ATL-CPH ROUND TRIP 1ST TIME ABROAD- GiGi1858 & Poppy

You do realize you are going at the peak of winter and that weather could have a big impact on your plans and travel. That is also a big peak time for travel both locals and tourists. It can be very busy. That is one of the more difficult times to travel. Is there a reason for mid-winter trip? Personal I would want to avoid northern Europe but with a flight into Copenhagen. North Europe will have long nights and very short days so bring your long underwer. We love the Christmas market but they can be cold and miserable if snowing. I would NOT travel on Christmas day or even the day after. Plan your return trip for the 27th or 28th.

As a first time traveler I would like to see you go late Spring or early Fall to learn how to get around without the complications of weather and heavy coats. If you are from the Atlanta area, northern Europe will be shook to the system.

Sounds to me like your airline tickets are bought, non-stops on SAS, so no sense changing now. The challenge is to stitch together an itinerary that covers 90% of your desires. You never get 100%. Need time to think about it.
As long as you are out of the Alps by Friday Dec 20, you should miss the crazy holiday ski season.
Looks like you get a twin Sr 1 month continuous Eurail Pass for $1450 2nd class, or 1st class for $400 more. Something to consider. You will not have any required reservation fees until you get to Italy.

Take a look at the multi-country RS tours itineraries to see if any will work for you, in whole or in part, and then use seat61.com to determine how to get from Copenhagen to wherever you want to start. Add in all the stops you want to make, and cull later, after you determine how long to stay in each place and what the travel time is between them. At this point, you might have to make choices based on where you can get accommodation. Remember that not all the places you want to visit need to be places you stay if you can day trip from somewhere else. Every time you change accommodation, you lose time.
You need to figure out what cities have direct flights to and from the Azores and see if you can fit that in somewhere. I would try skyscanner.com or the website of the major airport there.
If you have "extra" days at the end, plan to fly to Stockholm and then train back to Copenhagen after your time in Sweden.
Whether you will be well-served by a Eurail pass (and which one) is well-trod ground on this forum and an issue addressed by The Man in Seat 61. Basically, you compare the point-to-point tickets you can get (which may not be the cheapest advance fares at this point) against the pass pricing.

Hello,

Thanks for the replies, & yes we realize we are going at the height of winter( my husband wants to see the Alps- he’s 80- & we need to get it accomplished.

Hello,

Yes, tickets have already been purchased. I’m sorry idk what a twin rate is for the pass(remember it’s our first time- so please be gentle). Also, the $400 rate- that’s for 1 person, so 2 would be $800?

Thanks so much,
GiGi 1858 & Poppy

Hello,

I do like your idea of the RS tours, but I am really lost when it comes to this trip. I need detailed help with a structured routine to see as much as we can while we’re abroad. How to get here from there, what to see, where to eat, miss or not miss, etc.

This may be our one & only visit, & I’m serious about that.
This is our 1st visit, he’s an 80 year old Vietnam Veteran(idk if anywhere offers discounts for that), & I’m a 65 year old Retired RN. We get around very well.

Thanks in advance

Ponta Delgada airport on the Azores mainly has all year flights to Porto and Lisbon, with seasonal flights on many other airlines to many other destinations.

But the 'flag carrier' airline Azores Airlines has all year flights to many other places including Milan Malpensa (Saturday and Sunday) and Paris Charles de Gaulle.

So having started in Denmark, then made your way methodically down through Sweden, Germany, Switzerland and Italy you could then fly from Milan to Ponta Delgada for a last few days, then back to Paris, for a connection to Copenhagen, last night in CPH then your flight home.

TAP Air Portugal will also do a through fare from PDL-CPH connecting at Lisbon which may be preferable.

It is too late now, but Azores Airlines actually fly to Boston (Logan) non stop at 6pm daily on an A321 Neo, from whence you could have returned to Atlanta.

