want to see the most:
Any suggestions on how to order this? I map this out and just seems like a lot of back tracking.
There’s no magic way to make this trip make sense without a lot of backtracking, because you have selected places that are widely spaced across the UK - while missing out many great areas in between.
A few thoughts: Brighton isn’t really all that, and if you do want to do it, best as a day trip by train from London (are you spending some time in London as part of the trip?)
The Cotswolds (not Cotswold, singular) is a very large area, not a single place to visit.
The Lost Gardens of Heligan are way down in Cornwall, a looong drive at the best of times. And if your trip happens to coincide with the late May school holiday week then the traffic can be extremely heavy. Also, to get to Cornwall, you would be driving through gorgeous Dorset and Devon, full of stunning scenery and lovely villages, and missing it all because you’d probably be sticking to the faster roads. Would you, for example, consider dropping the overrated Cotswolds in favour of Dorset? Similarly full of cute villages but somehow there’s this idea amongst overseas tourists that the Cotswolds is the only place like it in the UK.
Alternatively find another of the UK’s gazillions of lovely gardens that make more sense with the rest of your trip - such as in the Cotswolds: Hidcote or Snowshill for example.
I don’t know Wales at all.
York is lovely and well worth it. Although there are many other lovely cathedral cities in England.
You might take a train from London to York, sightsee there then pick up a rental car, do your North Wales and Cotswolds thing. Those could work in a big circle.
Cornwall is an absolute outlier - unless you replace the Cotswolds with Dorset and Devon, and choose somewhere like Salisbury or Winchester as your cathedral city instead of York. Or maybe lovely Oxford.
We can’t magically change UK geography but I can assure you that for everything on your list, there are alternative areas that are just as lovely and might make more geographical sense.
Thank you for your well thought out points. My husband has requested no churches, no museums, and no London. Yes, we are taking the train from London to York.
We were planning on driving the Jurassic Coast from Travistock to Brighton, but maybe we should replace the Cotswolds with Dorset. My goal was to walk from village to village and pretend I was a hobbit on holiday in the Shire. Is Dorset a good place to do that?
You said Brighton was not all that. I was intersted in the LGBTQAI+ community, vegan food, and short commuite to the airport for our 3:30 pm flight. Do you have suggestions of other exciting LGBTQIA+ cities or places to stay with an easy commute to the airport.
Lost Garden of Heligan is my bucket list. I want to see that Giant's head. I have rain gear, I don't care. We will be there May 19th I think. Is that a school holiday weekend?
You said Brighton was not all that. I was intersted in the LGBTQAI+ community, vegan food, and short commuite to the airport for our 3:30 pm flight.
Ah, in that case Brighton is perfect. It’s when people here say they want to go there for the beach that I worry, because the beach is disappointing. It’s a big blowsy resort with lots of stag and hen parties - but it is also probably the town with the biggest gay population outside of London. And if you’re flying from Gatwick it makes sense.
There is no Jurassic coast road all the way from Tavistock (not Travistock) to Brighton. There is a lovely bit of coast road in Dorset - and specifically the little bit of B road between Bridport and Weymouth is stunning.
But for the most part the road is slightly inland, and the stretch from the New Forest (kind of Bournemouth area) to Brighton is busy multi lane tarmac. You’d be driving on the motorway past the big conurbation of Southampton/Portsmouth. There’s a little glimpse of some sea just near Portsmouth for a couple of minutes. Then the very very busy A27 to Brighton.
19th May isn’t school holidays. Read up on Dorset and Devon and see if any of the towns and villages you’d have to zoom past on the way to Heligan pique your interest.
If your husband doesn’t want churches and museums, why York?
When you say exciting LGBT cities are you looking for nightlife or? Brighton does have a large community but as a casual visitor I don’t think you will feel much excitement unless you want to go to a nightclub or something like that. Maybe I’m just old!
Bristol, where I live, has a lot of vegan restaurants and is known for being a slightly alternative city a bit like Brighton. It’s a much larger city than Brighton so obviously it’s not everywhere but there are areas that you would find interesting. There are a lot of LGBT people living here but I wouldn’t know about any particular scene that you might find.
