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where?

"Poland, Slovenia, Bulgaria, Slovakia and beyond!"

I guess we are using a pretty liberal definition for Eastern Europe? One that might not be too pleasing to the citizens of many of those countries but sits well with American sensibilities based on archaic Cold War sterotypes? Okay, I'm good with that.

I once did some research in an effort to produce the definitive list and discovered there was no unanimous definition. Even Churchill in his famous Iron Curtain speech recognized that the countries behind the curtain were in Eastern AND Central Europe. But here is the semi- long list:
Albania,
Armenia,
Azerbaijan,
Belarus,
Bosnia and Herzegovina, 
Bulgaria,
Croatia,
Czech Republic,
Georgia, 
Hungary,
Macedonia, 
Moldova,
Montenegro,
Poland,
Romania,
Russia, 
Serbia,
Slovakia, 
Slovenia,
Ukraine

So, who CA recommend good eats in Baku?

Posted by
8889 posts

Is this supposed to be a list of countries in Eastern Europe? If so you have missed off the three Baltic countries: Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania.

Also missing is Kosovo, Not yet a member of the UN, but de Facto independent and recognised by 108 out of 193 (56%) UN member states,
The Caucasus states have always been a dubious case (Armenia, Azerbaijan and Georgia). When the USSR existed, it was convenient to put the Europe Asia border at the USSR border, which put them in Europe. But now they are independent. And the more significant geographic divide between Europe and Asie is the Caucasus mountains. By which definition, these 3 countries are in Asia.

The divide between Europe and Asia from the Caspian Sea to the southern end of the Urals is totally abitrary. By some definitions part of Kazakhstan is in Europe.

And the final "borderline case" (bad pun intended) is Cyprus. This has traditionally been counted as Asia. It is of the southern coast of Asian Turkey, and nearer to Africa (Egypt) than to any other place in Europe. But, since it joined the EU, it is now often classed as being in Europe.

Posted by
10707 posts

Chris, my point exactly! Ohhh, and if we are going to count Kosovo then the Nakhchivan Republic should be counted.

Slovenia and Azerbaijan are in the same "region" while Greece and France are not? Huh?

This forum probably should have been called: "Places by Most Accounts in Europe that are Not Covered by Other Forums" or even, "Former Soviet Satellite States not Covered in other Forums" Of course, then we could argue if Albania was a former Soviet Satellite State.......

And of the Caucasus states, Armenia and Georgia are on the southern side of the Caucasus ridgeline, while Azerbaijan at least has a little territory to the north of the ridge line giving it a tiny claim to having some landmass in Europe.

Posted by
6019 posts

Oh puhleeze, what's the point of this? Most people who ask questions here about Eastern Europe (or Central Europe) usually define what countries they are talking about and then they are corrected if necessary. Maybe citizens of some of these countries are sensitive about what they are called but I sincerely doubt that anybody here is going to refer to them as either Eastern Europeans or Central Europeans when they are over there.

Posted by
8889 posts

Nakhchivan is an exclave of Azerbaijan, not a separate country. Same way that the Kaliningrad Oblast is an exclave of Russia (and many more exclaves in Europe).
Kosovo, on the other hand is recognised by more than 50% of the members of the UN. On a majority vote, it is an independent country.

All these descriptions (Eastern, Central, Western, Southern etc. Europe) are all vague, overlapping and a matter of personal opinion. They also do not necessarily correspond to national borders. The French Mediteranean coast is southern Europe, The English channel ports (Calais, Le Havre, ...) are Northern Europe, so where do you draw the divide?

Posted by
9361 posts

I'm with Nancy - what is the point of this post? How does this help anyone with travel? As she said, people who are posting generally ask about a particular country. It doesn't matter for the purposes of this helpline where that country is politically located.

Posted by
10707 posts

Chris, I am obviously just blowing gas here. It was an empty forum and needed a good start .... or at least a start. I do have some friends in a country in Europe that do wish the tourists would stop calling them "Eastern Europeans" as that puts them in a category with some other countries that they don't wish to be categorized with. That just means I call my friend a Eastern European Commie every chance I get and we both laugh. How about we rename the forum, "Former Commie States Not on the Rick Steve's Tour"?

Posted by
796 posts

As one who has traveled in these areas extensively, I have never heard anyone actually in those countries referring to themselves as being "Central Europeans" or "Eastern Europeans". They just say they are Europeans and identify themselves not by "Central" or "Eastern" but by their country. One is a Russian, Serbian, Czech, Hungarian, etc and not an Eastern European.

As for good eats in Baku, we like to stay at the Marriott and eat at two of their restaurants- the Fireworks Urban Kitchen and the Zest Lifestyle Cafe. The first is a steakhouse that serves lunch and dinner and the second serves food all day for breakfast, lunch and dinner. VERY good food at both.

Posted by
10707 posts

T.L.
You added to my point…EXACTLY! Thank you.

As for your choices in Baku, the Marriott is clean and very nice, and like a lot of the architecture in the town it is stunning. For business its in an excellent location but I think its a little removed for tourism. But hard to argue with. You have good taste. I think I would recommend the Museum Inn in the old pedestrian part of town if someone were to ask. Yes the neighborhood is a little touristy but it has great flavor. If my wife travels with me its the Four Seasons, which is a lot like the Four Seasons in Budapest in atmosphere and character; and almost of the same quality. Best of all, the location is ideal. If I were going to take guests for dinner I think my first choice would be Sahil. Beautifully prepared traditional fare presented in a very modern way. Excellent place and worth the cost.

Posted by
10707 posts

Keith, Like you apparently, I do consider such things when I choose a place to visit. There are indeed places I will not travel because I don't want to be seen as showing any acceptance of the country's actions or policies. I think I would feel like a hypocrite if I did. But its always a balance of a lot of factors, some logical, some purely emotional and none I have ever felt any need to explain or justify. Some things hold their value best when held within and not marketed "look at me", "look at the statement I am making" etc. In all but the most extreme cases I also know that everyone has the same challenge so I try not to judge there decisions. But you make a decent point.

Posted by
1 posts

It was great definition of Eastern Europe. last year I also going to Albany in Georgia that was beautiful place in Europe to traveling and enjoying the weekends with family and friends with less amount of the cost.

Posted by
16745 posts

James, my brother did not have much positive to say about Baku, but I think that's just his natural tendency.

The reason that all these countries are lumped together in this Reviews part of the forum is because it's an empty forum. There is a limit to how many unpopular pages we want to host. (But I'll bet that you've had that conversation with the webmaster already.)

Posted by
10707 posts

Laura, I am just killing time. BUT, I would like to see "Other Eastern Europe" in the Forum country list. Move the Czech Republic and Bulgaria to it along with the rest of the list that doesn't have an independent listing.