Ctoatia, Montenegro, Bosnia, Serbia: Tips, suggestions, advice, warnigs welcomed

That's a lot of driving and a lot of short stops. You'll barely get to a place before you have to leave again. I've driven to all of those places except Podgorica and Belgrade. Even I tend to move quickly, but I might slow it down. There are neat little towns too like Jajce and Travnik between Sarajevo and Zagreb, for example.

You'll be seeing Plitvice Lakes National Park from the cruise? That's one of the top highlights in Croatia for sure.

You need to fly out of Dubrovnik at the end?

Sorry, far too many one night stops to be enjoyable. Halve the number of destinations and you have a busy but more sensible pace.

Have you jotted down the time and distance between these cities? You have at least 4 hours driving time to get between 5) and 6), and 6) and 7. Then from 7) to 8), it will take over 6 hours (and who knows how much longer with traffic). So it seems like, with few exceptions, you're going to be in a car just driving for a large portion of every other day or so. So you have a lot of driving time in proportion of time spent on the ground for each of these cities, and some of the cities are quite a distance from each other.

My advice: cut down on your geographic range of places covered. Then, I would look into whether any rental car contract will allow you to bring a Croatia-based vehicle into Bosnia or Serbia. My guess is you'll find a lot of restrictions. I would explore the possibility of using trains and buses, although you have to be somewhat flexible - this is the Balkans and they don't cooperate very much on any level.

The drive times given above are very optimistic. 5 to 6 is more like a 6 hour drive, 7 to 8 is a 7 hour drive etc. These times assume no traffic delays or stops en route.

Hi Richard,
Few comments:
In Bosnia and Montenegro (as well as rural Croatia) you will travel slower than you would in the US for the same distance. If you are going through the mountains, 30 miles can easily take an hour, especially if you are behind a truck. Also be careful if you are passing: people there just gamble their lives and pass even the blind spots. Highways are better, but proper network is only in Croatia.
As other people noted, it might be dense: trip from Sarajevo to Belgrade will take most of the day, and Podgorica to Mostar and Zagreb to Dubrovnik will be very lengthy.
Maybe drop Belgrade, since it is geographic outlier?
Cheers
Edin

Hi Richard 2 nights in Mostar and going on the hercegovina tour

You're moving way too fast for me. Although I'm quite a fan of Zagreb, I'd suggest not going that far before you turn around. That will allow a bit more time in the other destinations.

By far the most interesting thing about Podgorica is its name. It's considerably off ViaMichelin's recommended path between Kotor and Mostar, and I don't know of any reason to make that detour. Montenegro is a beautiful country with great scenery and picturesque towns; I think you should skip Podgorica and (time-permitting) use the time in a place like Herceg-Novi, Budva, Ulcinj, or Cetinje, or by driving through one of the national parks.

"By far the most interesting thing about Podgorica is its name." That's one of the nicer things I've heard said about Podgorica .

If you are even slightly interested in history the place to go is Cetinje. Cetinje was the capital when Montenegro was an independent country in the late 1800's/early 1900's. It is home to the National Museum, royal palace, a number of interesting embassy buildings and is next to the Lovcen National Park.

If you have to return to Dubrovnik, I would cut out Belgrade and Zagreb otherwise everything will be a blur.

If you go to Montenegro, you need to be aware of a particular roadway. From Kotor there is a road that leads away from the bay inland. The views are spectacular!!. Absolutely beautiful!! Almost beyond description!! But, the road goes up the side of a steep mountain. It has 25 numbered 180 degree switchback turns and at least 75 other sharp turns. Just a rock wall on one side and absolutely nothing on the other. Can't remember the name or number of the road, but it went to the towns of Njegusi and Cetinje. Don't mean to rain on your parade, but don't want you to get into a hairy situation without prior knowledge. If anyone in your party is prone to motion sickness, or has a problem with heights, they might do well to avoid this road. You can get to Kotor in two or three directions without using this road. You can go to bing.com, use the map feature, and see aerial views of the road. You can also check it out on googlemaps.com. On 12 Mar. 2017 there was a thread titled "Greece Montenegro Croatia". There was a link to a map that shows the road. There was also a link to a video made along parts of the road.

The road TC makes reference to I have been on twice. It's a beautiful drive and they best tourist route to Podgorica. Not as bad as it's made to sound. Heck, giant tour buses use it all the time.

Kotor, not really worth the stop if you have seen Dubrovnik. Perast, nearby, is a nice and different experience for one night. I've spent the night in Podgorica twice because of necessity. Nothing much to see, stay in Budva instead.