Oh yes! Bristol is a very good shout as an alternative to Brighton, that would also fit better with Wales, the Cotswolds and Cornwall. Very much a hipster and gay-friendly place, easy to find vegan food.
I'm guessing that given you know your flight times that you have already booked them? If not, it would make more sense to fly into Manchester rather than London. You can get a direct train from the airport to York so would be there much more quickly and cheaply )and your husband would avoid having to go through London!).
As others have said I would plan your route as it's laid out but drop the Cotswolds for Dorset or Devon and Brighton for Bristol.
A car is no use in York and you could leave there by train to North Wales easily and then pick up a car in Llandudno Junction, next to Conwy. Make sure that you visit Bodnant Gardens whilst in the area - they will look wonderful in May.
You can then make your way steadily south through Wales and end up over the Severn Bridge in Bristol. Just as alternative as Brighton but more overall tourist interest in my view.
I would then drive down to Cornwall for Helicon (and the many other gardens in the area). Then work your way back through Devon and Dorset towards Gatwick and your return.
Wow! First trip abroad and no London, no churches, no museums. You short change yourself with that model.
Wow, again thanks you so much to everyone. Lot of helpful ideas.
Why York? I really love the Vikings and this is a Viking city. My friend is from their and her family will show us around, Betty's for tea. Watchman's walking tour. Shambles. Food. Ghosts. The pretty train ride.
Thanks for the feedback about the lack of Jurassic coast road. I thought it would be like Highway 101 on the Pacific Coast. that puts a damper in that plan. My husband is from Texas so long drives don't bother us, but we don't want to waste our time on slogs.
When you say exciting LGBT cities are you looking for nightlife or? Brighton does have a large community but as a casual visitor I don’t think you will feel much excitement unless you want to go to a nightclub or something like that. Maybe I’m just old!
I am old too! Not much for loud night life, although live music is nice. When we went to San Fransisco we did a walking tour of the Castro district, the traditional Gay neighborhood, and really enjoyed the sense of community there. Is there a gay or lesbian neighborhood of Bristol that would have that feel? Lots of queer owned business and such?
Yes plan tickets are booked. I did look at flying into other cities, but could not find a direct flight which was important to my partner.
As others have said I would plan your route as it's laid out but drop
the Cotswolds for Dorset or Devon and Brighton for Bristol.
Should I drop the Cotswolds even if I am not doing Brighton? It does make a nice cresent shape with no back tracking. I need to do more research on Dorset and Devon.
Wow! First trip abroad and no London, no churches, no museums. You
short change yourself with that model.
Wow you are right. Spending 15 days rambling around, eating great food, visiting cute towns, window shopping, spending time in nature, hiking, and seeing all the gardens I can muster sounds like a terrible time. I should just go to one of the biggest cities in the world, completely overwhelm my partner and have him shut down, then drag him to a bunch of places with stolen artifacts, stolen history, stolen lives, because a stranger on the internet said I was short changing myself.
I want to second the Bodnant Garden suggestion. It is lovely (as are the Lost Gardens of Heligan). You might also want to check out The Eden Project, which isn't far from the Lost Gardens of Heligan. All three of those are quite large; it takes hours to see each one.
The English gardens are the prettiest I've seen in Europe. Once you have your basic route pinned down, I'm sure others can suggest additional convenient garden options. I've never had a rented car in Europe, so I haven't always been able to reach the places I've read about easily enough for them to make sense for me.
Two smaller gardens I enjoyed in Dorset were Compton Acres east of Poole and Abbotsbury Subtropical Gardens west of Weymouth. If you are passing through those areas and have a bit of time, they're worth a look. I'm sure with a car you'll have access to more spectacular places.
I traveled through southern Dorset and Devon on my way to Cornwall in 2017. At one of my B&Bs there was an Englishman walking the coastal path in segments. He was able to use the local coastal bus to get to and from his starting and stopping points each day. Perhaps that would work for you.
I thought it would be like Highway 101 on the Pacific Coast. that puts a damper in that plan.