From Stockholm (Sweden) to Berlin (connections through Germany on the fast ICE trains for the Black Forest) there is a nightly sleeper train, which may help you to make that country change- https://www.seat61.com/trains-and-routes/hamburg-to-stockholm-by-sleeper-train.htm

The Azores is a bit of an outlier, but will give warm winter sunshine to end the trip and if that's what you want to do that seems the best way to facilitate it.

EDIT- From Copenhagen to Stockholm it is currently a local train to Malmo then the fast train to Stockholm- basically hourly frequency, overall journey time 5 1/2 to 6 hours. So the 0759 train for instance gets you into Stockholm at 1334. When comparing a rail pass to point to point fares the starting fare for that train is around 580SEK which is about (or 1043 SEK in 1st class)= US$56 or 101

I meant to use the tours as a guide to design your itinerary, not that you should take an organized tour. I suggest reading Europe through the Back Door and/or the trip planning section of this website to learn a method of planning. There are also lots of videos on how to plan your itinerary.

Twin 1st class pass is $400 more, $1850.

I will just throw this out as a starting point.

1. Copenhagen 2nts Nov 28,29 Jet lag recovery and tour Copenhagen
2. Rome 4nts Nov 30, Dec 1,2,3 Fly to Rome and tour Rome
3. Varenna 2nts Dec 4,5 Train to Varenna on Lake Como
4. Pontresina 2nts Dec 6,7 Train to Tirano, then Bernina Express train to Pontresina, Swiss Alps
5. Innnsbruck 2nts Dec 8,9 Train to Innsbruck, Christmas Markets, Austrian Alps
6. Ortisei 3nts Dec 10,11,12 Train to Bolzano, then bus to Ortisei, Christmas Markets and Italian Alps
7. Munich 3nts Dec 13,14,15 Bus to Bolzano, then train to Munich, Christmas Markets
8. Nuremberg 3nts Dec 16,17,18 Train to Nuremberg, Christmas Markets, Side trip to Rothenburg
9. Berlin 3nts Dec 19,20,21 Train to Berlin, Christmas markets and tour Berlin
10. Hamburg 2nts Dec 22,23 Train to Hamburg, tour Hamburg
11. Copenhagen 1nt Dec 24 Train to Copenhagen, rest for flight home

Total nights 27

Its a start. Eliminate Azores as it is out of the way and wastes a lot of time. It is heavy on Christmas Markets, but that is the season in Germany, Austria and northern Italy.

Sam,

This is great, thank you so much. Rather than flying to Rome- could we get there in the EurailPass, or does it take too long?

Also, do we have any room for the Austrian Alps or are we pretty jammed up with what yo7 provided? So far, I, liking your schedule better than anything I’ve seen yet.

Again, thanks so much.

Ideally, with this itinerary, you'd fly open jaw, into Rome and out of Copenhagen, but you already have your plane tickets. Flying to Rome from Copenhagen is the most efficient, but I have since learned that SAS does not fly to Rome on Saturday, so that makes an extra day in Copenhagen to fly out on Sunday, take a day away somewhere else, maybe Munich.

You will see the Austrian Alps in Innsbruck. You can take a train up to Seefeld and get into them.

I am rethinking the Eurail pass. It is nothing to get to hung up on. You can think about train ticket strategy later when you get your itinerary firmed up. A train from Copenhagen to Rome would take a lot, over 24 hours. Air plane is so much more efficient for this.

If you really wanted to do Copenhagen to Rome by train it takes 25 to 27 hours-
Copenhagen 1526, Hamburg 2004/2207 on the Nightjet Sleeper train, Basel 0810/0833, Zurich 0926/0933, Milan 1250/1330, Rome 1640.
Or stay on the Sleeper to Zurich arriving at 1005, depart 1133, Milan arrive 1450, depart 1525, Rome arrive 1840. There is a 1500 from Milan, arrive 1810 but that is a tight connection.
So quite a long journey.
With a Eurail pass you would have a supplement to pay for the sleeper, and a compulsory reservation for the Milan to Rome train. The Copenhagen to Hamburg train used (until 2019) to be quite interesting as part of the journey was on a train ferry, where the train drives onto a ferry. Now it is a less exciting journey entirely on land, but longer and more frequent trains.