Yeah, I had no trouble driving on that road to Cetinje either. I just took it easy. Once, while driving up, a big tour bus was coming down the road toward me. Not enough room to pass! So I stopped. The tour bus backed up to a spot on the road where there was enough room for me to pass, and I passed him - no problem. Just don't stress and you'l be fine. (I get motion sickness so wouldn't have done well as a passenger in a car on that drive, but when I drive I rarely get stick.)

I'm subject to motion sickness (though not nearly to the degree I was as a child), and I had no problem taking a bus on that road. I think part of what gets me is the speeding up and slowing down you often get on curvy roads; maybe my driver was especially good.

Wow, thanks for all the advice/information. I knew I was pushing the proverbial envelope regarding the schedule but wanted to start as an 'over achiever.' The input has already caused some modifications in the plan.
I've a further question: The cruise includes a bus trip to Krka National Park. As we'll have visited this park would visiting Plitvice Lakes National Park be a worthwhile day?
BTW: I've used Route Perfect for a few years to map out trips in Europe. RP also provides estimated travel time using either private or public transportation. Good planning site.

Richard, I've been to Plitvice three times but never to Krka, so I cannot compare the two. Plitvice is mobbed these days and should be attempted only by spending the night near the park so you can go inside right at opening time. If your itinerary doesn't allow you the flexibility to do that, I think having been to Krka gives you a very solid justification for skipping Plitvice this time. It is magnificent, but seen during day-tripping hours...not so much.

I've been both to Plivice (twice) and to Krka. They are different kinds of parks. Krka is bigger and more spread out, with a few highlights far apart. One of the highlights of Krka is a huge, magnificent cascading waterfall called Skradinski Buk that dwarfs anything at Plitvice. You can walk up and around this waterfall - it's lovely. You can even swim below it (even in May, a few people may be, but it will still be cold). You can't swim at Plitvice.

There is another falls, some Roman ruins...but you can't easily walk from place to place in a short time. You can drive between them or take day-long boat tour, I believe.

Plitvice is a much more cohesive hiking experience than Krka. There are dozens of little waterfalls, sometimes at every turn. It's amazing - but also extremely crowded at times. It's a developed park with wooden boardwalks. You can take a 20 minute boat ride between two parts of the park, the Lower Lakes and Upper Lakes. Otherwise, you're just hiking (you could also hike between upper and lower or take a shuttle "train" - just a motorized tram). At mid-day it can be uncomfortably crowded with day trippers.

If you visit Plitvice, I'd say it's essential to stay overnight at or near the park and enter when it opens at 7am, to have a few hours without the big tour groups. You could do two half days and a night - get in late the first afternoon, see part of the park (day trippers should be leaving by late afternoon) and see the other part the next morning and plan to be out by noon - or just prepare yourself for more people after 10am. There are a few hotels within the park itself (operated by the park ) - they are overpriced for what you get but convenient. (I stayed at one once.) Book one of the park hotels early - I hear they now fill up early with tour groups. (Maybe on Booking.com where you can cancel your reservation without penalty later if you change our plans.) Otherwise, there are plenty of sobe (B&B's) near the park but not many conventional hotels if any.

If you want a completely different experience from all the tourists at both Krka and Plitvice, try Una national park in Bosnia not far from Plitvice. It's a very back-to-nature experience; the park is fairly new. Like Krka it has a huge waterfall - but I guess you'll see a big one at Krka anyway. If you just want to see another big waterfall, you could detour to Kravice Falls not far from Mostar. Easy to drive to - I was able to drive right up to the falls, but at high season you have to park in lot and walk in or take some sort of shuttle bus.

2 nights worked for us in Dubrovnik and we even did a bike tour (afternoon of arrival day) and a kayaking trip (morning of the full day) while we were there. We found an uncrowded time to walk the wall (Late afternoon on a no cruise ship day) and took in an evening concert, plus had drinks at both bars on the water outside of the wall. It was a whirlwind of activity for sure.

I personally loved two nights in Kotor - staying within the walled city. We climbed the wall 3 times, for fun and on our whole day, we took a boat ride to Perast. On our last day we drove to Dubrovnik airport, turned in our rental car and flew out, so that can work if you want to completely re-arrange and do Kotor last.

One day in Mostar was enough for us - great food there, for sure. The drives there from Dubrovnik and then onward to Kotor took WAY longer than any trip router predicted. My notes called for 3 hours or so, but my recollection was that they were at least half day drives by the time you add in the border crossing and such.

Our only other one-night stay was at Plitvice and that was perfect for spending all of one late afternoon/evening in the park, and then going back to finish up in the morning. We cleared out when it got crowded. We loved it, and the country side and scenery getting there (I'm sure we were on some crazy backroad route, but it was fascinating!) I haven't been to Krka, so I can't compare.