I’m glad I told you! Oh my gosh, you’d be so disappointed. I live in the far west of Devon, nearly Cornwall, and have family in Portsmouth, so I drive that road a lot, and it’s pretty much a chore unless I have time to do that little bit of the Jurassic Coast en route* or maybe divert into Lyme Regis or Charmouth, find (and pay for) a parking space, then walk to the beach. The point about the main roads along the south coast is you would keep having to drive off the main road into towns and villages to see nice scenery, and then get back to the main road again, and that is extremely time consuming.
The Cotswolds definitely could work if you’re doing a York/Wales/Bristol/Devon/Cornwall swing. Just be aware when you’re looking at roadmaps that England is a congested, densely populated country. Road trips aren’t really a thing we do for pleasure here due to the fact that driving can take so much concentration (I’ve driven a lot in America and it’s like an entirely different activity). So you will need to leave yourself plenty of time if you want to get off the main roads and explore.
I seem to remember from another thread that you were interested in Dartmoor. That would certainly be something you could do en route to Cornwall - you could get off the A roads and choose the B road that goes across the moor, and that actually would give you a lovely scenic drive albeit not coastal. 40mph limit, though, and sheep and ponies all over the road…
*this the B3157 between Bridport and Weymouth. It is absolutely stunning but it is just a few short miles and about 25 minutes of an otherwise vexing hours-long drive.
You’ve gotten a lot of great input - I am so impressed with the help we get from our UK residents. I know you have been doing this (after reading your previous post and answers), but it might be time to sit down and plot each day and driving distance between your stops - to be sure you have time for the wandering you are interested in. (I know in general your route, but didn’t stop to look specifically.) Everywhere you have listed is worthwhile but maybe not all is enjoyably possible in 2 weeks.
A general note about driving: I am also from Texas and think nothing of a 3 hr drive for lunch and then a 3 hr drive home on the same day. However, 3-4 hours a day is my personal max in England (and that distance not often) - because more concentration is required and therefore it is more tiring than here. I didn’t realize that when I planned our first trip. Whoever is driving is less able to actually see that lovely countryside.
I agree that either Brighton OR Cornwall is out of the way, depending on the route you wind up with. It sounds like Bristol might be a better and more convenient stop to approximate what you are looking for in Brighton, and would be more in your general path. Been to Brighton, not yet to Bristol.
I just got home from my 5th trip to the UK, a full week in London. It was a lot of fun, very interesting, and far easier than I expected. However, for my first 4 trips, I felt no need to include London. There is so much to see in so many areas! So choose what interests you and keep it relaxed! 😊
For Bristol, the Old Market Quarter is probably what you want. https://visitbristol.co.uk/shopping/old-market
http://www.oldmarketquarter.co.uk/
I’m a huge fan of Bristol. It’s a big, busy, arty multiracial city, and was the centre of the Black Lives Matter protest which pulled down the statue of slave trader Edward Colston.
Lots of great history along the waterfront, and even people who don’t like museums would surely enjoy SS Great Britain, an extremely interesting historic ship.
You’ve gotten a lot of great input - I am so impressed with the help
we get from our UK residents. I know you have been doing this (after
reading your previous post and answers), but it might be time to sit
down and plot each day and driving distance between your stops - to be
sure you have time for the wandering you are interested in.
TexasTravelmom you are very right. People here are so helpful. I read to my husband the advice on driving. There is a little does not compute wheel running but he trusts advice from those who have been there and will reduce driving. It was so cute.
Golden Girl thanks so much for the Bristol links. My husband is very excited to go there now. And I can wonder around and find Banksy art.
At one of my B&Bs there was an Englishman walking the coastal path in
segments. He was able to use the local coastal bus to get to and from
his starting and stopping points each day. Perhaps that would work for
you.
I will look into this.
Okay here is my itinerary based off advice here. I reserve the right to change my mind at least 4 more times. I need to make reservations soon.
day 15. A 2 or 3 hour drive from Dorset to Heathrow and then allowing an hour to take the car back with a 3 hour checkin for the flight is courageous.
Day 3 York to Conwy is 4 hours on the train, rather than 5. Driving might be 3 hours in theory and on a good day, but there's the Leeds ring road and, especially, Manchester to go round- both real congestion points if you get unlucky.