Since this is a once in a lifetime trip you should not miss out on stockholm (a minimum of 3 days recommended). Go there as early as possible in your itinerary as the days in northern Europe are getting shorter by the day at that time of year. Travel from north to south for the same reason. Rome is a must. There is only one Rome on this planet and you really feel it when visiting. I went in January, which was a very good choice. I would, if possible, end the trip in Rome.

RICK STEVES ON SCANDINAVIA:
Have a look at Rick Steve's Scandinavia guide book. The descriptions are accurate. "If I had to call one European city home, it might be stockholm. One-third water, one-third parks, one-third city, on the sea, surrounded by woods, bubbling with energy and history, Sweden's stunning capital is green, clean, and underrated". Mr Steves must like the Venice vibe, with all the islands, as he also thinks that it is "Scandinavia's grandest city".

Watch his TV episodes on considered countries here for free and get a feel for them (30 minutes apiece).

I have a couple of questions. Are you seasoned travelers elsewhere and this just happens to be your first time to Europe? And, how light can you pack?

Because this will make a difference in how much you can see. If you pack a big bag, you do not want to be moving that on a train every 2-3 days. Even if you only have a carry-on sized bag, the days you move from place to place are mostly lost for anything "fun." You have that alabatross of a bag with you. So, you know yourselves and whether you need to stay in one place a week and do day trips, or whether you will really enjoy lots of moving around. I get that it's so tempting to do it, but you really want to enjoy the trip too!

When I was in college I had a Eurailpass and changed towns almost every day - even sleeping on the train. My luggage was a book bag with a couple of changes of clothes. Not my idea of a fun time these days....

We just flew into Copenhagen in April and spent three nights. That was not too many. We walked miles and miles, and still didn't see everything. Pack well because we were cold in April. I would not skip Tivoli even if you don't ride rides, it is lovely and historic. We also fit in Rosenborg Castle - a must see, I think, the Carlsberg Glyptotec - great museum with views from the roof, and climbing the outside steeple of Our Saviour church (catch your breath while watching the short film and don't miss the inside of the church), Walking through Christiania, around Nyhaven and several lovely meals and treats.

We then flew to Amsterdam because I didn't want to use my precious vacation time on a long train ride. I'd say do the math on getting to the ariport 2 hours ahead, plus flight time plus an hour into the city center and compare to the train time. It's easy to get to the airport. and if you buy early, the plane tickets are often cheaper than the train. The passes are not as good a deal as they used to be either. Once you have your itinerary, you can price out individual train and plane tickets vs. the rail passes.

You can probably take the train to Stockholm. Spend 3 nights. Don't miss the Vasa Museum! Then maybe fly to Munich. From Munich, you can easily get a day tour to Neuschwanstein with other stops. I have traveled by train between Munich and Switzerland. It's not unreasonable. I have mostly visited the Berner Oberland, but never in December. it was worth 4 nights in May.
You would definitely get the high mountains there. Then maybe from there down into Italy - there should be some beautiful train routes, but I have not done those. I have visited Venice, Rome and Naples in February which was clearly mid-winter and they were fine, and easy to visit by train. Even in the off season, you will want to buy your tickets ahead for the Vatican and Coliseum most likely. Three nights was enough for me in Venice, but 4 would be better in Rome (and Naples if you are so inclined). Then fly back to Copenhagen to get your flight home.

Happy Planning!

Hello,

Thank you all so much, it is indeed our first trip abroad and we’re unsure if or when we’ll be able to go back. So on this trip, we’d like to see as much as possible. We will be packing very light- maybe a weeks worth of clothes and that’s it.

I (female) spend the entire summer in Europe with 3 pairs of slacks and about 5 tops. Plus the necessary warm layers, etc.