Day 13- hotel in Weymouth or Dorchester is what I would suggest.
For Corfe Castle the really obvious place to stay is Swanage.
On the last day I'm not sure that a 2 hour drive to Heathrow before a 3 hour check in and then a TA flight is the best of ideas. That drive would be better down the previous night, stay at Heathrow. What happens if there is congestion for some reason, you break down, or an RTA causes a motorway closure, on the morning. It fees risky, unless your flight is mid to late afternoon/early evening.
I’d pick up the car in York at the end of your trip there.
Some of your driving estimates are off. Take the journey I know best of yours, Bristol to Fowey. Via the beautiful but slow road across Dartmoor, is going to take a lot more than three hours, but it will be broken up with stops so not so bad. Bristol to Fowey is only three hours if you stick to the main roads and aren’t driving during busy times - eg, Google maps says three hours now, at nearly 11pm, sticking to major roads.
I’ll have a think about Devon and Dorset places to stay. A classic beautiful small town right on the Jurassic coast is Lyme Regis, just into Dorset from Devon. There is the SW Coast Path which allows you to walk the coast all around Devon, Cornwall and Dorset, so there are lovely walks.
Further into Dorset, there’s lots of lovely villages south of Dorchester and around.
Make sure you check your journey times for the time of day you’ll be doing any such drive, allowing for the time difference between where you are and the UK. And be aware that our roads snarl up easily. One lorry shedding its load and you’re going to miss your flight.
I especially love the “pretend I am a hobbit” plan. I will also be on the area in early May and am pondering 4 days in the same area of Wales…..
I agree that your final day is iffy unless you have an evening flight. But it sounds like you are nearly there!
Just have to urge you to break the 'no churches' rule even if it means leaving your husband outside. It would be real shame to be in York and not take the time to see the cathedral.
for others looking at day 15, I have seen up-thread that the flight is at 1530 at Heathrow.
to the airport for our 3:30 pm flight.
another reason for flexibility is that flights change more often than we would like. May is 6 months out.
for a first trip abroad for the two of you this will be a trip filled with wonders. You will have a great time.
Lost Garden of Heligan is my bucket list. I want to see that Giant's head. I have rain gear, I don't care. We will be there May 19th I think. Is that a school holiday weekend?
that isn't a school holiday
dates vary a little around the country and public schools are often slightly different to state schools but in general in May
Early May Bank holiday: Monday 6 May.
Half term holiday: Monday 27 May to Friday 31 May.
When going from York to north Wales, Chester is worth a look. https://www.visitcheshire.com/chester
When going from Brecon Beacons area to Bristol - go via A40 to Raglan (don’t go via Pontypool on A4042), See Raglan Castle and then take A449 expressway down to M4 (like an interstate) east of Newport. (That’s assuming you are not going to The Cotswolds).
I would not spend to whole days seeing Bristol - although you could say in the same hotel. Spend 1 of those days seeing nearby Bath - which is only 15 minutes away by train - or you could drive.https://visitbath.co.uk
The best part of the Dorset coast in my opinion is Lulworth Cove & nearby Durdle Dor. https://lulworth.com/visit/places-to-visit/lulworth-cove/
Be sure to look at Google Maps/Streetview to see the kind of roads you will be travelling on. I have set traffic enabled on this map but that will be at the time you view it - which may be nighttime in the UK.
I wouldn't be too concerned about day 15 and I'm very risk averse! As long as the OP leaves early they should be able to make Heathrow for midday. There won't be any time for stopping off in the New Forest to go exploring and they will need to be mindful of the bottleneck in Lyndhurst but it should be pretty uneventful on the M27 and M3. The M25 is anyone's guess so if it was me I'd be looking at leaving around 07:00 and if I get to the airport early then so be it.
Thank you all again. I feel like I have a lot more logical and doable plan and I don't feel so overwhelmed.
A video just popped up that went through Cheddar, Wells, Glastonbury, and Exmoor. I think I am going to make a new post.
Geographically it’s starting to make a lot more sense.
There’s a lot of driving so make sure you have properly mapped your routes according to the time you’re driving, and I would thoroughly investigate exactly where you’re going to park in places like Bristol and Cardiff.
I don’t know Wales very well but I do know that Merthyr Tydfil isn’t anyone’s definition of a cute or quaint town. It’s the biggest of the Valleys town, in a blighted former coal-mining area. The landscapes are dramatic... It’s great that you’re spending money there and its location makes it an excellent hub, but just be aware of the history and current state of this part of Wales.
This is a pretty good itinerary now and some slightly unusual places to visit (for this forum) which is nice to see, especially Merthyr Tydfil. It really is a great location on the Heads of the Valleys Road, having been there fairly recently Merthyr has had quite a bit of money spent on the town, and is rather smarter than it was, although it is never going to win any rewards for cuteness. But a bit of out of the box thinking. And pleased that you are going up to Windsor on Day 14, not leaving that journey to the fates of chance on the last day. And made a virtue out of it with a splurge hotel for the last night.
The Hotel in Merthyr Tydfil had a lot of really good reviews on Trip Advisor, and was a great price. It is easy access from the A470 and right on the border of Brecon Beacon. I honestly didn't look much beyond that, except I saw a tattoo parlor next door and thought that was good sign. I hope people will worn me if we are doing something stupid or dangerous, but honestly we are just look for a place to grab dinner and sleep so we can spend time hiking. We are really hoping for clear weather so we can stargaze in Brecon Beacon.
there are no safety issues in staying in Merthyr, unless you were considering doing a spot of drug dealing whilst there - you will be fine. It's just not a place on anyone's obvious tourist route, like many, many other places in the UK where we all live and work.
Brooks Guesthouse in Bristol is in an excellent place but you will need to make a plan about parking assuming they don't have their own. I would ask them for advice.
Hey friends, I am back. Is A39 from Bristol to Port Issac a pretty drive akin to driving down HWY 101 in the states? I know it will be a long drive. Would you consider this drive a sight or just a way to get from point a to point b?
. Is A39 from Bristol to Port Issac a pretty drive akin to driving down HWY 101 in the states?
It’s not really like Highway 101. In parts it’s pretty nice and has been branded the Atlantic Highway. You can see the sea over in the distance for much of it - but in order to actually get to the coast and see the pretty towns and villages, you’d have to keep turning off the main road.
It’s also extremely busy at certain times of the year. Nightmare on an August Friday for example.
I wouldn’t call it an attraction in itself as it’s a very major road rather than a picturesque crawl right along the coast.
As I’ve said before, the concept of a road trip being an attraction in itself is not a big thing in the crowded south of the UK.
On your other post where I was suggesting an overnight stay on route to Fowey in Dunster or Lynton/Lynmouth part of the reason for that, was to build in the best (as in most scenic) part of the A39 as well as Exmoor. Both being very attractive villages which should really be stops IMO if you were doing it as a through route. The problem in some ways with doing the A39 as a through route in one day is that you wouldn't have time to see many of the sights and villages which make the road. Quite a few of those, as Golden Girl says, are deviations off the main route (the same as the NC500 in Scotland).
I always thought the point of a road trip in the US sense was not speed, but seeing what was on route. To me, in that style, that would be more of a 3 or even 4 day trip to fully appreciate it.
The part of the A39 I haven't done is Bideford to Camelford so I can't talk about that section, until February when I am meant to be that way. But one of the suggested deviations, just before Camelford (and then Port Isaac), is Tintagel. Boscastle (on that deviation) being as far along the A39 route as I have been coming up through Cornwall.
I say I mean to be there as I am in Deon/Cornwall for work reasons with a stay in Bude as a spur from where I need to be. How I get to Bude depends on other circumstances, so it is trying to fit in an A39 diversion.
I would get to Port Isaac via the quickest route and then focus on spending time there. You won’t see much on a road trip without stopping and there’s so much to see once you get to your destination that I’d just focus on that and minimise car time.
Exmoor - which is on the north coast of the SW peninsula. The A39 road goes through this area and the first place to call at when coming from the east is DUNSTER. The main town of Minehead is worth a look but it is west of Minehead that you go through wonderful scenery. Detour for 1 mile to the thatched village of SELWORTHY and perhaps also pop into ALLERFORD which has a little humped bridge. LYNMOUTH is well worth a stop.
https://www.visit-exmoor.co.uk for more info.
Dunster > https://www.discoverdunster.info
I have driven much of the A39 on the Exmoor section and it is very scenic but slow going. Don't bother with Illfracombe but stay on A39 to Barnstaple. On the next section going west, you might like to detour into CLOVELLY.
Note that you would be hard pushed to do all this in one day and still reach Fowey (which is lovely). I would skip Cheddar Gorge and Glastonbury.
On the Tuesday, you say that you will do (Climb)? the Brecon Beacons. You do this from a car park just south of the highest point on that section of the A470. If you are fit, the climb will take about 1 hour and 10 minutes - a steady uphill slog. Be sure to have sun protection if it is sunny. If the clouds are down on the mountains, consider the waterfall area at Pontneddfechan or the caves:>
https://www.showcaves.co.uk
OR going down a coal mine > https://museum.wales/bigpit/
AND the Brecon Mountain Railway from Pant - on the northern edge of Merthyr:> https://www.bmr.wales
About 20 minutes drive W of Merthyr is this zipline:> https://www.zipworld.co.uk/location/tower
I can’t see much point in driving from Merthyr to Cardiff just for dinner. It takes 35 minutes from Merthyr to the northern edge of Cardiff. Cardiff deserves a visit in its own right.
More on Cardiff:> Did you know that 4 castles can be found in & around the city?
https://www.cardiffcastle.com/the-castle/ is found in the centre and dates from Roman times. In the middle is a Norman keep (1087) but much of the castle dates from the 1800’s when it was owned by the Marquess of Bute. CARDIFF CASTLE is now under the control of Cardiff Council who unfortunately allow events to take place on the green in the middle.
CAERPHILLY CASTLE is a massive medieval fortress just north from Cardiff. The town of Caerphilly is a dump in an ex mining area but the castle is everything that you would expect of an 1100’s fortress complete with moat.
CASTELL COCH stands on a hillside in north Cardiff. If you have a car - it is M4 junction 32 or come off the A470 via Tongwnlais if coming from the north.
ST.FAGANS CASTLE & MUSEUM OF WELSH LIFE is just to the west of the city. This must be the best free place to visit in the UK - you have to pay for parking = £6 at present. The site is vast and needs at least half a day. You have grounds with buildings of significance brought from all over Wales and re-erected. The Castle is really a 1500’s Manor House. You will also find gardens near the castle.
You will also find indoor galleries explaining about life in Wales through the ages - handy if it starts to rain.
LLANDAFF CATHEDRAL is about 2 miles NW of Cardiff Castle.
If visiting Cardiff, I suggest you visit CARDIFF BAY - which is just over 1 mile south of the city centre.
https://cardiffmuseum.com is a small museum about Cardiff in the centre of the city. THE NATIONAL MUSEUM OF WALES is found just N of the shopping area next to the City Hall. It has extensive art galleries.
If visiting Cardiff, note that the city holds major events - especially in the Principality Stadium. This can result in hotels charging massive rates to cash in on all the fans and transport systems are stretched. (Taylor Swift is now booked for 18 June 2024 and Billy Joel in early August).
Best to avoid such events if of no interest.
https://www.visitcardiff.com
When in north Wales, you are missing out on PORTMEIRION. https://portmeirion.wales
If going into Cardiff for dinner and you don't want to drive there are fast Traws Cymru buses back from Cardiff to Merthyr in 50 minutes until 10 o'clock at night- https://passenger-line-assets.s3.eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/transportforwales/SSWL/T4-timetable-20230904-7dc51e13.pdf
The bus station in Merthyr is pretty new- a total rebuild, also hourly trains until 2226 on the current timetable, if you both want to relax for that meal.
It depends of course on where you choose to eat in Cardiff, but worth knowing about.
By the way something no one has mentioned is that Wales now has a 20mph speed limit in almost all urban areas, compared to 30mph in other parts of the UK. There are some places which are exempt, so you need to be extra observant.
